@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

You should be extremely careful when installing 68k software; the installers might easily replace system libraries or MUI classes, at least take a backup before you do, it might be smart to run some dir compare tool after you have installed something just in case. Also MUI classes that are installed into LIBS: might give big problems, MUI classes should be found in SYS:MUI no where else.

Use Chris Handley's AmiSystemRestore to take care of this!

It will record what has been installed and overwritten and lets you revert changes you don't want. Very practical in situations like this.

I'm not entirely sure he has released a full version yet though since I couldn't find it in OS4depot.

http://www.amigans.net/modules/xforum/viewtopic.php?post_id=64570

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@mbrantley

Quote:

ModePro (some folks will scoff at using this, as OS4's Screens editor does mostly the same thing)

I disagree. There is no substitute for using ModePro if you want to have the greatest chance of promoting all of your screens and position them where you want on the display.

It may be 68k, but I wouldn't use OS4 mode promotion on a bet. Heh.

#6

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@amigadave

I can't say that I've used DPaint V a lot but when the Planar setting (not in front of my Amiga and can't remember the correct name) under sys:prefs/gui was introduced one of the softwares that I was able to run and do some drawing in was DPaint V if I choose one of the emulated modes that are not RTG. Didn't try it a lot, did some drawing, loaded a file and so on and no crashes.

Regarding PC-Task it can be a bit unstable but it runs, however DOSBox is a lot easier to use and faster so I wouldn't bother with it other than for nostalgic reasons. However Windows 3.x runs on it and works ok.

EDIT: OK I'm in front of the Amiga and the correct name is "Planar screens on RTG" and it can be found under "Controls". Haven't done any serious drawing since I was a teenager but it was fun just to see it working at least . No AGA modes though when doing this(?).

Last edited by hotrod on 30-Apr-2012 at 10:44 PM.

@amigadave

I use the following system friendly 68K programs with AmigaOS 4.1 Update 4 ...
ARexx
IBrowse OEM version supplied with OS4
Final Writer 97
Personal Paint
TVPaint
Real3D
Imagine 3.0
KingCON
MakeCD
MicroRexx

For Final Writer 97 only, I disabled JIT because I got occasional GR, always indicating "petunia.library".

This means that Final Writer 97 runs without JIT.

All other programs listed above run ok with JIT so far.


Final Writer 97 Startup Options:
Open New Screen
Screen mode: Radeon 7000:640x480 RGB16

I used Screens preferences to define screen properties for Real3D:
Screen mode: Radeon 7000:640x480 ARGB32
GUI Settings: Like Workbench
Palette Settings: Like Workbench

---
redfox
MicroA1 + AmigaOS 4.1 Update 4

Last edited by redfox on 01-May-2012 at 02:10 AM.

@hotrod

I just checked my settings and I had Planar screens on RTG just as you suggest. I think I have at least a couple of versions of DPaint V but since it's getting late here I decided to just re-test the one copied from my A4000 installation. I host a Fakenative 640x480 screenmode at 16 colors. Let me know if you suggest another.

DPaint looked great and I was able to draw, fill with color (which sometimes causes a crash), etc. Really felt great. Then I decided to animated something, which is the main "draw" (haha) for me on this program as well as Brilliance and PPaint. When I set the number of frames I noticed I could not see the number in the requester box. It was black on black, but I set the frame count at 10 anyway.

Then I animated an orange dot moving around the screen by stamping it down on each of the 10 frames by advcaning with the 2 key. I did shift-M for the move requester and noted that all the fields were not readable because they were black on black. I'll try different versions of DPaint tomorrow to see if any show the characters.

When I attempted to play the animation with the 4 key the screen turned all black and the computer was frozen hard. Only a power recycle got me out of that.

This is my Sam440ep-flex @ 733mhz with AOS4.1u4, by the way.

It'd be so cool to get this working.

Meanwhile, on to Lightwave.... This is very baffling as I said, but tonight I ran LightWave Modeler and SnoopDos with the intention of making note of the error log in SnoopDos when Modeler would crash at execting an AREXX script.

But guess what? All the AREXX scripts are again working perfectly -- on both of my Sam440 machines. If past behavior is an indication, they will keep working for many weeks and then just stop working again -- ON BOTH MACHINES.

This makes no freaking sense to me. I can think of any variable that changes, and I sure can't see how it would change on both machines always at the same time.

Is there any possibility that there is something to do with my network that would affect AREXX scripts in Modeler?

So very baffling...

But, hey, at least it's working -- until it stops.

_________________

OK, I really should be in bed but couldn't help a little more DPaint testings. My disappointing findings...

DPaint 4.0... I can read the text in the entry fields and on requester buttons, but when I attempt to add animation frames I get an error dialogue telling me there's not enough memory to animated. Of course this is a 1GB computer.

DPaint 4.5... This is the version that was my go-to version on my A1200 and then A4000 for years. On my Sam, I can read the text in the entry fields and on requester buttons can draw, etc. I can't paint on the individual frames and also use the Move panel to animate brushes. I can then step through the animation frames quickly enough to judge movement by holding down the 2 key to advance the frames. But when I press the 4 key to play the animation the screen goes black and it's a hard lockup. Have to repower to get out of it.

DPaint 5.0... This is the version I had on my A1200 and A4000 also, but it seemed slower and kind of buggy on the classic hardware, so I alway ran 4.5, which was speedy and knew about AGA. On my Sam, the results were the same in the previous post in this thread... can't read text in panels and buttons and can't animated without lockup. When I attempt to stamp down a brush and then use the Move panel to animate it, the brush does not preview or draw. I can manually paint with the brush however I want on the frames.

DPaint 5.2.... This was in a giant collection of Amiga application abandonware that I, ahem, found someplace. Same behavior as 5.0, with the unreadable text and the hard lockup when working with animations, but the improvement is the Move panel will actually draw the brush on the animation frames.

So, this ALMOST works and DPaint sure does look beautiful up on the screen... but it does not work well enough to actually use to make an animation. With things being like this, I'd rather use Personal Paint. but oh how nice it would be to have the DPaint Move panel.

So, anybody had any better luck making an animation with any version of DPaint on AOS4.1?

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Last little note before I turn in for the night.... Don't anybody be discouraged by these dicussions. A lot of old software works great under AOS4. I'm just stressing the problems I've enountered with a couple of programs in hopes of working toward solutions.

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@mbrantley

Don't worry too much about discouraging anyone with these discussions. That is what this thread is for, to discuss successes and problems with running Amiga 680x0 software on OS4.1 through Petunia, instead of E-UAE.

The fact that many of them even run at all is a testament to the programmer(s) who worked on Petunia for OS4.x (and Trance on MorphOS). I think these discussions are very ENCOURAGING, not discouraging.

Thanks for all of your experimenting. I need to do more experimenting myself, but don't get to use my X1000 nearly as much as I want to use it. There never seem to be enough hours in the day (or night), to do all the things I want and need to do. I have already started to write the guide for running LightWave3D on OS4.1, and I will send it to you to review, so you can proof read the parts about running it on a SAM440ep (as I do not own any SAM computers).

I need to think of where to host these guides after I finish writing them, or if I should just upload them to Aminet.

It will take me quite a while to complete each one, as I am easily distracted and jump from one project to another, but this one seems to have a fairly firm grasp on my attention at the moment. LightWave3D has really captured my interest and attention right now, as I have always wanted to learn how to use it proficiently and have been collecting LightWave3D magazines, VHS Tutorial tapes, the LightSpeed magazine on DVD, and instructional books with included CD's full of examples and LightWave3D object files, scene files, texture maps, displacement maps, etc. I even bought the PC & Mac combined versions of LightWave3D version 8 on eBay and had the registration license transferred to me, so I could render faster on my Core2Quad Extreme 3.0GHz PC (which unfortunately is not working at the moment, some kind of video problem).

I sure hope (with the help of you, Mike, and a few others users) I can figure out the rendering problem I am having, so I can run LightWave3D v5.2a as well on my "First Contact" X1000, as you are able to run it on your SAM 440ep. Well, actually I am hoping to run LightWave3D many times better and faster on my X1000 than you can on your SAM 440ep. It should be able to run LightWave3D as well as my 1.5GHz G4 MacMini, or faster, which is really nice, with rendered pictures taking only a few seconds (depending on the complexity of the picture), what would have taken hours on an accelerated Motorola 680x0 original Amiga computer. Like you, I get such a kick out of seeing this old Amiga software running so awesomely fast and looking so good on a 1680x1050 LCD monitor. I can't wait until I get to some of the other programs to see how they look too, and how fast they can run. Until now, I have only heard about other users who have raved how nice it is to run these Amiga 680x0 software applications so fast and on RTG screens.

If I can't make any progress on LightWave3D on my X1000, I will move on to a different program and come back to LightWave3D later. I suspect that the rendering problem might have something to do with the display differences, video card driver differences, between your SAM 440ep and my "First Contact" X1000, but if anyone knowing more about the X1000's video card driver and how it compares to any of the Sam video card drivers, or video card drivers for the original AmigaOne computers, please contact me with any ideas you might have on how to fix the LightWave3D rendering problem on the X1000 computers.

Last edited by amigadave on 01-May-2012 at 07:02 AM.

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@amigadave

After Lightwave "guide" is done, perhaps screamernet setup guide for AMigaNG+heterogenousfriends should be done. That way you would get the 3Ghz+++ rendering speed also on your SAM.

@thread
interesting thread.
I've tried some 68k SW, some works, some do not. For example real3D needs some tricks that I do not master yet, etc...

Last edited by KimmoK on 01-May-2012 at 09:57 AM.

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@mbrantley

I've noticed that the colours are wrong too but I didn't test it any more than that. Could this be changed with sys:prefs/screens?

I used a halfbright mode at 640x512 IIRC.

Regarding the not enough memory error there is a way to limit the chip-ram available to AOS and software and you do that by typing setpatch addchipram and a value which I'm not sure of the format, if it's in MB then it would be 2 for 2MB but I'm not sure if it's bytes, KB or MB. Perhaps this could make it work. You just add this to your startup-sequence script in sys:s/ and it'll limit the amount of chip-ram.

Last edited by hotrod on 01-May-2012 at 12:07 PM.
Last edited by hotrod on 01-May-2012 at 11:56 AM.
Last edited by hotrod on 01-May-2012 at 11:27 AM.

@KimmoK

Real3D: http://www.amigans.net/modules/news/article.php?storyid=419#comment3441
At least here Real3D works and renders with OS4.1 on Sam and Peg2.

_________________
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@amigadave & mbrantley

Quote:

My first Amiga 680x0 software program that I have attempted to install on OS4.1.5 on my X1000 is LightWave3D v5.2a. I have had some success in setting up ModePro to create the proper screen resolution to match the full 1680x1050 screen size for my 20" widescreen LCD monitor and both Modeler and Layout look and run well (except for the Arexx macros in Modeler). I have not been able to set up Rendering of anything yet, so I am wondering if this has something to do with the different video card and driver than the SAM 440ep that Mike Brantley has, as his system Renders LightWave3D scene frames without any problems.

There are many different versions of lightwave and they may behave differently with mode promotion. Assuming you have the same buttons on layout that I do, could you please do the following test:

(1)Start Lightwave
(2)Select "surfaces" button
(3)Click "surface color" (for use with the sliders to adjust surface color)

Does a band showing this color appear at bottom of screen?
Does the band change colors as you move the sliders?

#6

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@amigadave

I think an other problem whit 68k programs and games are this that wait for vertical blanking by pooling the register in closed loop.

Some color problem might be caused by some programs that write to the screens bitmap, the screens bitmap is little endien format, if it was some how possible to fake a screen so that it writes into a window bitmap on the screen then the color problems should go away.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 03-May-2012 at 11:48 AM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 01-May-2012 at 01:04 PM.

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@NutsAboutAmiga
Quote:

You should be extremely careful when installing 68k software; the installers might easily replace system libraries or MUI classes, at least take a backup before you do, it might be smart to run some dir compare tool after you have installed something just in case.

That's even true for OS4 software. Years ago I posted a warning that installing svgtools from the OS4Depot archive could overwrite your C:fc-cache command. Some installers try to check for the existance of a file and the version before replacing it but that doesn't necessarily help when dozens of files (like fc-cache) on the system partition don't even have a version number. Checking file dates might not help if you have restored your system partition from a backup and didn't preserve the original dates. It's a sad state of affairs that you can't really trust installers but that seems to be the reality.

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SAM Flex 800MZ with 1GB memory & OS4.1u4

Some of my successes -- and indeed some of my failures -- with this stuff might be that I don't have too many original floppies anymore and thus not many 68K installers. I just keep copying my old stuff from computer to computer over the decades. I came closest to losing all my Amiga stuff during the early years of the new century, when I turned away from Amigaland for a long time and all my 68K-era software and data existed only on a single, failing hard drive.

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@mbrantley

Yeah, I understand what you are saying about just copying software to your NG Amiga, instead of using an installer, but for most people downloading software from Aminet, or even getting complete software that has been compressed with LHA, or another compression method, they might still have an installer script to ignore, and would need to know how you, or I, or someone else, got the software installed on our systems.

@Number6,

I am using LightWave3D v5.2a, if that helps give you a better idea of which one I am trying to get working on my X1000. I did not work on any of this Tuesday, but will try to get some more done on Wednesday.

@everyone else,

More lists of software that OS4.x, or MorphOS2.x users are running without E-UAE and tips on how to get certain software titles working, if they need adjustments to let them run properly will greatly be appreciated.

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@Deniil715

I haven't been able to connect to Chris Handley's web site, home of Portable E and his others tools, in the past few days. Anyone else having this problem?

Scott

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@amigadave

A few games I can think of off the top of my head that seem to work great:

Megaball 3
Payback - demo
Miner version 6
Scott Adams Adventures
HB Monopoly
WBSteroids
MUI Mines
Mahjongg Tiles
Lazy Mines
Pairs NG
Hexamine
Slider


Most can be found on Aminet.
Have fun!

Scott

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@amigadave

I am Running

o Wordworth 7.

Installed from CD onto my AOne (IIRC long time ago) then transfered in situ on hard disk to my SAM

Has the update from Aminet installed on top.

Requires PICASSO=TRUE in the main iocn tooltypes.

Another subtlety is that when using EPS images created from jpegs etc via ImageFX sometimes WW7 will lockup when creating the screen preview, after alot of testing to work out when this did and idn't hapen I found that it only happened from the recently opened list and never if loaded via the file requester.

Cutting and pasting of abject is patchy / buggy but it was under 68k too IIRC

o TurbCalc 3.5

Works well. DSI if a command searches the sheet for text. The DSI is ignorable but slows sheets athat need it down, So I disable autocalculate, and manually recalaculate when I've made the modifications I need.

o ImageFX 4.5

Works very well if a bit buggey here and there, worst bug is with the text tool, which can be worked arriund by deleteing the ENV varaiables it creates in ENV:ImageFX4

o ARexx

System component works very well with out any issues.

o PPaint 7.1

Works well.

o MakeCD

Works well requires updated wizard.library to prevent GUI lockups.

o TurboPrint

Works well in combination with my hp815 printer. Since 4.1update 2 it emits a warning about hanging forbid after using via ghostscript.

I think that's about it.

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@mbrantley

Regarding DPaint, now that you have set the "Planar screens on RTG" option, have you tried to run Blitzen again before launching any version of DPaint? Might make a difference now.

Varthall

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