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Nimrod
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 15-Aug-2012 19:38:16
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Super Member |
Joined: 30-Jan-2010 Posts: 1223
From: Untied Kingdom | | |
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| @BigD
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What makes you think the C4EM petition is anything other than Elton John and David Furnish signing it 30,000 times | It doesn't matter if that other petition is as you say because that other petition is totally irrelevant. Even if the C4EM petition did not exist it does not alter the simple fact that 590,000 religious fundamentalist bullies do not constitute a working majority. For two thousand years all debate has been silenced by the unsupported claim that "God says so", and as a result there has been no true concept of democracy until recently. Don't forget that once women had no say, and no property rights because "God says so", and people who did not own their own homes had no vote because "God says so", and non christians could not become MP's because "God says so". AAnd you think that democracy is dying, just because you and your cronies no longer hold absolute power.
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keep marriage the way it has been for thousands of years | Which biblical definition of marriage do you mean? This one perhaps? Or one of the ones in BrianK's list? Once you have forced the homosexual community back into the closet, what is your next target? Contraception? Divorce? Democracy? Or do you plan to reintroduce slavery? We have spent too much effort moving away from the stone age to let some fundamentalist drag us back._________________ When in trouble, fear or doubt, run in circles, scream and shout. |
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SpaceDruid
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 15-Aug-2012 19:58:45
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Super Member |
Joined: 12-Jan-2007 Posts: 1748
From: Inside the mind of a cow on a planet that's flying through space at 242.334765 miles per second. | | |
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| @Nimrod
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We have spent too much effort moving away from the stone age to let some fundamentalist drag us back. |
It isn't going to happen and that's why he is so angry. BigotD is like a spoilt single child suddenly realising that the world doesn't revolve round himself when he hears a new baby is on the way. He's already thrown his toys out of the pram and soiled himself, now he's having his temper tantrum. _________________ "Anyone with a modicum of reasonableness may realize that it is like comparing the ride in the world to descend the stairs to catch the milk in the house."
Google Translate |
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AndyC
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 15-Aug-2012 21:19:45
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Joined: 28-Oct-2002 Posts: 180
From: Edinburgh | | |
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| @Rob
Because it's his "faith position".
@SpaceDruid
Too true!
AndyC
Last edited by AndyC on 15-Aug-2012 at 09:22 PM.
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Rob
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 0:14:42
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Elite Member |
Joined: 20-Mar-2003 Posts: 6344
From: S.Wales | | |
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| @AndyC
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Because it's his "faith position". |
I'd like to hear it from him. |
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AndyC
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 9:22:35
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Regular Member |
Joined: 28-Oct-2002 Posts: 180
From: Edinburgh | | |
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| @Rob
Wouldn't we all... |
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BigD
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 12:47:55
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Elite Member |
Joined: 11-Aug-2005 Posts: 7307
From: UK | | |
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| @Nimrod
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It doesn't matter if that other petition is as you say because that other petition is totally irrelevant. Even if the C4EM petition did not exist it does not alter the simple fact that 590,000 religious fundamentalist bullies do not constitute a working majority. |
I am completely bewildered why you keep needing this clarified but the C4M petition is non-religious and has a wide range of people from different "faith positions" and political persuasions. IT IS NOT A RELIGIOUS ORGANISATION!!
Secondly, it is simply a HUGE number of people, one of the biggest petitions of recent times and cannot be ignored by politicians if we are still said to live in a democracy. If it is ignored we are on the slippery slope to some sort of dictatorship where what David Cameron says goes despite no manifesto pledge or public consensus to change marriage!!Last edited by BigD on 16-Aug-2012 at 12:49 PM.
_________________ "Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art." John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios |
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Rose
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 13:28:39
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Cult Member |
Joined: 5-Nov-2009 Posts: 982
From: Unknown | | |
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| @BigD
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BigD wrote: @Nimrod
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It doesn't matter if that other petition is as you say because that other petition is totally irrelevant. Even if the C4EM petition did not exist it does not alter the simple fact that 590,000 religious fundamentalist bullies do not constitute a working majority. |
I am completely bewildered why you keep needing this clarified but the C4M petition is non-religious and has a wide range of people from different "faith positions" and political persuasions. IT IS NOT A RELIGIOUS ORGANISATION!!
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So it's just coincidence that everyone on board of directors are leading figures of varios fundamental christian organisations? |
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BigD
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 13:35:18
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Elite Member |
Joined: 11-Aug-2005 Posts: 7307
From: UK | | |
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| @Rose
Everyone is free to sign the petition and all sorts of people have. I took a petition sheet around my street and all my neighbours wholeheartedly signed up even though one of them had a nephew who is living a homosexual lifestyle. Christians are probably more aware of the importance of marriage but the majority of the country at large value it too! Why don't you? _________________ "Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art." John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios |
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Rose
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 13:37:32
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Cult Member |
Joined: 5-Nov-2009 Posts: 982
From: Unknown | | |
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| @BigD
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BigD wrote: @Rose
Everyone is free to sign the petition and all sorts of people have. I took a petition sheet around my street and all my neighbours wholeheartedly signed up even though one of them had a nephew who is living a homosexual lifestyle. Christians are probably more aware of the importance of marriage but the majority of the country at large value it too! Why don't you? |
And now you are changing subject again... Is it's just coincidence that everyone on board of directors are leading figures of varios fundamental christian organisations? |
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BigD
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 13:46:39
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Elite Member |
Joined: 11-Aug-2005 Posts: 7307
From: UK | | |
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| @Rose
So a homosexual has to have started the petition to make it valid? Richard Dawkins himself perhaps? Get a grip!!! It is a large demographic of different faith persuasions including atheists and even encompasses different sexual preferences. In the public sphere George Michael and Christopher Biggins do not believe in this ridiculously unnecessary redefinition because Civil Partnerships are enough and represent equality in the law! _________________ "Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art." John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios |
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Rose
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 13:48:34
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Cult Member |
Joined: 5-Nov-2009 Posts: 982
From: Unknown | | |
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| @BigD
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BigD wrote: @Rose
So a homosexual has to have started the petition to make it valid? Richard Dawkins himself perhaps? Get a grip!!! It is a large demographic of different faith persuasions including atheists and even encompasses different sexual preferences. In the public sphere George Michael and Christopher Biggins do not believe in this ridiculously unnecessary redefinition because Civil Partnerships are enough and represent equality in the law! |
In true Fundie christian way you dodge actual question. Might be able to respect your opinion if you wouldn't try to hide your real agenda. |
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T-J
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 14:35:55
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Cult Member |
Joined: 31-Aug-2010 Posts: 596
From: Unknown | | |
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| @BigD
You've avoided the issue, again. You've got one debunked and flawed poll showing 70% against. I've got the weight of British polling over the past twenty years, including recent polls by Ipsos and Yougov showing 65% in favour. And yet you accuse me of lying, in an increasingly hysterical manner.
Why is this?
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Everyone is free to sign the petition and all sorts of people have. I took a petition sheet around my street and all my neighbours wholeheartedly signed up even though one of them had a nephew who is living a homosexual lifestyle. Christians are probably more aware of the importance of marriage but the majority of the country at large value it too! Why don't you? |
People willfully indulging in their interfering religious lifestyle choice, now that's something that sorely tries my patience. Going round the neighbours with a petition trying to interfere in how they live their own lives in their own homes, how un-British. I'll let you into a little secret. Your neighbours didn't sign to support your petition. They signed to get that crazy old man off their doorstep before he started telling them about Jesus.
Also, while we're on the topic of lifestyle: Homosexuality is not a lifestyle choice, it is a biological fact. You will I hope notice that I didn't need to add any exclamation marks to this statement nor did I need to express it in block capitals. This is because it is already a true statement and therefore does not need any false emphasis to make it look like one.
Unlike this:
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IT IS NOT A RELIGIOUS ORGANISATION!! |
Methinks he doth protest too much.
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Wake up and smell the death of democracy! This is a valid petition representing the silent majority of this country that don't want marriage destroyed to help... |
C4M is not a sovereign body. Its petition has no relevance to democracy whatsoever. There is only one poll, devolved administrations notwithstanding, that is remotely relevant to democracy at this level and that was the poll held on Thursday the 6th of May 2010 to elect the members of the Parliament of the United Kingdom.
During that election, every single party that elected members to Parliament has a stated position of supporting equal marriage. Everyone, from the Conservatives to the Greens.
When anyone, one single member, is elected to Parliament on an anti-gay platform, then perhaps we will have a debate to hold on the democratic legitimacy of equal marriage. But until then, there is no such case to answer and your attempts to raise one attack the foundations of the democracy you claim to defend. As long as it agrees with you of course.
I urge you to stand for election during the next relevant poll in 2015, on such a platform in your local constituency. Then, we will both discover how much support your opinion really has among your petition-signing neighbours. And maybe then you will learn that democracy is not synonymous with getting your own way. |
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Rose
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 15:08:35
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Cult Member |
Joined: 5-Nov-2009 Posts: 982
From: Unknown | | |
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| @BigD
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BigD wrote: @Rose
Everyone is free to sign the petition and all sorts of people have. I took a petition sheet around my street and all my neighbours wholeheartedly signed up even though one of them had a nephew who is living a homosexual lifestyle. Christians are probably more aware of the importance of marriage but the majority of the country at large value it too! Why don't you? |
Why you are avoiding question? |
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BigD
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 17:05:07
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Elite Member |
Joined: 11-Aug-2005 Posts: 7307
From: UK | | |
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| @Rose
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Why you are avoiding question? |
It is of no consequence what the personal beliefs are of the founding members of C4M only that it is open to everyone and is not religious in nature. Last edited by BigD on 16-Aug-2012 at 05:23 PM.
_________________ "Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art." John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios |
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BigD
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 17:11:19
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Elite Member |
Joined: 11-Aug-2005 Posts: 7307
From: UK | | |
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| @T-J
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Your neighbours didn't sign to support your petition. They signed to get that crazy old man off their doorstep before he started telling them about Jesus. |
Since it isn't a religious petition the subject of Jesus didn't come up, only the importance of marriage to British life and the acknowledgment that Civil Partnerships should continue!
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During that election, every single party that elected members to Parliament has a stated position of supporting equal marriage. Everyone, from the Conservatives to the Greens. |
An absolute lie! There was no mention of support for Homosexual Marriage in the Liberal or Conservative Party manifestos. This was a completely unwarranted amendment to marriage that no one campaigned for!
Again check your so called facts _________________ "Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art." John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios |
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AndyC
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 18:47:39
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Regular Member |
Joined: 28-Oct-2002 Posts: 180
From: Edinburgh | | |
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| @BigD
Your hypocrisy knows no bounds.
You are asking people to check facts, yet base your religious ideology on fairy tales.
To quote Goebbels:
“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
Replace the word "State" with "Church" and what do you get?
“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the church can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the church to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the church.”
And there, in a nutshell, is the basis of Christianity over the last 2000 years.
Not that you're paying any attention...
AndyC Last edited by AndyC on 16-Aug-2012 at 06:52 PM.
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Nimrod
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 19:18:05
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Super Member |
Joined: 30-Jan-2010 Posts: 1223
From: Untied Kingdom | | |
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| @BigD
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Everyone is free to sign the petition | This is true, but much to your disgust people are also free to not sign[/b[ your charter of hate. Quote:
I took a petition sheet around my street | So not satisfied with pestering a group of people on a computer forum, you disturbed your neighbours to pressurise them into supporting your campaign for inequality. The neighbour who signed despite having a homosexual relative most likely signed just to get rid of you secure in the knowledge that it would make absolutely no difference. The [b]minority viewpoint is not going to prevail just because they invoke their invisible friend. Quote:
Christians are probably more aware of the importance of marriage | Do you have any evidence for this smug, self satisfied egocentric view, or is it just more evidence of your holier-than-thou attitude to the rest of the world. Once you have convinced youself that you are morally superior to the rest of the world it becomes easier to deny others the right to order their own lives because you "know better". The next step is torturing people to recant their heretical opinions "for their own good" This is the slippery slope back to the dark ages that you want to take us on. Quote:
the majority of the country at large value it too | As do I, old boy. Which is why I feel it important to spread its benefits as widely as possible. If two other people can make each other happy, it does not in any way detract from my own happiness, although it obviously does upset you. Could it possibly mean that I as an atheist have more of the true 'spirit of christianity' than a self proclaimed 'christian' has.
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This was a completely unwarranted amendment to marriage that no one campaigned for! | There have been thousands of items of legislation passed through parliament that were never in any parties manifesto, some good and some not so good. Do you honestly think that this country should call a general election every time some new item of legislation is required? As a matter of interest the political party that has had the greatest part of its manifesto commitments passed into law in the past forty years was David Sutch's Monster Raving Loony Party, and he never even managed to keep his deposit. Many of his manifesto commitments were quietly passed into law by other parties in government for no other reason than that they made sense._________________ When in trouble, fear or doubt, run in circles, scream and shout. |
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Nimrod
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 19:31:08
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Super Member |
Joined: 30-Jan-2010 Posts: 1223
From: Untied Kingdom | | |
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| @AndyC
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“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the church can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the church to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the church.” And there, in a nutshell, is the basis of Christianity over the last 2000 years. | I have been trying to sum up the history of the church for years, and you have just topped my best efforts in one short post.
I am humbled in the presence of greatness _________________ When in trouble, fear or doubt, run in circles, scream and shout. |
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Rose
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 19:43:41
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Cult Member |
Joined: 5-Nov-2009 Posts: 982
From: Unknown | | |
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We have quite many boxes crossed allready...
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AndyC
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Re: Gay Civil Marriage In UK at a cost of 3.7 million - good use of tax payers money!? Please sign Petition if you think not. Posted on 16-Aug-2012 20:00:39
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Regular Member |
Joined: 28-Oct-2002 Posts: 180
From: Edinburgh | | |
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| @Nimrod
Always happy to please my good man!
AndyC |
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