@pavlor

that makes the forum more entertaining

@pavlor
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You compare Hyperion with Commodore?

No. I'm comparing the time they had available.

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And longtime MorphOS user.

And a proud one, for a reason. Especially when you consider MorphOS stands alone, w/o hijacking the name.

BTW, I'm familiar with OS4, even developed for it. Still not impressed.

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@Chain-Q
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BTW, I'm familiar with OS4, even developed for it. Still not impressed.

Not even a little bit? Bummer

@Phantom

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AROS has more devs than normal users.

This may be true but it seems Hyperion hasn't had any devs of late.


On the note of insolvency. I am curious if the license included any form of payment(I'm sure if it did no payments were made). Would that make A. Inc a creditor?

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@terminills

No payments requirements in September 30 2009 Settlement Agreement. And yes, there is bancruptcy clause, but only concerning Amiga.Inc.

@Phantom

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Phantom wrote: AROS has more devs than normal users.

That's wrong. Every AROS user has his personal developer. Soon is feeding time.

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@pavlor

I know what the settlement says. I keep a copy handy. It does not specifically state one way or another about payments. :P

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@pavlor

Lets look at this list then.

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2005: Warp3D drivers for Radeon R200 cards (Update5)

I had no support for 3D on my SAM460. So this changed fizzled out to nothing.

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2006: Petunia 68k JIT, support for screen dragging (Update6); new memory system with SLAB allocator, 32 bit icons (Final Update)

Better emulation - Means nothing to anyone wanting to run OS4 software. Presumably UAE was ported to OS4 before this?
Screen dragging - Screens on non OCS/ECS/AGA chipsets are pointless. But I guess for nostalgia...
Better memory allocator - Ok, this is a real OS improvement. I assume this was to reduce memory fragmentation.
Pretty icons - Woop, woop.

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2007: Shared Objects, Python (July 2007 Update)

Shared Objects - Now this is very interesting. I was dismayed when I found out that OS4 had "shared" objects. First of all, they are not shared. Secondly, and most important, they are not even slightly "Amigaish". Instead they are a cheap shot to try to make up for dev resources by making AmigaOS4 a "POSIX-ish thing". Massive bad idea IMO, might even be called a betrayal.
Python - Is this just a port or is it integrated like AREXX was? If it was integrated (more a perl guy myself) then I'll give it some points.

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2008: Virtual memory, 64bit DOS, compositing, Cairo (4.1)

VM and 64bit DOS - Genuine OS improvements, super. Never quite got VM on Amiga though. If you needed paging, I dread to think what your doing with the computer.
Compositing - I covered that one. :)

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2010: new compositing effects - fading and drop shadows, notifications, DDC support, AppDir: (4.1 Update1)

Some nice "fluffy" things here. Though I dunno what DDC is.

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2011: USB2.0 (4.1 Update3), improved UAE integration (4.1 Update4)

USB2 - Cripes, I didn't know it took that long. Better late then never though.
Better UAE - I'm sorry but it still sucked hard when I tried it on my SAM460.

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2012: Auto-update of system components (4.1 Update6)

Updates - Yes I'll agree that this was nice. It's questionable wether this is a OS feature though.

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2013: HD Audio (AmiUpdates)

This is just driver tweaks.

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2014: new filesystem API (AmiUpdates); support for more than 2 GB RAM, new graphics library, improved console (4.1 Final Edition)

Banked memory - Like something from the early 80s to try to say the system could use more then 2GB. Totally cheap shot. Do any programs use this?
Tabbed console - Finally. The Shell is one of the things that dismayed me the most with my Sam460 and 4.1U6 - it was *identical* to what I'd used *20 years earlier*, even down to having to hack in KingCON (or whatever it's called).

So, no I don't think that's a lot to show for 11 years of effort. Perhaps comparable to the change from OS2.0 to OS3.1 but that's it. And remember, many many of those things mentioned weren't even paid for by Hyperion.

Pavlor, I'm someone who has used OS4, and OS1.3 to OS3.1 before that. I love my old Amigas, like no computer I've owned before *or since*. But to say OS4 has progressed well under Hyperions stewardship is a joke. It's like if Apple had tarted up OS9 with new icons for the last 12 years, instead of releasing OS X...

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@terminills

Royalty free license for Hyperion. I expect no payments there. Still, your question is interesting... Amiga.Inc strikes back!

@Aslak3

You need your own topic with this long list of complains

DDC is very handy.

So this was a bit of a surprise, nice that it looks to be false, still wasn't too worried, Amiga survived Commodore, Escom, Gateway and Amiga inc all going bankrupt, I'm sure the community would of survived this one if it happened. As long as someone is not going to physically breakdown my door and smash up my Amiga collection I will still get to enjoy my Amiga's for a long time, that include OS4.1, even if all development stopped by absolutely everyone, there still a ton of stuff I got to play with and enjoy on Os4.

If anything the community is pretty much covered for all possibility thanks to project like MorphOS, Aros, WinUAE etc we are free from what ever happens to the "official" route.

But still here to OS4 and Hyperion for continuing, just wondering however if this did happen would Os4 ownership default back to Amiga Inc?

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@Aslak3

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I had no support for 3D on my SAM460. So this changed fizzled out to nothing.

You can use Radeon9250 in PCI slot.

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Better emulation - Means nothing to anyone wanting to run OS4 software. Presumably UAE was ported to OS4 before this?

You were (or still are OS4 user) and you don´t get difference between Petunia and UAE?
Most OS friendly 68k applications are able to run on OS4 like on OS3 (68k applications can even use PowerPC libraries and PowerPC applications 68k libraries). Until 4.0preU6, there was built-in interpretative 68k emulation with such features, Petunia added speed (cca 1/5 of native performance). Applications like TvPaint, PPaint, Arteffect, Cinema4D or even IBrowse beneffit from it.

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Screen dragging - Screens on non OCS/ECS/AGA chipsets are pointless. But I guess for nostalgia...

Screen dragging is one of defining features of Amiga. So yes nostalgia.

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Better memory allocator - Ok, this is a real OS improvement. I assume this was to reduce memory fragmentation.

Exactly. It was also basis for future virtual memory implementation.

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Pretty icons - Woop, woop.

Change from 8bit paletted icons to 32 bit is at least visible.

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Never quite got VM on Amiga though. If you needed paging, I dread to think what your doing with the computer.

Although VM on OS4 is not robust, I was able to play Baldurs Gate games on my "Classic" setup (128 MB Fast RAM limitation).

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Though I dunno what DDC is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Display_Data_Channel

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Better UAE - I'm sorry but it still sucked hard when I tried it on my SAM460.

I didn´t wrote only "better UAE", but better UAE integration - ability to run old games (ADF, WHDLoad installed or binaries) is great in my point of view. A500 games should run fine on your setup with right settings.

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Updates - Yes I'll agree that this was nice. It's questionable wether this is a OS feature though.

Nice indeed. It is for OS updates via 3rd party application installed in OS by default. Well, OS feature I think.

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This is just driver tweaks.

32 bit audio - first time on AmigaOS (not that I hear difference to 16 bit).

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Banked memory - Like something from the early 80s to try to say the system could use more then 2GB. Totally cheap shot. Do any programs use this?

Still better than nothing. No public SDK for FE yet, so none.

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Tabbed console - Finally. The Shell is one of the things that dismayed me the most with my Sam460 and 4.1U6 - it was *identical* to what I'd used *20 years earlier*, even down to having to hack in KingCON (or whatever it's called).

One of nice updates I like in FE.

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So, no I don't think that's a lot to show for 11 years of effort.

It is clear I have opposite view.

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Perhaps comparable to the change from OS2.0 to OS3.1 but that's it.

Localisation
8 bit colour support (including chunky GFX)
8 colour icons
CD-ROM support
Datatypes
Improved early boot menu
Impoved FFS (DC)

Anything more?

@amigang

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just wondering however if this did happen would Os4 ownership default back to Amiga Inc?

No. It would be probably sold to best bid to cover debts and costs.

@Hyperionmp

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Hyperion Entertainment Directors

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However, Hyperion has several directors and nobody is irreplaceable or always available. It is a "corporate" account for that simple reason. It may even be that the directors are not available to post some information and ask that somebody of the AmigaOS development team posts the information using this account.

Source

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=Ben Hermans Director Legal

Source

Is this not of sufficient magnitude to ask that the person using the Hyperionmp account today sign his posts?
Otherwise, we have to take the word that it could be anyone from the dev team, according to the above.

#6

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@pavlor

Quote:

Quote: I had no support for 3D on my SAM460. So this changed fizzled out to nothing. You can use Radeon9250 in PCI slot.

No doubt. However 3D support fizzled out to nothing ie. no attempt made to keep up with hardware improvements.

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You were (or still are OS4 user) ...

Just to clear that up - I bought a SAM460 in September 2013, and sold it about a year later. The computer has a new home in Poland last I heard. Still glad I bought it, even though I sold for about 300 pounds less then I paid. It was an interesting experience triggered by a massive bout of nostalgia.

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... and you don´t get difference between Petunia and UAE?

So I would class UEA as being an application, so not part of the OS.

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Most OS friendly 68k applications are able to run on OS4 like on OS3 (68k applications can even use PowerPC libraries and PowerPC applications 68k libraries). Until 4.0preU6, there was built-in interpretative 68k emulation with such features, Petunia added speed (cca 1/5 of native performance). Applications like TvPaint, PPaint, Arteffect, Cinema4D or even IBrowse beneffit from it.

I tried about 10-15 68K OS-friendly programs, hoping to run them "inline" with the PPC OS and programs. Few of them worked well. Some worked ok. Quite of a few of them bombed the OS. Perhaps I was just unlucky.

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Display_Data_Channel

Ah, ok. I just assumed this kind of thing was required when you support DVI/HDMI etc.

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I didn´t wrote only "better UAE", but better UAE integration - ability to run old games (ADF, WHDLoad installed or binaries) is great in my point of view. A500 games should run fine on your setup with right settings.

Right. Again, sad to report that only some games worked from my old ADF collection. And sound emulation (even with a decent soundcard installed instead of the broken onboard sound) was pretty poor.

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Nice indeed. It is for OS updates via 3rd party application installed in OS by default. Well, OS feature I think.

Maybe it is. OS is a blurry term.

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32 bit audio - first time on AmigaOS (not that I hear difference to 16 bit).

Me neither. ;)

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Still better than nothing. No public SDK for FE yet, so none.

So not really "released" then.

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One of nice updates I like in FE.

But *twenty* years to get a console that isn't dreadful by contemporary standards?

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It is clear I have opposite view.

And that's cool. :)

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Localisation 8 bit colour support (including chunky GFX) 8 colour icons CD-ROM support Datatypes Improved early boot menu Impoved FFS (DC) Anything more?

Background pictures instead of just patterns
CrossDOS (or was that 2.0?)
Better colour scheme. :)
Datatypes

I listed datatypes again just because they are such an awesome concept which modern OSs haven't implemented.

(I never actually used a OS2 system, sadly. Never had the pleasure.)

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If hyperion is bankrupt what is happened i dont yet get point.

@Vanhapolle

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If hyperion is bankrupt what is happened i dont yet get point.

Hyperion is company behind AmigaOS 4 and AmigaOne.

@Vanhapolle

It is an interesting question, since Hyperion licenses IP from Amiga Inc and only owns parts of Amiga OS4(for instance, kernel is owned by the Frieden brothers).

Oh, well... there are still MorphOS, AROS, ARIX, AEROS...

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@pavlor

I knowed AmigaOS 4 part but point is what happened i mean someonesays they are not bankrupt in this thread if i understanded correct but something else is happened.

@Hyperionmp

Quote:

Hyperionmp wrote: @OlafS25 The quote a famous writer: "the news of our demise is greatly exaggerated" ;) This is the result of an unfortunate administrative mishap by a third party and is in the process of being addressed/cleared up. This may take a while as everything takes a while in Belgium whilst it comes to administrative and judicial matters. Those dancing on our grave, sorry guys, no party here ;) Hyperion Entertainment Directors

Thanks for clearing that up.

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