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cv643d 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 12:01:59
#661 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 29-May-2009
Posts: 262
From: Stockholm - Sweden

Im still peeing myself of excitement what it can be, cant we get a slight hint?!

Please please please!!!

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Frek 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 12:33:02
#662 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 21-Jul-2009
Posts: 134
From: Unknown

@Arko

If you read what I type instead of randomly guess things can be more interesting to discuss.
Your post is full of statements that is mostly irrelevant to the discussion.

Quote:

Of course, and they got more and more standard with every year, x86 was just the last switch. Now they could buy their mainboard evrywhere.


Apple buys the motherboards from Intel (who inturn manufactures the stuff in china)- They're custom designs- and uses (mostly) standard chipsets.

Traditionally apple designed the motherboards on their own, but outsourced manufacturing.
I wouldn't be surprised if that's still the case to some point.; or atleast they license intel designs and modify them.

Quote:

Soft- or hardware ?
For computers or gadgets ?

AFAIk they even use standard designs from other companies iun th

- I don't know if it's as big or bigger than in the early 90s however, but it's significantly bigger than it was during the late 90s and early 00s.

Both,
However- Please tell me, what standard designs from other companies are Apple using?
If it didn't occur to you already, Apple is primilary a hardware company- and that's where most of their income comes from.
Of some reason alot of people thinks they're a software company like microsoft, they never been!

Quote:

AFAIk they are still using standar of the shelf ARM CPUs from TI.

Huh first of all I don't know what you're on to about, secondly Apple never used any ARM CPUs from TI. They use Samsung ARMs!
The only exception is the first versions of the ipod that used custom ARM chips from portaplayer.

Quote:

I'm curious to see what is going on their, if they have just bought PaSemi for the deleopment of own ARM hardware it would be a waste.

But how big is PaSemi 20 developers or more ?

PA Semi doesn't do ARM, they do PowerPC. Now stop confuse things.
And PA Semi was about 150 employees when Apple bought them; I reckon they're in the 200 range today, but still it's a pretty small company.

But just to make things clear P.A Semi doesn't manufacture, they only *design* chipsets.

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TheMaskedMuchacho 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 13:41:21
#663 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 21-Feb-2006
Posts: 341
From: Unknown

@Leo

Quote:
Linux couldn't survive on x86.. oops! Actually Linux first appeared on x86, and is well alive thanks to x86. But desktop market is dead on PPC, so the bigger Linux desktop player (Ubuntu) stopped supporting PPC. FreeBSD, NetBSD, and all BSD flavors are all well alive and kicking... on x86.


you may notice they all (inc aros) have one thing in common that Amiga OS doesnt, they don't cost the user a penny. that, it seems is the only way to get anywhere on the x86 desktop market with anything other than windows or another very well established OS tied to specific hardware (apple) at the minute i see no future for amiga os on the desktop market on any architecture other than a few thousand sales to the faithful, thats what i was trying to get across, there must be another market hyperion are aiming at but they sell the OS to us to keep the community alive, give something back for years of support and because they are all fans the same as we are. the problem is that porting to x86 may not be any use in their other markets and the extra sales to the enthusiast community wouldnt cover the costs. Millions of people wanting to run Amiga OS are not going to appear out of nowhere just because it runs on x86 and most would expect a certain level of functionality thats just not there at the minute in OS4.1 so would maybe download a torrent to try it for a few minutes for nostalgic reasons then go back to windows where they feel more comfortable and can run all their software. maybe in a year or two when the feature level is acceptable to people not used to amiga os and its got a good reputation outside this community then a port to x86 may make sense but at the minute it seems like the wrong way to go.

Don't think i hate the idea of x86, i would love to run OS4 on my Acer Aspire One and my 4gb 3.4ghz core2duo with 2x radeon hd4850s but i just don't see it happening any time soon and it seems to make sense to me why not.

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Arko 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 13:58:48
#664 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Jan-2007
Posts: 1989
From: Unknown

@Frek

Quote:

Frek wrote:
@Arko


However- Please tell me, what standard designs from other companies are Apple using?


From:
Tianrui Technical Co.,ltd
Nanguang, Shenzhen, Guangdong,
China
Shen Zhen
Guangdong
China 518000

Produkt Mac Notebook (branded as Mac Air):
Description1.8 intel core 2 duo processor with 4 mb shared l2 cache; intel gma x3100 video processor with 144 mb shared memory thinnest, lightest macbook ever includes multi-touch trackpad, built-in isight webcam, and up to 5-hour battery life one usb 2.0, built-in wi-fi (802.11n draft plus 802.11b/g), bluetooth 2.0 + edr, micro-dvi video output with adapters preloaded with mac os x 10.5 leopard operating system and ilife '08 suite of applications 13.3-inch glossy led-backlit screen; 64 gb solid-state hard drive; 2 gb of ram (maximum capacity)


Last edited by Arko on 28-Jul-2009 at 02:18 PM.

_________________
AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

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Arko 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 14:09:57
#665 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Jan-2007
Posts: 1989
From: Unknown

@Frek

Quote:

Frek wrote:

PA Semi doesn't do ARM, they do PowerPC. Now stop confuse things.



I never claimed PASeme doing ARM (even if some people belives Apple has bought PASemi for this puprose )

Here is what I told about PASemi and ARM:

Quote:

if they have just bought PaSemi for the deleopment of own ARM hardware it would be a waste.

_________________
AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

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Frek 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 14:32:13
#666 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 21-Jul-2009
Posts: 134
From: Unknown

@Arko

Who has even suggested Apple bought PA Semi to do ARM stuff? What would they gain on it? Companies buys other companies of two reasons, either they want their expertise- or they want to shutdown the company.
PA Semi was no threat to Apple, if anything I think it's more likely they're working on some netbook processor or something. But I don't know, I just think it's very unlikely they do anything ARM related at all.

Apple already do the "hardware" of the iPhone, they buy the processor/gfx package from another distributor like pretty much everyone else does in the industry.
I don't think there's a company in the world that manufactures every component they use in their hardware.

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Frek 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 14:38:24
#667 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 21-Jul-2009
Posts: 134
From: Unknown

@Arko

Quote:


From:
Tianrui Technical Co.,ltd
Nanguang, Shenzhen, Guangdong,
China
Shen Zhen
Guangdong
China 518000

Produkt Mac Notebook (branded as Mac Air):
Description1.8 intel core 2 duo processor with 4 mb shared l2 cache; intel gma x3100 video processor with 144 mb shared memory thinnest, lightest macbook ever includes multi-touch trackpad, built-in isight webcam, and up to 5-hour battery life one usb 2.0, built-in wi-fi (802.11n draft plus 802.11b/g), bluetooth 2.0 + edr, micro-dvi video output with adapters preloaded with mac os x 10.5 leopard operating system and ilife '08 suite of applications 13.3-inch glossy led-backlit screen; 64 gb solid-state hard drive; 2 gb of ram (maximum capacity)


You seriously think this chinese company made this product and apple just found it and said "hey lets make this a mac"- buys them and calls them Macbook Air out of nothing?

It's no secret that chinese companies build Apples hardware; infact that's pretty much standard for all electronics companies.

Asus and Quanta Computer already build apples Macbook and Macbook Pro, "builds" as in assembles- manufactures, it does not mean they designed them, neither the case or the ciruitry.

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Arko 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 14:41:39
#668 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Jan-2007
Posts: 1989
From: Unknown

@Frek

Quote:

Frek wrote:
@Arko

[quote]



You seriously think this chinese company made this product and apple just found it and said "hey lets make this a mac"- buys them and calls them Macbook Air out of nothing?


No, I'm not as naive as you think, this is not how this type of contracts works ...

Quote:

It's no secret that chinese companies build Apples hardware; infact that's pretty much standard for all electronics companies.


I already wrote it: standard

_________________
AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

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Arko 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 14:46:22
#669 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Jan-2007
Posts: 1989
From: Unknown

@Frek

Quote:

Frek wrote:
@Arko

Who has even suggested Apple bought PA Semi to do ARM stuff?


http://www.google.de/search?hl=de&q=apple+bought+pa+Semi+for+ARM&btnG=Google-Suche&meta=&aq=f&oq=

Quote:

What would they gain on it?


They would gain an own chip designer, that could tailor the chips to their special demands, some people (at least one) have experiance with ARM but I already wrote :

if they have just bought PaSemi for the deleopment of own ARM hardware it would be a waste.


Last edited by Arko on 28-Jul-2009 at 02:46 PM.

_________________
AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

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Frek 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 14:52:03
#670 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 21-Jul-2009
Posts: 134
From: Unknown

@Arko

Btw this is a fraud if someone claims to sell a computer from that manufacturer,
MacBook Air is manufactured by Quanta Computer (which is taiwanese to start with).

"Tianrui Technical Co.,ltd
Nanguang, Shenzhen, Guangdong,
China
Shen Zhen
Guangdong
China 518000
"

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OldFart 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 14:52:34
#671 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Sep-2004
Posts: 3059
From: Stad; en d'r is moar ain stad en da's Stad. Makkelk zat!

@All

What has this all to do with Hyperion's secret project? Or are we simply disgressing from what this thread was all about.

OldFart

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AmigaBlitter 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 14:58:29
#672 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 26-Sep-2005
Posts: 3512
From: Unknown

@cv643d

i'm not interested at all. Stop with the Amiga.



























_________________
retired

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brotsalami 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 15:04:19
#673 ]
Member
Joined: 28-Jan-2009
Posts: 36
From: Unknown

@OldFart

as I already mentioned:

"off topic thread search algorythm"

that is the way to go for Hyperion to make the big money and bring back Amiga to glory.

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Bite Me!

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AmigaHeretic 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 15:52:25
#674 ]
Super Member
Joined: 7-Mar-2003
Posts: 1697
From: Oregon

Quote:
future for amiga os on the desktop market on any architecture other than a few thousand sales to the faithful,



I guess we may never know for sure as AmigaOS's time seems to be fading, I think there would have been a lot more sales if AmigaOS 4 had been bundled with a $99 modern in every way motherboard, than like it was sold bundled with an $800 anchor.

Later we got more $800 anchors and finally some $650 anchors! WooHoo!!

@all

This crazy idea that if AmigaOS had been bundled with a $99 motherboard instead of an $800 motherboard, people would have just preferred to use Windows is a joke.


The sad reality is that most Amiga users from back then eventually said the exact opposite!! They said, " You want me to buy an $800 motherboard to run the NEW Amiga OS? Nah, I guess I'll switch to Windows as an $800 motherboard is not really an option." And we lost most our users that were still waiting from the 90's till the very early 2000's.


Why did this happen? Because a FEW insane people out there wanted to force us to pay 8X to 10X more for the little white writing on a CPU to say the letters P P, C, instead of the letters X, 8, and 6.



_________________
A3000D (16mhz, 2MB Chip, 4MB Fast, SCSI (300+MB), SuperGen Genlock, Kick 3.1)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Back in my day, we didn't have water. We only had Oxygen & Hydrogen, & we'd just shove 'em together

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Interesting 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 16:00:55
#675 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 1812
From: a place & time long long ago, when things mattered.

@Frek

Quote:
Btw this is a fraud if someone claims to sell a computer from that manufacturer,


the asians have a different way of thinking on the matter and this could be another knock off.

_________________
"The system no longer works " -- Young Anakin Skywalker

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Interesting 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 16:06:52
#676 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 1812
From: a place & time long long ago, when things mattered.

@Arko

Quote:
if they have just bought PaSemi for the deleopment of own ARM hardware it would be a waste.


it was a great business move on Apple's part. PASemi div of Apple continues to sell the PPC chipsets, maybe Apple has made their money back.

Second: Apple now follows the old Commodore business model of custom chipsets this time sans the fab.

a win win

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"The system no longer works " -- Young Anakin Skywalker

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TheMaskedMuchacho 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 16:28:41
#677 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 21-Feb-2006
Posts: 341
From: Unknown

@AmigaHeretic

Quote:
This crazy idea that if AmigaOS had been bundled with a $99 motherboard instead of an $800 motherboard, people would have just preferred to use Windows is a joke.


MOST people would choose to use windows out of familiarity and because thats what runs the software they need, thats why MOST people use windows now and not Linux or OSX. even a $99 motherboard would not change that, there probably would have been a lot more sales than there was for the amiga one and sam combined but i expect it would still only be a few thousand. Also x86 made no sense in 2001, apple were still using PPC and were performing much better than x86 at the time so PPC seemed a good choice. only the fact that the hardware was produced in low volume made it as expensive as it was and is the same reason the SAM is as expensive as it is now, x86 wouldnt really change that much as it would be impossible to support all the hardware out there so a small selection of compatible hardware would have to be chosen and then changed after 6 months when it becomes obsolete and is no longer manufacturered making a constant cycle of development that would stop or slow development of important OS features. the only other solution would be to support some VIA motherboards, they are very cheap and have a much longer time on sale than anything else so support would be easier but they would be no more powerful than a SAM440 but then people would be getting the OS for free from some torrent site and trying it on their regular desktop and complaining that it doesnt support any hardware and feels out dated to use, a bad reputation would follow and stall sales outside the current community again.

PPC may be dead on the desktop but so is Amiga OS, they may work well together in another market so let it be, you still get to use it on your desktop if you want to. if you dont want to buy a PPC amiga board then don't use amiga OS, use Aros on your core2quad or stick with 3.9 on a classic.

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OldFart 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 16:44:03
#678 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Sep-2004
Posts: 3059
From: Stad; en d'r is moar ain stad en da's Stad. Makkelk zat!

@TheMaskedMuchacho

Quote:
PPC may be dead on the desktop but so is Amiga OS, they may work well together in another market so let it be, you still get to use it on your desktop if you want to. if you dont want to buy a PPC amiga board then don't use amiga OS, use Aros on your core2quad or stick with 3.9 on a classic.

Amen to that!

At long last a sensible word in this thread, which has slowly but surely been downgrading in a whining and complaining thread. Again: well said!

OldFart

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rigo 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 17:18:30
#679 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 30-Jul-2003
Posts: 718
From: Unknown

@OldFart

Amen to that. It is quite refreshing to know that there are still people in this community that can see past the end of their noses.

_________________
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Comments made by me on any public fora are not representative of, or on behalf of, any company I may have, or assumed by the reader to have, any association with.

Any comments are a personal opinion, and should be accepted as such.

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OldFart 
Re: the secret project of Hyperion
Posted on 28-Jul-2009 17:50:16
#680 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Sep-2004
Posts: 3059
From: Stad; en d'r is moar ain stad en da's Stad. Makkelk zat!

@rigo

Quote:
It is quite refreshing to know that there are still people in this community that can see past the end of their noses.

Getting of an age forces me into this capabillity: even glasses of +1.5 are becoming to weak now.

OldFart

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