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   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 13:39:49
#741 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@Thom_Holwerda

Quote:

Thom_Holwerda wrote:
@HenryCase

And I would expect better from Amiga "fans".

I've read countless posts in this thread as well as others on the subject that x86 is somehow less Amiga than PPC. My post was all about explaining that that's utter nonsense.



I'm sure you could easily count them in *this* thread, and they'd be *very* few. Almost everyone debating here seems well aware its utter nonsense. You did not divine anything here.

So if you want to preach to people that have this PPC chip on their shoulder, why not find the right thread then?

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SHADES 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 13:42:19
#742 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Nov-2003
Posts: 612
From: Melbourne

@Hypex

Quote:

Hypex wrote:
@eniacfoa

Quote:
I think 1-2 thousand buyers is a reasonable target to aim for with an x86 version.. I think you may find it would end up exceeding that. see my earlier posts for debate as to why AROS is not a template for what will happen if AOS goes x86.


As an interesting note I once looked up the amount of native Amithlon software in comparison to Amiga PowerPC software. It pailed to insignificance! I was shocked that Amithlon had such low support from programmers. And I know how popular it was back then. Bernie went to my club.

But now, I look at AROS and it is almost as large as any Amiga PowerPC suppoort. However, combine this with Amitlhon to bunch all the native x86 stuff together, compare it with either MorphOS or AmigaOS4 and they are almost totally destroyed!

I find this interesting. So it looks like x86 is largely supported by users, but not by programmers who prefer PowerPC on an even greater scale.


I think AMIGA inc may have done the most damage here asking development to stop or it's in breech of their license.

Only OS4.x is the Official endorced upgrade of the continuation/development of the true AMIGA OS. According to the company who suposedly owns it.

That removes QNX, BeOS, AROS, Morph etc etc etc.
Only AMIGAs upgrade is going to be supported to be continued according to them. the rest ...well in unkind words can go sink to them.

This I believe removed a lot of survival hopes and future investment for people. Or at least greaqtly contributed.

Last edited by SHADES on 27-Mar-2009 at 01:46 PM.
Last edited by SHADES on 27-Mar-2009 at 01:44 PM.

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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 13:46:55
#743 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@Hypex

Quote:

Hypex wrote:
@fairlanefastback

Now this is downright silly, everybody knows OS5 IS for x86!! Unless you know someone who doesn't?


I think almost everyone knows OS5 probably does not exist at all. But if it did it supposedly would have worked on ACK PPC Amigas.

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Hypex 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 13:52:31
#744 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 8970
From: Greensborough, Australia

@SHADES

Quote:
AROS is not what we are talking about here. We would like to use AOS.


I can fully unsderstand you here but still I wonder why? OS4 was built off the OS3.1 codebase and all the legacy baggage that came with it. With which it hasn't shrugged it all off yet.

AROS was bullt by reverse engineering almost the API. They already had in place the instructions for what functions and OS structures were needed and reimplmented it fresh from scratch. So they've done the groundwork already needed that AmigaOS4 would still need for another CPU port. Therefore, IMHO, AROS is better suited at being the x86 "AmigaOS." Slap an OS4 theme on it, install modern programs and is there much difference?

It's quite interesting that for a closed source OS how "open" AmigaOS is. We have a list of almsost all the functions, at least the ones we need. And the major structures. Two thirds of the equation. No wonder AROS has done so well, they had a head start!

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SHADES 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 13:58:04
#745 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Nov-2003
Posts: 612
From: Melbourne

@Hypex

Quote:

Hypex wrote:
@SHADES

Quote:
AROS is not what we are talking about here. We would like to use AOS.


I can fully unsderstand you here but still I wonder why? OS4 was built off the OS3.1 codebase and all the legacy baggage that came with it. With which it hasn't shrugged it all off yet.

AROS was bullt by reverse engineering almost the API. They already had in place the instructions for what functions and OS structures were needed and reimplmented it fresh from scratch. So they've done the groundwork already needed that AmigaOS4 would still need for another CPU port. Therefore, IMHO, AROS is better suited at being the x86 "AmigaOS." Slap an OS4 theme on it, install modern programs and is there much difference?

It's quite interesting that for a closed source OS how "open" AmigaOS is. We have a list of almsost all the functions, at least the ones we need. And the major structures. Two thirds of the equation. No wonder AROS has done so well, they had a head start!


I understand your point however AROS is not the Official supported, developed and planned future for AMIGA OS. That route is currently on a crash course to heaven as i see it right now, but this was my reason.

AROS's aim was and still is to try to get to a compatible equal to AOS3.9 or as close as possible. AMIGA wanted to move on from 3.9 and have funded or part funded the OS from this point. AROS have not followed that path and are going their own way which is different to that of what AMIGA invisioned for the OS. It is not supported by them either.

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Hypex 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 13:58:08
#746 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 8970
From: Greensborough, Australia

@Thom_Holwerda

Quote:
Let's first get this ridiculous notion about PPC out of the way. The PowerPC platform is no more "Amiga" than the x86 platform. Both have absolutely zero-nada-nothing to do with the original Amiga. The PPC is no more a continuation of the 68k than x86 is. It's just utter nonsense to claim that PPC is "more Amiga" than x86.


For one thing, there are PowerPC expansion cards for real Amigas. You can't buy an x86 CPU accelerator for an Amiga. I think that's where the divide starts. At least for me.

Last edited by Hypex on 27-Mar-2009 at 02:10 PM.

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whose 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 14:03:11
#747 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2005
Posts: 892
From: Germany

@SHADES

You still oversee a mountain of reasons why your argumentation fails. First, the SAM isn´t planned for Desktop use at first sight. It is an embedded platform with quite good cost-performance ratio, compared to other platforms like ARM and such. Don´t cry out loud, it´s a fact. There is no single ARM based board, that features so much things like the SAM does, and they´re quite pricy compared to the SAM, too.

So, if you think a little bit further, the OS sales are not necessarily needed for further SAM development. Got it? Good.

So, you have a not-so-desktop platform that is cross-funded and not depending on the sales achieved by the desktop use. This lowers development costs as you don´t have to insure platform development costs upfront with heavy OS development and marketing (which in turn have to be upfront funded, too!). Drivers are more easy to develop, as ACube has access to all needed documents and I don´t think that they charge the Friedens for the Docs. Platform details are no topic, because all things needed are onboard or possible extensions are limited. This lowers costs even more.

Thinking a little bit further: AmigaOS as a base for a more matured embedded system is very interesting because of speed/needed CPU power ratio. Hence there is a good chance that there is some more cross funding by e.g. ACube and other embedded interests, giving money to the Friedens for ExecNG development or similar to Hyperion for other developments.

All that without any dependence to desktop sales and whining wannabe users!

Figure out yourself, how much a desktop only development in the x86 segment would cost. You´re entirely dependend to the sales you achieve for desktop use, no chance of any embedded sales because desktop x86 isn´t the big player in this segment (have a look into embedded market yourself!) or any other cross funding! You have to make some business agreement with a hardware manufacturer (or two, or three, or...), which will cost you "some" upfront funding. You will have to buy a quite huge stock of hardware from this manufacturer, to get a decend pricing, that´s use in this market!

You will have to invest in several documents regarding chipsets that are used, which may cost some bucks, too. You will have to draw some experienced developers for driver development, and most developers, coming from the x86 world, won´t work just for fun. Well, another heap of bucks gone.

Face it, we (the desktop users) are a bunch of "nice guys", that Hyperion didn´t forget about, nothing more. If we will go bust, they will certainly not, if PPC based or not. That we can use OS4 on a PPC based machine as a desktop OS is actually a nice side effect, no effect of heavy funding by users.

Regards

Edit: Typo

Last edited by whose on 27-Mar-2009 at 02:09 PM.

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Hypex 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 14:09:30
#748 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 8970
From: Greensborough, Australia

@fairlanefastback

Quote:
I think almost everyone knows OS5 probably does not exist at all


Isn't it just a more develoepd version of that AmigaDE thing? Has anyone got the lastest SDK to tell us what it is? The would explain a lot.

Quote:
But if it did it supposedly would have worked on ACK PPC Amigas.


But how could it? As funny as this sounds, Amiga don't support PowerPC! OS5 couldn't run on the ACK PPC as it's compiled for x86!

(BTW what happewnd to ACK? Such good promise. He should design the next OS4 board!)

Sure Amiga go on about supporting multiple platforms but until you can confirm you know someone who is running the SDK for OS5 on Debian Linux with theie PowerPC AmigaOne I don't believe otherwise!

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SHADES 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 14:16:41
#749 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Nov-2003
Posts: 612
From: Melbourne

@whose

Quote:

whose wrote:
@SHADES

You still oversee a mountain of reasons why your argumentation fails. First, the SAM isn´t planned for Desktop use at first sight. It is an embedded platform with quite good cost-performance ratio, compared to other platforms like ARM and such. Don´t cry out loud, it´s a fact. There is no single ARM based board, that features so much things like the SAM does, and they´re quite pricy compared to the SAM, too.

So, if you think a little bit further, the OS sales are not necessarily needed for further SAM development. Got it? Good.

So, you have a not-so-desktop platform that is cross-funded and not depending on the sales achieved by the desktop use. This lowers development costs as you don´t have to insure platform development costs upfront with heavy OS development and marketing (which in turn have to be upfront funded, too!). Drivers are more easy to develop, as ACube has access to all needed documents and I don´t think that they charge the Friedens for the Docs. Platform details are no topic, because all things needed are onboard or possible extensions are limited. This lowers costs even more.

Thinking a little bit further: AmigaOS as a base for a more matured embedded system is very interesting because of speed/needed CPU power ratio. Hence there is a good chance that there is some more cross funding by e.g. ACube and other embedded interests, giving money to the Friedens for ExecNG development or similar to Hyperion for other developments.

All that without any dependence to desktop sales and whining wannabe users!

Figure out yourself, how much a desktop only development in the x86 segment would cost. You´re entirely dependend to the sales you achieve for desktop use, no chance of any embedded sales because x86 isn´t the big player in this segment (have a look into embedded market yourself!) or any other cross funding! You have to make some business agreement with a hardware manufacturer (or two, or three, or...), which will cost you "some" upfront funding. You will have to buy a quite huge stock of hardware from this manufacturer, to get a decend pricing, that´s use in this market!

You will have to invest in several documents regarding chipsets that are used, which may cost some bucks, too. You will have to draw some experienced developers for driver development, and most developers, coming from the x86 world, won´t work just for fun. Well, another heap of bucks gone.

Face it, we (the desktop users) are a bunch of "nice guys", that Hyperion didn´t forget about, nothing more. If we will go bust, they will certainly not, if PPC based or not. That we can use OS4 on a PPC based machine as a desktop OS is actually a nice side effect, no effect of heavy funding by users.

Regards


OMG! lol I DO just get it.
here are some more facts.

Facts:
1. SAM is custom built and thefore expensive as there is no mass market. It can't compete cost wise.
2. x86 is also in the embedded market and can do it cheaper with similar results. however desktop h/w with better specs and more to offer than SAM is also cheaper.
3. x86 is cheaper, better tested and has countless benifit for future proof H/W development.
2. AOS is currently reliant on custom H/W SAM in part to run. There is no current alterntive.
3. AMIGA userbase is small, so is the Custom H/W base just built that runs it.
4. AMIGA community gets smaller not buying custom H/W because of cost.
5. AOS sales go down by a few making Dev costs go up.
6. No Alternative H/W base to attract more users.
7. x86 boards and chips are well documneted. what do you think SAM uses? PCI is one such spec mate. It was developed for the mass x86 market. same with ATi cards.

Nice or not, if Hyperion sell less Whose, they have to up the costs or pull out.
Or
Find an alternative that is cost affective and has no development timeframe and is ready to use.

There may be more cost involved having to port again intialy however the returns are more sales. this may be a reason to consider that. Acube are not reliant on just the AMIGA community and no one wants them to go bankrupt. they surly would if they were "only" reliant on this community as their product is to expensive for most, HOWEVER, they have no mass market like x86 does to keep costing down so specs suffer and dev tims increase, price increses again hurting Hyperion sales that relly on it.

You code some chips the same for any base, esp industry standards!. That PCI bus on the SAM is the same spec as a PCI bus on the x86 platform, that's where it came from. Why do you think it's suddenly different because it's being used on x86?

Last edited by SHADES on 27-Mar-2009 at 02:24 PM.
Last edited by SHADES on 27-Mar-2009 at 02:18 PM.
Last edited by SHADES on 27-Mar-2009 at 02:17 PM.

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eXec 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 14:23:21
#750 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2004
Posts: 954
From: Burkina Faso

@SHADES

Every single word is on it˙s place. Very good post...
Now, you`ll have to face yourself with an anger of those
radical PPC people... Especially my personal guru...


haha


All the best,

D.

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Yo 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 14:31:26
#751 ]
Team Member
Joined: 8-Oct-2004
Posts: 2042
From: France, on an ADSL line

@eXec

I think that's enough, eXec, this is getting into obvious trolling and baiting so, can I ask politely that you PLEASE think seriously before you post anything else?

That's a final warning, by the way.

Thank you.

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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 14:37:22
#752 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@eXec

Quote:

eXec wrote:
@SHADES

Every single word is on it˙s place. Very good post...
Now, you`ll have to face yourself with an anger of those
radical PPC people... Especially my personal guru...


haha


All the best,

D.


I'm starting to feel sorry for you, obviously you lack reading comprehension skills. As I've said multiple times, I am all for us going x86, if we can find a practical way to accomplish it in a reasonable amount of time. I don't see a practical way currently when the authors of the OS have no interest at this time. And other projects that are open source show there is not a large group of capable people to volunteer. And there is no one with a pot of gold to donate to pay people with for it either.

Now you can keep up the "my personal guru" crap to try to agitate me. It will only re-inforce to others that you are not actually trying to contribute to this conversation in any meaningful sort of way.

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whose 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 14:38:11
#753 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2005
Posts: 892
From: Germany

@SHADES

Quote:
OMG! lol I DO just get it. here are some more facts.


These are no facts, these are mere assumptions. I will show you:

Quote:
Facts: 1. SAM is custom built and thefore expensive as there is no mass market.


Plain wrong. In the embedded market it is not expensive, to the contrary. But you should have a look at it yourself, first. You simply assume expensiveness when there isn´t.

Quote:
It can't compete cost wise.


Plain wrong. In the embedded market it does very good.

Quote:
2. x86 is also in the embedded market and can do it cheaper with similar results.


Plain wrong. If you have a closer look in the real embedded market (industry and home automation use), you will see very few x86 based boards. There is PPC, ARM, even 68k, but very, very few x86. You shouldn´t exchange "embedded" and "mini-boards" freely.

Quote:
3. x86 is cheaper, better tested and has countless benifit for future proof H/W development.


In the desktop segment, yes. By using Windows and Linux, but certainly not AmigaOS.

Quote:
2. AOS is currently reliant on custom H/W SAM in part to run. There is no current alterntive.


And? That´s an empty argument.

Quote:
3. AMIGA userbase is small, so is the Custom H/W base just built that runs it.


Another empty one...

Quote:
4. AMIGA community gets smaller not buying custom H/W because of cost.


Plain wrong. The fact that YOU won´t buy the hardware doesn´t automagically mean that NOBODY is buying it. Ask the people who are waiting for the next batch of SAM boards

So, the community in reality is growing, albeith very slowly.

Quote:
5. AOS sales go down by a few making Dev costs go up.


Empty argument. The sales are growing the same rate the hardware does. As SAMs are in several purchasing pipelines...

Quote:
6. No Alternative H/W base to attract more users.


Currently not. And? Do you have a readily available x86 alternative in your pocket?

Quote:
7. x86 boards and chips are well documneted. what do you think SAM uses?


Definetly no x86 board. Why do you ask?

Quote:
PCI is one such spec mate. It was developed for the mass x86 market. same with ATi cards.


Aha... what about North-/Southbridge (remember the VIA/AmigaOne case?), USB, SATA, Wireless, BlueTooth... should I count more?

You still have no vaild point against the status quo. You still try to argument with some shady dreams, nothing that could stand business reality.

What about leaving Amiga and go for x86, were hardware is pretty cheap and available by any Wal Mart near you? Oh, wait, they won´t give you AmigaOS on x86, because they won´t fund it... *asking himself what the reason may be?*

Regards

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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 14:42:57
#754 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@Hypex

Quote:

Hypex wrote:
@fairlanefastback
Isn't it just a more develoepd version of that AmigaDE thing? Has anyone got the lastest SDK to tell us what it is? The would explain a lot.


Thats AA2 you are thinking of.

Quote:
But how could it? As funny as this sounds, Amiga don't support PowerPC! OS5 couldn't run on the ACK PPC as it's compiled for x86!


You are confusing AA2 (real but extremely limited) and OS5 (probably fake IMHO, the supposed new Amiga desktop).

Regardless, Amiga, Inc. vaporware has nothing to do with this conversation.

Quote:
(BTW what happewnd to ACK? Such good promise. He should design the next OS4 board!)


Last we heard he is still at home in Canada with Kneedeep's AmigaOne. Not sure what makes you see such good promise in them. But to each his own!

_________________
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eXec 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 14:50:07
#755 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2004
Posts: 954
From: Burkina Faso

@Yo

That is the power of democracy and liberty of free speech!

All the best,

D.

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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 14:58:08
#756 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@eXec

Quote:

eXec wrote:
@Yo

That is the power of democracy and liberty of free speech!

All the best,

D.



You do realize that a forum site with a TOS is not a pure democracy and not a place where you can say anything you want, right?

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eXec 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 15:00:24
#757 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2004
Posts: 954
From: Burkina Faso

@fairlanefastback

I said all the important already on the very first post of this thread, my thread. Now, 700+
post later it is a mass chaos full of insults and all type of arguments for/against.
Obviously it is allowed for the "elite" members to write what they want and to make
a jokes out of us who see the final frontier in platform switching. But for us
who are not getting into that group of elitism is the freedom of written word
obviously, FORBIDDEN!
About that "personal guru" thing, read on all your posts which are assigned on me
and think about it why, By the way, it is not an insult or anything similar, a quite of joke
and my apologies if you consider that on any other way. You apparently
have nothing else to do but to "prove" me your perfect replying skills and point me
how deeply disturbed I am and that my wish of AOS to be ported onto x86 is a
complete optimism. It would be the best thing to ignore my posts for you.

All the best,

D.

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SHADES 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 15:01:23
#758 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Nov-2003
Posts: 612
From: Melbourne

@whose

Quote:

whose wrote:
@SHADES

Quote:
OMG! lol I DO just get it. here are some more facts.


These are no facts, these are mere assumptions. I will show you:

Quote:
Facts: 1. SAM is custom built and thefore expensive as there is no mass market.


Plain wrong. In the embedded market it is not expensive, to the contrary. But you should have a look at it yourself, first. You simply assume expensiveness when there isn´t.

Quote:
It can't compete cost wise.


Plain wrong. In the embedded market it does very good.

Quote:
2. x86 is also in the embedded market and can do it cheaper with similar results.


Plain wrong. If you have a closer look in the real embedded market (industry and home automation use), you will see very few x86 based boards. There is PPC, ARM, even 68k, but very, very few x86. You shouldn´t exchange "embedded" and "mini-boards" freely.

Quote:
3. x86 is cheaper, better tested and has countless benifit for future proof H/W development.


In the desktop segment, yes. By using Windows and Linux, but certainly not AmigaOS.

Quote:
2. AOS is currently reliant on custom H/W SAM in part to run. There is no current alterntive.


And? That´s an empty argument.

Quote:
3. AMIGA userbase is small, so is the Custom H/W base just built that runs it.


Another empty one...

Quote:
4. AMIGA community gets smaller not buying custom H/W because of cost.


Plain wrong. The fact that YOU won´t buy the hardware doesn´t automagically mean that NOBODY is buying it. Ask the people who are waiting for the next batch of SAM boards

So, the community in reality is growing, albeith very slowly.

Quote:
5. AOS sales go down by a few making Dev costs go up.


Empty argument. The sales are growing the same rate the hardware does. As SAMs are in several purchasing pipelines...

Quote:
6. No Alternative H/W base to attract more users.


Currently not. And? Do you have a readily available x86 alternative in your pocket?

Quote:
7. x86 boards and chips are well documneted. what do you think SAM uses?


Definetly no x86 board. Why do you ask?

Quote:
PCI is one such spec mate. It was developed for the mass x86 market. same with ATi cards.


Aha... what about North-/Southbridge (remember the VIA/AmigaOne case?), USB, SATA, Wireless, BlueTooth... should I count more?

You still have no vaild point against the status quo. You still try to argument with some shady dreams, nothing that could stand business reality.

What about leaving Amiga and go for x86, were hardware is pretty cheap and available by any Wal Mart near you? Oh, wait, they won´t give you AmigaOS on x86, because they won´t fund it... *asking himself what the reason may be?*

Regards




Bring it on :)
Once I have disproven you, you can stop.

Where is your costing comparison Whose? You seem to think that the current embedded design costs less than a x86 base of similar spec. I'll provide you with a better spec x86 base that is cheaper here.

Point 1. Here goes ...
Just to be realy nasty, lets start with embedded designs. -> http://www.via.com.tw/en/products/mainboards/

Now lets go to mass market H/W bases This is one-> http://www.geeks.com/products.asp?cat=MBB
Oh, take your pick. they start at $39.95

Point 2.
Where are your uptake statistics on SAM takeup? x86 is in the billions. Google Wiki and see how many are sold each year. Here is one such manufacture IBM http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/01/21/ibm_q4_2008_numbers/print.html
VIA also outsell SAM, ASUS, MSI the list goes on, have a look for yourself.

Point 3.
WinUAE uses AMIGA OS.
lol Still, we are talking about the feesability of porting to AOS4.x to x86. IF it was ported, it could also run it cheaper and sell many more copies too I believe. That's the debate.

Point 4.
Why is it invalid? that keeps AOS limited to a high priced, lower selling uncertain future H/W platform. lol
You say it's invalid but you don't offer any proof.

Point 5.
The EXISTING userbase is not keen to take up expensive lower spec custom H/W = Less sales than the full Current AMIGA userbase buying AOS4.x . no NEW users are adopted or brought in to that pool. the pool has now reduced. Fact.

Point 6.
Me personally? no, but a lot of other manufactures do. Heres a really small one.
Smallest in the world actually. -> http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-9909472-64.html

Point 7.
Oh, i see. SAM doesn't use a PCI slot or SIMM module. You better tell them that cause their specs just got lower i bet. lol
All these industry standard specs are made for x86. Coding information is available or SAM would have the same issues in development. SAM just uses a different codebase to access them. The spec don't change.

Point 8.
I beg to differ. Plenty of well documented chipsets out there for x86 with plety of sources to pull info from. Via make more money norht and southbridge on x86 than the PPC market I can assure you. Look at their website for embedded in point 1.

I hear you making a lot of noise but you aren't really saying much. Where's your proof?
I can't believe you got me to do all this. I didn't like having to do that "homework" lol

I think you need to re evaluate your own arguments because i have now prooven my facts.



Addition to the top of my points, i forgot to address your embedded Automotive x86 design.
Here you go, this is real recent too -> http://www.tomshardware.com/news/VIA-In-Car-PC,7329.html

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eXec 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 15:03:59
#759 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2004
Posts: 954
From: Burkina Faso

@fairlanefastback

I see that only through a prism of naughty words reduction...

If I want to say that AOS should be ported to x86, i can say it 3 000 000 times
in a upcoming thread. Is that also forbidden?

All the best,

D.

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wegster 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 27-Mar-2009 15:05:36
#760 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Nov-2004
Posts: 8554
From: RTP, NC USA

@COBRA

Quote:

COBRA wrote:
@eXec

Quote:
In the year of 2525....
Sam and PPC - Ready for the future!
Hahahaha!


When I read things like this I get the impression that you're just here to troll...


Yes, it does, and he's been warned already, as well as a few others. As I've actively been posting in the thread, I won't process any AR reports in it, short of something 'spectacular', but please, feel free to file ARs if you feel it appropriate, and other members of Staff will attend to them as they deem appropriate.

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Are we not done with the same silly arguments and flames yet??!

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