Looks like I end up asking this specific question, or a variation of this question, pretty much every year.
This year's variant:


You turn on this box.
The workbench appears. It has your familiar top menu, plus desktop.
Folders are drawers, programs are tools.
Sys, Prefs, everything is where it's meant to be.
Screens are draggable.
Datatypes are in place.

3.x programs, they work.
Old games, they work.

PLUS:

SMP is supported.
Memory protection is supported.
OpenGL is fully supported.

Would the first part make this an Amiga, and the second part make it a ... MODERN amiga? And if so, would you care at all of what the underlying Kernel and HW architecture are?

That's all.

@resle

And every year I answer such questions with this...

Quote:

Would the first part make this an Amiga

Not unless whomever made this box had the right to call it Amiga (and even then it would be debatable) or you were indeed actually switching on a real Amiga made by Commodore or even the last production runs sold by Gateway/ Escom... simple as zat...


Quote:

and the second part make it a ... MODERN amiga?

Hmmm... would SMP (Statutory Maternity Pay or maybe it means Switched Mode Power Supply though that would need an "S" at the end)...

Either way and whatever the heck "SMP" means and that dumb thing "Memory Protection", neither of which would "make it a MODERN Amiga" cos on the miggy you don't need rubbish like that...


Quote:

And if so, would you care at all of what the underlying Kernel and HW architecture are?

Yup I would indeed care, if it aint 68K then it aint a miggie. You could put PPC in there I suppose but as PPC on the miggie never really took off then I don't suppose it matters really...

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Last edited by Petah on 09-Mar-2013 at 06:18 AM.

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@resle

If the response is very fast yes.

And i do not even need the newer things.

I would like to have one accessory...
a compatible diskdrive for my 10k disks.

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@resle

It can´t be Amiga without Amiga name.


With Amiga name, it will be Amiga we all dream about.

Last edited by pavlor on 09-Mar-2013 at 08:25 AM.

@pavlor

Quote:

It can´t be Amiga without Amiga name.

Should it be that easy, we know of "Amiga names" that are not Amigas.

But it would be good to have name back

You know it ... feels like Amiga, must be Amiga

Last edited by vox on 09-Mar-2013 at 09:10 AM.

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@resle

Quote:

Would the first part make this an Amiga, and the second part make it a ... MODERN amiga? And if so, would you care at all of what the underlying Kernel and HW architecture are?

Kernel, no. Hardware architecture, yes. I don't care if it runs AmigaOS 3.x or AROS 68k. (In fact, I'd prefer a slightly more advanced software architecture like that of AROS.) The hardware must be open, compatible with most AGA functions with few exceptions and hardware banging must be supported.

Why? Because all the Amiga-likes that used PC graphics chips struggle to implement compatibility with the old games until a generation later. That generation later had few native games and the ports all originated on the PC, Mac or Linux. Also, most handhelds run Android which is a Linux distribution.

Exceptions to the rules? Softcores running on FPGA architectures, OS functions that support the features of the chipset more completely and attempts to bring new game engines and rapid application development tools to the Classic Amiga.

My amigahistory so far, which will probably not end there.

A500/A600/A1200/A1200T/A4000/A4000T/AmigaOneG4Xe/AmigaOne X1000

Last edited by Kicko on 09-Mar-2013 at 09:20 AM.

@resle

Yes it would be "Amiga 2.0" to me. And it should run on the fastest hardware available with enough resources (f.e. RAM).

@Thread

In this case no I wouldn't care what the underlying kernal and hardware architectures are, providing it was made with an official Amiga name and branding and not cost the earth that would be good enough for me.

I'm not sure why people are still expecting 100% compatibility with technology from 2 decades ago none of the other OS's have this, hell an Amiga1200 isn't even 100% compatible to an Amiga500 people didn't go around saying it wasn't an Amiga though. Move to the present/future folks.

Oh Franko SMP is Symmetric MultiProcessing for multi-core processors.

Still that's my thoughts

@resle

Quote:

And if so, would you care at all of what the underlying Kernel and HW architecture are?

The newest Amigas are technically Amiga Compatibles or better known as Amiga Clones. Assuming you mean kernel = turn into Linux Distro, and HW architecture = X86, abandon old platforms, .... just like Mac OS X, This "second" part would not make it modern because it would make it worse. Modern things should = Improving them. not making them worse.

I prefer ARM. Other people prefer PowerPC and 68K. I would only accept an X86 port if X86 would be as good, or superior. This means low energy consumption and not needing fans.

And even if X86 was best option, it would turn the Amiga Clones into PC Clones. I still fail to see why people do not recognize "Macs" as PC Clones, and overpriced PC Clones.

Quote:

That's all.

You should have included price, perhaps as a "third" part. It must not be overpriced.

====

I don't care any more. (and I shouldn't) Modern is interpreted into people's opinions. So these "modern" things are going to happen. They already have. C=USA released a C64x, and they released a Linux called C= OS. (And, I don't think they even have a C=USA Logo. They only use the logos of "Commodore" and "Amiga".)

As long as there is a trademark problem with C= and Amiga, I will just support MorphOS, AROS, ....... and RISC OS.

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@Kicko

A500+, A1200, A600HD, A3000, 2x A4000, sam440flex

With the following notes
The A1200 suicided inside a month...
The A600 lost its keyboard for 9 months, coding mouse only is a bitch
Both A4000s were Desktops with 25MHz C= CPU cards

One A4000 was hacked for SMP hardware... the other relocated to Mech

I still can't write exec compliant devices very well

Following the C= Amiga series I went with Linux

The sam flex is my return, and I am not just being quiet and ignored I hope

@resle

Quote:

Would the first part make this an Amiga, and the second part make it a ... MODERN amiga?

Yes, probably.

Quote:

And if so, would you care at all of what the underlying Kernel and HW architecture are?

Yes, the HW architecture definitely needs to consist of obscure, expensive or out of production custom hardware!

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@resle

If runs on WinUAE, UAE or another type of UAE then no, then its a emulator not a Amiga.

if its some thing simular to AmigaOS for example MoprhOS and AROS, then its not, there are many car's but they are they have different specifications and names, at best you can call it a AmigaOS variant or clone or replica, there is no group definition for operating systems that fall into this group.

AmigaOS is the only operating system that is based on orignal AmigaOS source code and developed by some of the same people and has the same name.

What you call is Amiga depends on what is was called when it was manufactured, there are no new Amiga computers, there are only new AmigaONE computers, computers designed to run AmigaOS 4.x and up, and not AmigaOS 3.x and down. Even new AmigaOS 3.x computers can't have the Amiga name as Amiga Inc own the rights and wont cash for it.

And the answer is pancakes, it depends. Your definition is not full.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 09-Mar-2013 at 11:02 AM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 09-Mar-2013 at 11:02 AM.

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@In_Correct

Quote:

I would only accept an X86 port if X86 would be as good, or superior. This means low energy consumption and not needing fans.

Low energy consumption ? I'm sure there are some 8Bit CPUs that can run for years on a coin battery

Now if you meant high energy efficiency, thats a place where some x86 CPUs are they way to go (depending on what level of performance is needed).

@Samurai_Crow

HW banging in these days is just a stupid idea (unless you are targeting those 8Bit CPUs mentioned above). In the 80s it was essential to get descent performance, the HW was simple enough to be understood by a single developer and didn't change that much for the whole lifetime of a system.

The lack of non-ported SW in NG-Amiga-systems is not due to the use of of-the-shelf chips but the severe lack of users&developers.
Add to it that a good (and modern looking) game can't be developed by a single developer anymore like it was often the case in the old days.


Back to topic:
What makes a system "Amiga" ? Certainly not the name (AmigaDE was not Amiga, nor was the crap NotC=USA sold).

For me "Amiga" is a system that can be fully understood and coded for by people without an university IT-degree. "Amiga" also has to be different from mainstream OSes, both on the OS-level as on within applications, cos if I wanted to run Gimp on YALD I would just install Gimp on YALD

It has has to have some contiunty, I certainly would want to switch all my favorite apps and recode my stuff for a completly new API all at once.

Now if someone manages to trow in SMP,MP and whatsnot into that mix and runs it on whatever CPU......

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What makes an Amiga is none of those things you listed. What makes an Amiga an "Amiga" is the feel of an Amiga.
The smoothness of the multitasking.
The efficiency of the kernel.
The hack-a-bility of the OS, which you can patch as much as you want.

There are so many things about the Amiga that no other OS - even one with screen dragging and a Prefs drawer - that make it special.

A Linux box with an Amiga skin is still a Linux box with an Amiga skin. A WinUAE installation is still a PC running an emulation (real Amigas don't suddenly start thrashing their hard disk for no apparent reason and reboot without warning because it installed an update 15 minutes ago, told you it was going to reboot in 15 minutes in the background where you can't see it).

Real Amigas - even OS4 ones - offer a smoothness and customisability that no Linux or Windows core can offer.

The FEEL of an Amiga is what makes an Amiga an Amiga. Not the location of your preferences programs.

@Kronos

for me Amiga are API and concepts like simplicity. If it is developed by using original 68k code or from scratch is not interesting to me (like for the vast majority of users). For some is Amiga only 68k computers, for others only when used original code for development. There is no definition everyone agrees to (only one that the vast majority of users in and outside the community can agree to).

@Spirantho

And what about Amithlon then?

@polka.

"Yes, the HW architecture definitely needs to consist of obscure, expensive or out of production custom hardware!"

you forgot hopelessly underpowered there

@OlafS25

Amithlon is closes to emulator whit some plugin extentions.

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