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      /  Spotify for the Amiga is a go
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PosterThread
OlafS25 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 9:45:25
#241 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 6321
From: Unknown

@Birbo

I do not know how complicated a port is. But even if you are right with 10.000 it is not the end of story. The software is in development so you need someone doing the updates. And you need someone who can do the support if they have requests. That must be done inhouse.

And porting software you do not know is not a easy task. Even a experienced developer would need some time. So 10.000 EUR is propably not much for that task. Someone would have to stay there for some time to do it.

Last edited by OlafS25 on 12-Jul-2013 at 09:49 AM.

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Overflow 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 9:46:15
#242 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2012
Posts: 1628
From: Norway

@Birbo

How long would a company stay in buissniss with such a model; "lets spend money on something
we probarly wont get any return on?"

Not saying in the long run they wont get a return on the time spent cause there are some revenue
to be made with everyone in Amiga land using spotify.
But throwing away money just for nostalgica will make for a funny boardmeeting.

That said; I really hope Spotify will arrive on the Amiga. I love using it on my WinPC, and its my main music
"channel"/streaming service.

Last edited by Overflow on 12-Jul-2013 at 09:47 AM.

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Britelite 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 10:22:05
#243 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 23-Jun-2005
Posts: 295
From: Finland

@Overflow

Quote:

Not saying in the long run they wont get a return on the time spent cause there are some revenue
to be made with everyone in Amiga land using spotify.

I don't think they would be getting much more revenue from porting Spotify to the Amiga (and variants), the userbase is just way too small. The ones that are interested in Spotify are probably already using it, so the amount of actual new users would be even smaller.

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Birbo 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 10:42:02
#244 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 5-Apr-2007
Posts: 594
From: Zurich, Switzerland

@Overflow

It depends on the company and the amount of money. But holding back money is not the solution - this is well known...

And I tell you what: spending money on something probably won't get any return is very common: Marketing, Research and Human Resources are fields where a lot of money is spent, even when probably no return will come.

And for deciding about Euro 10'000 you don't need even a boardmeeting, when hundreds of milions of dollars have been invested...


What better reason does exist to invest, sayin that spotify will be available on one more platform? You could even make a Marketing-Event out of that...

_________________
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OlafS25 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 10:46:41
#245 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 6321
From: Unknown

@Birbo

10.000 EUR is only a personal guess, we do not know (it could be much more). And I already said it is more than one time doing the port.

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Britelite 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 11:04:10
#246 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 23-Jun-2005
Posts: 295
From: Finland

@Birbo

Quote:

And I tell you what: spending money on something probably won't get any return is very common: Marketing, Research and Human Resources are fields where a lot of money is spent, even when probably no return will come.

But you don't do marketing and research for something that you don't expect to generate income at some point. And Spotify on Amiga is a loss, no matter how you look at it.

Quote:

And for deciding about Euro 10'000 you don't need even a boardmeeting, when hundreds of milions of dollars have been invested...

Maybe not a boardmeeting, but someone has to make the decision to hire/pay someone to do the port. And seriously, for 10000e they could hire a fulltime coder for a month, maybe a month and a half. That MIGHT get a port, but they still have to have someone doing the updates and so on.

Quote:

What better reason does exist to invest, sayin that spotify will be available on one more platform? You could even make a Marketing-Event out of that...

"Look here, we're releasing the Spotify client for a platform nobody uses!" ;)

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wawa 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 12:11:32
#247 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 6259
From: Unknown

what is so important about particularly spotify that it is so much "must to have" and that it is worth so much investment? lets assume it is there, what does that change for the majority of users? ability to use one of these countless internet services that may come and go? okay, it was apparently worth a try, it has not worked out, like most of these initiatives, and now people want to push it even harder?
arent there more important things than just showing off "i have a spotify!". as we see from this experience there are obviously more important things to work on first, underlying dependencies that have not been met. one should do first things first.

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Birbo 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 13:11:14
#248 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 5-Apr-2007
Posts: 594
From: Zurich, Switzerland

@wawa

The only thing is, that there was a bounty - with no result until today.

I don't know if it's important or not to have a spotify vlient on the Amiga.

But a lot of platforms already have one - and since we have QT 4.7 an AmigaOS it would be great to port the linux client to AmigaOS.

_________________
Sometimes we give people a lot of credit just because they’re writing nice sentences even if it isn’t adding up to much.

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Overflow 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 13:14:48
#249 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2012
Posts: 1628
From: Norway

@wawa

Well, I have Spotify on my Main Tower PC, laptop and mobile phone. Its very handy to
be able to access my playlist anywhere as long as Ive saved the details as a user.

Its not a "big deal" to have per see, its just a very convinient and userfriendly
way to access music.

On AmiKit I use hippoplayer (just like on my real A1200) and it serves its purpose
perfectly. I got it hooked up to my stereo and blast those awesome old tunes I got
stored.

But Spotify is so much more userfriendly when it comes to current music.
You hear a song on the radio, flip up your mobile or PC, type in the name and its
added to your playlist a few seconds later.

A MUST have? No. Nice to have? Hell yeah!

EDIT;

Its a bit like the ageold discussion regarding what you expect from your system.
Do you want it to cover all your current needs or are you happy switching between
Amiga and Win/linux/Mac to get things done?
Back in 1990-93 I got by at highschool using A500 and I belive the wordprocessing program that came with Workbench (honestly dont remember if it was a 3rd party program, but floppy only a500).
A1200 I got HD, turbocalc and wordsworth. In reality I dont really need more to get
by.
BUT its very CONVINIENT to be able to do everything on 1 machine.

I like to think the readers here would love to be able to have only a "Amiga" based machine to everything, be it AOS4, AROS, MorpOS or x1000 with linux.

So its with that backdrop it would be nice to have Spotify, together with Openoffice, browser with up to date features, a music program that would drag users like DJnick away from Renoise etc.

The realism if this is another topic, but this is why its understandable why Skuggan pushed for Spotify on Amiga.

Last edited by Overflow on 12-Jul-2013 at 01:45 PM.

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Skuggan 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 14:02:43
#250 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 10-May-2010
Posts: 165
From: Sweden

@Olaf25: You have many good points there.
Many of those I already know.

I cant remember who said what but here is some answers:

"Spending money on something that might not have a large user base just because its cool and retro."
Some companies do this because it creates headlines etc. There are many reasons to do this but in the end it should generate more customers. Like ex Amigans that will still use their PC or Mac but find it respectable to the good old Amiga.

When we started this Spotify deal we ment to get it ported for all plattforms but started with AmigaOS 4 to see the response. If we throw three different systems on them on the first "date" they might have closed the door.

We were offered a free Arosmachine from ClusterUK but we wanted to wait a while to see what spotify said.

Regarding offering free coder we have done this to some extent but they never answer to that.

We are now writing down a more serious offer backed up by a good Amiga coder and the company he is working on to give it more punch so to speak.
Having a Amiga coder at spotify under NDA is no different from a employee with NDA. They can both steal the code when they quit but they are not allowed.

If someone wish to compete with Spotify they can easily figure out a protocol by them selves.

We are doing our best and we see what happens.

@Olaf25: One more thing. The other machine I gave away is not to a big company like Spotify but to a talented Amigaguy that had no NG machine. :)

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wawa 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 14:04:28
#251 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 6259
From: Unknown

@Overflow

i dont say, its not worth to have if possible, but is it worth to have at all costs?? i can understand skuggans motivation, what i dont understand is the reasoning. the whole issue was doomed to fail from the start, now you want gather even more funds to burn..
guys, stand back and get real for a minute, then think of something that can actually help your platform.

and i dont think of any particular software your phone can run. because if you can run it on a phone it will not drag users away from it towards some obscure, expensive, poorly supported platform running on heavy hardware.

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wawa 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 14:07:34
#252 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 6259
From: Unknown

@Skuggan

Quote:
We are now writing down a more serious offer backed up by a good Amiga coder and the company he is working on to give it more punch so to speak. Having a Amiga coder at spotify under NDA is no different from a employee with NDA. They can both steal the code when they quit but they are not allowed.


im sorry, but this really sounds childish. you are dealing with a serious enterprise that works for profit, how can you seriously expect it to work out?

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Overflow 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 14:13:37
#253 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2012
Posts: 1628
From: Norway

@wawa

Skuggan saw an oppurtunity that probarly looked more realistic than it seems now.

Hindsight 20/20.

Im not gonna get into a long debate on this.

If you want to attract even the ex amigas that have gotten lazy and creatures of convinience (like me) then some basic functunality is "required".
If not, then ill stick to my A1200 and AmiKit

Im perfectly aware of the Amiga being a hobby machine for most and should be treated as such from a buissnis and expectation point of view.
Tho Trevor/aeon seems to try to make a small niche' market that could be somewhat
sustainable. I have no idea if he even breaks even or is planning to do so with his project.
But a X1000, 2000 or whatever they would be called sure would look even more attractive
with Spotify (amongst many other things).

As for getting "real". I support Amiga directed developers by buying the software that I can use right now, be it Amikit, AmigaForever, or games that runs on IOS, WinPC (that is also developed for the AOS4). Last game I bought was Huenison by saimo. Pocketchange
and I would probarly never had been aware (or bought it) if it werent for this forum.

@Skuggan; good luck with the new proposal. I hope you will have better luck this time around.

Last edited by Overflow on 12-Jul-2013 at 02:21 PM.
Last edited by Overflow on 12-Jul-2013 at 02:16 PM.

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OlafS25 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 14:13:41
#254 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 6321
From: Unknown

@Skuggan

I wish you good luck with your offer (you seem still to hope) but i personally do not belief it will have success. As I already wrote to someone else porting it now is one thing but then it must be further updated and they must offer support for a system they do not know. And you cannot simply say "no support for amigans" you are obliged to do by law. And that all with people not in the house. We will see who is right.

When you write your offer you should include how updates are handled and how support should be (realistic) be handled because they will certainly think about it before making a decision.

Last edited by OlafS25 on 12-Jul-2013 at 02:38 PM.

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OlafS25 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 14:22:52
#255 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 6321
From: Unknown

@Skuggan

Regarding AROS you are a AmigaOS fan so it is fine for me that you showed it first. But generally I would say chances for any commercial support are higher if something runs on known (and cheap) hardware. Many of the "NG" fans here see the world very different compared to the other people. But even if you would have showed AROS (without the need to convince them of exotic hardware) I doubt that they would have supported it (low user number, no expert knowledge, nobody for support...).

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Toaks 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 21:19:55
#256 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 8042
From: amigaguru.com



typical, there is always people who moan about people not being interested because they already have it on their pc or mac etc, you know? , you guys are actually the whole problem and the reason for the userbase to shrink.

maybe people should USE their Amiga instead of pretending to use it? , that's when people get the need for tools/games or whatever.

come on guys, we need major stuff and skuggan wanted this spotify thing, so do i and that is why i donated.

if spotify ain't for you then maybe you should take the initiative to bring forward and do a bounty or whatever on the stuff you want.

_________________
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Rose 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 12-Jul-2013 23:40:36
#257 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 5-Nov-2009
Posts: 982
From: Unknown

@Toaks

What they are intrested is number of new users... And I cant see all camps combined to be enough.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 13-Jul-2013 1:52:59
#258 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 12795
From: Norway

@Rose

You don't get new users by taking crap about what people are trying to achieve, I'm all for suggestion on how things can be done better or constrictive criticism, but when some one use criticism, only to under mind the efforts of some one or group, then it is a disgrace.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 13-Jul-2013 at 02:58 AM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 13-Jul-2013 at 02:56 AM.

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OlafS25 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 13-Jul-2013 7:41:13
#259 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 6321
From: Unknown

@NutsAboutAmiga

Where is here "crap"? Nobody said Skuggan had bad intentions or similar and he took the comments much more constructive than f.e. Toaks. I now only wait for someone calling others "Trolls" then we are back in the typical discussion "AmigaOS" versus rest of the world. I contacted game developers (former amigans) a couple of months ago and know that they answered. In opposite to the few developers and users here most people outside want to earn money with programming so we have to find a way that this becomes possible. Calling every "non-conform" view "crap" is not improving anything. Please think a little about it (the same for Toaks)

Last edited by OlafS25 on 13-Jul-2013 at 07:48 AM.

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Britelite 
Re: Spotify for the Amiga is a go
Posted on 13-Jul-2013 7:47:24
#260 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 23-Jun-2005
Posts: 295
From: Finland

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

You don't get new users by taking crap about what people are trying to achieve, I'm all for suggestion on how things can be done better or constrictive criticism, but when some one use criticism, only to under mind the efforts of some one or group, then it is a disgrace.

I think it's a nice effort trying to get Spotify to do a port, but you have to be realistic. If they as a company really had interest in doing the port they probably would have got it done already. As Rose said, the userbase is just way too small for them to even have a theoretical chance of seeing some kind of return to their investment. The smallest platform that currently has an official client is probably Symbian, and even that platform still has millions of users, in contrast to the few thousands in amigaland.

I really think that porting one of the open-source alternatives would be a more realistic option. Or if we want an official Spotify-port, we should find a coder in the company that would be enthusiastic enough to take this as a pet-project and be willing to work on it in his/her sparetime.

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