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/  Forum Index
   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
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Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 | 25 | 26 Next Page )
Poll : Would you use OS4 if it ran on PC boxes/laptops?
Yes, immediately.
Maybe eventually.
No. Never.
 
PosterThread
lavo 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 5:35:03
#101 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Jun-2004
Posts: 128
From: Perth, Australia

@Ferry

And don't believe everything you read on rumour sites either It is a design fault, not a problem with the heat from the cpu. The G3 white iBooks also had a major design fault - some bright spark decided to put the hard drive right on top of the video chip. Eventually the heat from the drive lifted up the chip from the logic board, causing failure. On a side note, the "Pismo" Powerbook was the best designed laptop ever, on any platform. As an Apple technician (which I was for 5 years), it was such a joy (and rarity) to work on one. I could have it in complete bits in 10 minutes. Once Apple started obsessing with getting laptops thinner, the faults increased.

Heat may not be such an issue with G4s, but it is with G5s. There were 9 fans inside the Powermac G5, and the models above 2.5Ghz required liquid cooling. The Intel-based Mac Pros that superceded the G5 only has two fans. It didn't take much for the fans in the iMac G5 to kick in either.

If there were more PPC solutions out there, I would be happy for the Amiga to continue along that line. But they are few and far between, so I figure x86 would be a better bet for the long term future of Amiga (obviously Apple were thinking along the same lines - guaranteed they still have PPC-based models in their skunkworks ready to switch back if need be).

BTW, its nice to read a thread where everyone is debating the issue with a little intelligence and respect for one another's opinion. Its almost like everyone is on their best behavior while Carl is around Great to see you back Carl!

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evilrich 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 5:37:22
#102 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 19-Oct-2003
Posts: 534
From: Unknown

@me

Quote:
So, now she's got this screaming dual-core box which she uses to browse the web, do email, and use Word.

Waxing anecdotal here and getting off-topic, but it's late and I've had a couple of beers....

Amusing thing about the missus's new machine: it basically didn't work for a lot of the software she needed. Brand new PC, brand new install of XP, but Java apps didn't work (and a lot of the web-based apps she needs for work use Java), Flash didn't work (a lot of the web-based games the kids play use Flash), etc, etc.

The wife wanted to return the computer, and I said "No. I can fix it." Mainly I was thinking of a dual-core machine that I could test E-UAE on. So, I spent a day twiddling around, finding the right combination of drivers that would make everything fly. Phew! BTW, I installed Ubuntu Linux on it and it worked without problems from the word go. And still she refuses to use Linux...

I keep telling her that a fundamental feature of software is that it has bugs, but she won't believe me. If something doesn't work, it's the fault of the hardware, or the phase of the moon, or anything else.

Cheers,
Rich

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COBRA 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 6:17:24
#103 ]
Super Member
Joined: 26-Apr-2004
Posts: 1809
From: Auckland, New Zealand

@AmigaHeretic

Quote:
If someone took a Core 2 duo laptop removed the sticker and put a "PPC" sticker next to the touchpad instead and then handed you a laptop running Amiga OS 4, how could you possible know the difference of what cpu is below the keyboard?


From the temperature of the box?

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WOSPUPOS4 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 6:20:25
#104 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 24-Feb-2006
Posts: 220
From: Unknown

@Carl-S
Would'nt think about not doing it immediately.

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adiaux 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 6:37:48
#105 ]
Super Member
Joined: 1-Jun-2006
Posts: 1249
From: Unknown

@Carl-S

Quote:
So, that's the razor. You decide.


Nonsense.

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abalaban 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 7:07:54
#106 ]
Super Member
Joined: 1-Oct-2004
Posts: 1114
From: France

@evilrich

About your definition of fun and all, it was exactly what I tried to say in my own post. You sumarize it with better words even with your numerous beers

Also I doubt people saying they will instantly remove Windows from their MacPro : for what reason will they do that ? First they *have* already installed Windows in dual boot on their machine while they had OSX. So given the fact that OSX is much more advanced applications wise than AmigaOS and that they still installed Windows, for what reason exactly will they remove it if AOS would prove to run on X86 ? I really, really doubt it.

Someone in this thread summarize it better : "if AOS would run on x86, then that would be another PC running another pointless OS".

If AOS goes x86 you won't see any application for it, except maybe someone mad that will port WINE and then that will be the end : "no need to bother : just launch WINE and you'll have application X" that will be the answer you'll get after that. Juste take an example, could you tell me how many application BeOS has ? And BeOS had a clearly specialized goal : multimedia and still could not stand the comparison in the long run So why AOS will be other way ?

I think it will be even worst because you will have standard PC, and still you won't be able to use standard peripehrals just because there won't be any driver for it, except some rare ones that would not sell cheap because it will be rare... So nothing would change and you'll end up running Windows...

See I don't have any PC at home (yes like in "not even one") except my work laptop that I from time to time bring back to home, and I never had one since 1987 when I bought an A500 and never feel the need of having one : back at the time I had school computer rooms to do school works (and I firmly beleive that I was very much productive being in this school room than I would have been at home) and now I have office to do my work stuff, when I get back at home and feel the need of switching a computer on I want it to be fun and different then the thing I did all day long. I may be a fanatic and biased by my nearly 20 years use of Amiga computer but that's the reason I use it now despite the almost sh*tty application situation.

_________________
AOS 4.1 : I dream it, Hyperion did it !
Now dreaming AOS 4.2...
Thank you to all devs involved for this great job !

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hatschi 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 7:46:51
#107 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 1-Dec-2005
Posts: 2328
From: Good old Europe.

@COBRA
Quote:

COBRA wrote:
@AmigaHeretic
Quote:
If someone took a Core 2 duo laptop removed the sticker and put a "PPC" sticker next to the touchpad instead and then handed you a laptop running Amiga OS 4, how could you possible know the difference of what cpu is below the keyboard?


From the temperature of the box?


Because a G5 would most possibly run much hotter than a Core 2 Duo?

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Serpi 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 8:15:54
#108 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 31-Jul-2003
Posts: 547
From: Germany

@Carl-S

I voted maybe.
It's not so much my interest if it perfectly runs classic games/apps (especially for games, UEA already does a pretty good job) but I want to see new development in OS, games and apps.
Of course the Computer should be able to run such a big amount of classic software as possible, but I accept that this will not be possible for all existing games/apps.

So, I'm already quite happy with the existing OS4 (I'm owning an AmigaOne XE/G4) and it seems to be a good way for the Amiga.

Ciao, Alfred

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TheDaddy 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 8:17:03
#109 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@Carl-S

Is that all?



Now really let's cut to the chase...Is this just a poll or have you got something cooking?

- Dream mode on -

Carl-S takes over Amiga Inc. and becomes The President or Il Presidente or El Presidente (you choose the title)

Carl-S has already worked on a new OS for years (collaborating with Hyperion and others) and it's basically Amiga OS X.X running on anything you throw at it.

I become Head for R&D for Amiga Inc. and new cool cases are developed with Amiga logos.

The members of amigaworld.net become share holders and most of them develop new grounbreaking software and games.

Microsoft becomes just a bad memory in people's minds. (People say" Remember the bad days when we had to use Vista? Hehe!)

Amiga takes over the world and everyone is happy...

- Dream mode off -

Where am I? What year is it?

_________________
www.loriano.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk

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TheDaddy 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 8:25:44
#110 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@TheDaddy

I am so hurt!

I was typing the reply to Carl-S just and I looked to my left to see a poster with an old photo of three guys in front of a 1984 machine...

It says : "The original Apple gurus, Steve Jobs, John Scully and Steve Wozniak, 1984"

I am sitting in an Mac Studio at the moment...

The photo is very old, brownish in colour and made me think, if we could do a Back to the Future thingy, that photo will now have an Amiga instead of a mac with different names on the poster....

_________________
www.loriano.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk

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lavo 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 8:41:37
#111 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Jun-2004
Posts: 128
From: Perth, Australia

@TheDaddy

What's funny is that Wozniak had very little (if anything at all) to do with the Mac. He was an Apple II man through and through.

I wonder what would have happened if Atari did end up buying Amiga before Commodore snatched it at the last moment. We'd probably be in the same boat

I'm not sure what Carl's motives are with diving back in to the Amiga again. Its funny that he has resurfaced at the same time as DiscreetFX making an announcement on Amiga's future as well. Who knows...... If Electronic Arts pop up, there is definitely something fishy going on!

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Hannibal_Smith 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 8:51:52
#112 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 2-Sep-2006
Posts: 122
From: Unknown

@evilrich

I agree with you at the notion that GHz and GHz of raw power is not needed. However x86 is much more than how much raw computational power would be available or even how much bang per buck you can get. It’s about actual cost, availability and future security.

* No more needing to source exotic and expensive memory modules.
* No more relying on tin-pot companies operating out of a shed somewhere.
* No more ‘we need x orders to get the price down’
* Tried and tested technology.
* Real choice.

We’ve been down this PPC road for 5 years now, and there seems to be no progress and no light at the end of the tunnel. Had IBM got motherboard manufacturers to make PPC varieties like they were trying to a couple of years back, then things might be different. As it stands though, I can’t see AmigaOS even making even minor progress in the future.

Last edited by Hannibal_Smith on 27-Oct-2006 at 08:57 AM.

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AmigaBlitter 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 8:59:47
#113 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 26-Sep-2005
Posts: 3512
From: Unknown

@thread

Again?

Why start at this point an X86 project? Now that the OS4 Final is coming as well as new hardware?

Does this mean that we must put all the effort in writing the PPC code and to produce PPC Hardware in a bin?

A transition, eventually, could be done only if a platform is well established. Correct me if i'm wrong: Amiga platform is not well established at this time, right? Isn't Amiga considered a survivor or not? Or Amiga is in the same situation of Apple having all the resource and power to shift from PPC to X86?

Amiga have to find itself, first. When the platform will be well established and solid, then a switch to X86 could be considered.

AFAIK, there are 4 different PPC firmware where OS4 run.






_________________
retired

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Hannibal_Smith 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 9:08:01
#114 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 2-Sep-2006
Posts: 122
From: Unknown

@takemehomegrandma

Quote:

takemehomegrandma wrote:
@Carl-S

Quote:
So, that's the razor. You decide.


Nonsense.


Care to elaborate?

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hatschi 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 9:11:23
#115 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 1-Dec-2005
Posts: 2328
From: Good old Europe.

@AmigaBlitter

Quote:
Now that the OS4 Final is coming as well as new hardware?


I am sure you would have used the same argument 4 1/2 years ago: "McEwen, Hermans and Redhouse have said that OS4 is in it's final stages, it doesn't make any sense to switch to x86 now!"

Quote:
Does this mean that we must put all the effort in writing the PPC code and to produce PPC Hardware in a bin?


No. Any reason why both architectures can't be used in parallel for some time? Do you see anybody throwing their PPC-Macs in the bin?

Quote:
A transition, eventually, could be done only if a platform is well established. Correct me if i'm wrong: Amiga platform is not well established at this time, right?


The basic problem: The Amiga platform is never going to be "well established" if we stay PPC. PPC is nearly dead as a desktop CPU and the price/performance ratio compared to x86 is just ridiculous.

Quote:
AFAIK, there are 4 different PPC firmware where OS4 run.


Funny that you mention it as "AFAIK" since you apparently just asked which firmware that would be and if the original poster (m3x) meant firmware or hardware.

Last edited by hatschi on 27-Oct-2006 at 09:21 AM.
Last edited by hatschi on 27-Oct-2006 at 09:12 AM.

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falemagn 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 9:20:11
#116 ]
Super Member
Joined: 24-Nov-2003
Posts: 1126
From: Italy

@Carl-S

I voted "no, never", but I think I need to explain why.

As it is now, AOS4 doesn't give me anything that I couldn't get from other operating systems. Rather, it gives me way less than the other systems. I couldn't live without MP and VM, for instance, and neither could the majority of users of other operating systems out there.

Of course, current AROS and MOS are no better.

I'd buy it just to try it out if it costed less than, say, 50 EUR, though. So "no, never" isn't an accurate answer to the poll.

_________________
It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary
system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning.

~~ Henry Ford

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AmigaBlitter 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 9:21:37
#117 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 26-Sep-2005
Posts: 3512
From: Unknown

@hatschi

I don't think, however, that we have the power and resource to start a port to X86.

_________________
retired

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Nibunnoichi 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 9:26:02
#118 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 18-Nov-2004
Posts: 969
From: Roma + Lecco, Italia

@AmigaBlitter

Quote:

AmigaBlitter wrote:
@hatschi
I don't think, however, that we have the power and resource to start a port to X86.

We don't have power and resources 'cause we're wasting them designing hardware.

_________________
Proud Amigan since 1987
Owner of various Commodore and a SAM440ep\OS4.1FE
See them on http://retro.furinkan.org/

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Benji 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 9:29:01
#119 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 1-Nov-2003
Posts: 573
From: Cheltenham or London, UK

@Carl-S

Here is the strange thing - ask someone if they would spend $50 on OS4 for x86 or $500 on a complete PPC board in a case with OS4...

I would go with the latter - because its different, lower power/quieter/smaller... I have all the x86 boxes I want, they all came with Windows which does fine for what I need. I dont know anyone at the moment with old or "spare" x86 boxes that needs an OS, and if I do I point to Ubuntu or Beatrix...

The compelling reason for OS4 for me is that its different! Replacing all my Windows installs with OS4 wouldnt work. Install it on the PS3, or PSP or the old iPAQ I hardly use (now Windows Mobile is worse than XP etc IMHO) or something different and its much more interesting.

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yak 
Re: [Poll] Carl's Amiga Test
Posted on 27-Oct-2006 9:35:31
#120 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Mar-2006
Posts: 322
From: Bochum, Germany

@Benji

Of course replacing Windows installs with OS4 wouldn't work, at least not yet. But availability of OS4 for x86 lets you have a cheap secondary system to play with. And the "cheap" is very important now to increase the userbase and add some active developers.

Last edited by yak on 27-Oct-2006 at 12:32 PM.

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