The most interesting thing about this, IMHO, is why would they need a 16 core CPU in a console in the first place...

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@WolfToTheMoon

The answer is simple:

Fast rendering high-definition graphics. The multi-core architecture will make sure, that everything runs smoothly. It's the worst thing for a console, if speed is slowing down some games or the gameplay is not smooth enough. All whats CPU-Intensive will run better on software optimized for multi-core.

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Sometimes we give people a lot of credit just because they're writing nice sentences even if it isn't adding up to much.

@Birbo

yeah, but, anything over 4 cores will not be felt in gaming. In fact, experience and tests/benchmarks show, that games favor higher clocks over the number of cores.

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@WolfToTheMoon

I read that kinetic 2 only uses 4 cores

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retired

Quote:

Imagine the irony, what helped to kill the Amiga

Does anyone still thnk Microsoft has something to do with Amiga's... "death" ?

Amiga/Atari/... didn't need Microsoft to screw everything up.

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http://www.warpdesign.fr/

@WolfToTheMoon

Quote:

yeah, but, anything over 4 cores will not be felt in gaming. In fact, experience and tests/benchmarks show, that games favor higher clocks over the number of cores.

All that proves is the games tested weren't written with parallel processing / multi threading in mind.

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BroadBlues On Blues BroadBlues On Amiga Walker Broad

@WolfToTheMoon

Quote:

yeah, but, anything over 4 cores will not be felt in gaming. In fact, experience and tests/benchmarks show, that games favor higher clocks over the number of cores.

I'd say a GPU with 16 cores would help better and a soundchip that can mix hundreds of channels in real time with no audible loss of quality.

But, muticore CPUs are really a cheat over the fact that they can't get them much physically faster. You make a good point about four cores as an example, because it doesn't matter how many cores a CPU has, the code running on any single core will only run at the max CPU speed. Not taking into consideration CPU hardware threading.

Tasks can be split over cores but an instruction routine can only run on one core at a time at the mac speed. A four core 4Ghz CPU doesn't mean the CPU can run code at an effective 16Ghz.

@Leo

Quote:

Does anyone still thnk Microsoft has something to do with Amiga's... "death" ?

I do. Even though I knew many people who only knew Windows 3.1 as what a computer runs and didn't know what a Mac did Windows 95 really helped to push the PC market.

Suddenly you had multitasking under the hood, true colour graphics and decent enough sound, and built in Microsoft software. The Amiga fell behind.

People just started using Outlook for email, Word for word processing, Internet Explorer for free and what they offered for DTP. Not only for the Amiga but in other PC markets Microsoft helped to kill off the computer software industry!

Quote:

I do. Even though I knew many people who only knew Windows 3.1 as what a computer runs and didn't know what a Mac did Windows 95 really helped to push the PC market.

Then I suggest you read about Commodore's history... Bad decisions, ages to come with a new chipset, halt of Commodore's PC business, the useless A500+/A600, the weak CD32,... are all responsible for Amiga's death. Surely not MS. And I don't even talk about the OS' UI that didn't much evolve, the lack of true RTG/RTA,...

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http://www.warpdesign.fr/

@Hypex

Quote:

Windows 95 really helped to push the PC market

Commodore was already dead.

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OpenWindows Initiative. Port PS3 hardware to bananas. For free. Join today and receive expired $50 cupon from AI!

@Birbo

Quote:

Birbo wrote: @WolfToTheMoon The answer is simple: Fast rendering high-definition graphics. The multi-core architecture will make sure, that everything runs smoothly. It's the worst thing for a console, if speed is slowing down some games or the gameplay is not smooth enough. All whats CPU-Intensive will run better on software optimized for multi-core.

Fast rendering high-definition graphics should be done on the GpGPU.

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I want my quad or dual core C64.

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John 3:16

There was no support for Cell, what makes you think there will be for this one ? What makes you think the processor will be available for 3rd parties, whom would have to design their own motherboards anyway. Or what makes you think that you'll be able to install an operating system on the consoles ? Remember the alternative OS option on the PS3 and how support was close to non existent and they even canceled it in the next firmware revisions!

Last edited by Jose on 14-Apr-2012 at 04:01 PM.
Last edited by Jose on 14-Apr-2012 at 04:01 PM.
Last edited by Jose on 14-Apr-2012 at 04:00 PM.

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José

@Leo

I'm not saying it was Microsoft exclusively. It was a lot of factors as you pointed out. But not having their software which came to dominate didn't help.

@opi

Commodore was dead at that point yes, but the Amiga was still alive.

@WolfToTheMoon

More cores/threads is (as Intel, AMD, Freescale and IBM have all shown over the last decade) that the only way to get more processing done per second you need to go MP.

EDIT: ok, I didn't read that through before submitting. That sentence doesn't really stay afloat by itself, does it. But it's fine. It's that sort of week for me

The 4+GHz chip era has come and gone, now we're back between 2 and 3GHz, just with more stuff happening in parallell.

And if the argument for choosing PPC last time was to make it harder to emulate then a 16 thread PPC will be equally difficult to emulate over the life time of the next XBox. If MS decide to go with a more or less standard PC configuration it'll be very difficult to control the market the way they've traditionally done with their XBox thingie. Not that I would say this would be bad for the market, but it wouldn't be according to their previous business idea, at least

Last edited by olegil on 17-Apr-2012 at 02:18 PM.

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This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

@thread

Microsoft won, as they were smart to make a Rapid Development Environment (RAD), Visual Basic/C++.

This allowed developers to quickly make applications with minimal effort.

Even today, Microsoft developer tools are brilliant, not once I needed to struggle with installing header files, install files - it all worked out the box.

Amiga was once known for 'works out the box' software, shame really.

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@olegil

Quote:

And if the argument for choosing PPC last time was to make it harder to emulate

There's good evidence jumpimg to x86 is a bad idea if you make exclusive hardware. Look how hard it was to get OSX running on an A1 with the MOL "translator" running in Linux on similar hardware. When Apple went x86 it didn't take long before we saw modifed OSX installer images that booted on a PC! It just looked so easy to hack it. Apple really didn't try to hard to protect OSX from x86 piracy. They should have made their own firmware at least and probably should have kepy designing their own computers but with x86 as the core.

@AmigaBlitter

Quote:

AmigaBlitter wrote: I want a 16 core Amiga :) http://sillegamer.com/2012/04/06/xbox-720-devkit-specs-detailed-includes-16-core-processor/

Xbox 720 Yukon

Xbox 720 Yukon shows ARM/X86 based APU.

8X over Xbox 360's Xenos' 240GFLOPs yields 1920 GFlops.

1920 GFlops leads it to Radeon HD 7850 level GPU and "64 ALU" matches AMD GCN's compute unit (CU) stream processor count i.e. 64.

A mix of X86+ARM matches AMD's recent announcement on ARM IP and future AMD APUs.

Last edited by Hammer on 24-Aug-2012 at 05:38 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 24-Aug-2012 at 05:35 AM.

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@Hammer

You resurrect a 4 month old thread to post rumours from two months ago? Come on, live in the now, will you?

And you really need to learn how to use Preview instead of 700 edits per post.

Last edited by olegil on 24-Aug-2012 at 05:38 AM.

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.