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   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  Hyperion Entertainment is not bankrupt
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QuBe 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 9-Apr-2015 8:13:22
#1401 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Dec-2006
Posts: 1075
From: Dunes of Uridia

@All

I typically shy away from "controversial topics" - life is complex, and very subjective, and therefore there will be agreements and disagreements on both sides, across a broad range of opinions expressed.

Respecting each others opinions is vitally important in conjuring up a safe, interesting, intellectual market place of opinions, each of which has its place, and can be of benefit to the persons reading them.

I would like to add my opinion.

I think the threads' title, "Hyperion Entertainment Bankrupt?" is rather depressing to look at.

The community has had to face multiple busts over the Amigas long history, and seeing this title every time I view the board brings back bad memories.

I think the community should try to find positivity where possible, it's the little that is left (your enthusiasm for the platform), and the companies that currently support Amiga. Let's keep it positive by steering away from titles that remind us of our past, even though it does form part of our historic reality, sadly.

I agree that it may be a good point to close this thread, but not stop interesting and intellectually minded debates that keep community members engaged, thinking and being creative with their Amiga's

Q!

Last edited by QuBe on 09-Apr-2015 at 08:17 AM.
Last edited by QuBe on 09-Apr-2015 at 08:15 AM.
Last edited by QuBe on 09-Apr-2015 at 08:15 AM.

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bison 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 9-Apr-2015 15:23:42
#1402 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 18-Dec-2007
Posts: 2112
From: N-Space

@QuBe

Quote:
I agree that it may be a good point to close this thread,

Hold on there, we have 98 more posts to go.

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"Unix is supposed to fix that." -- Jay Miner

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sundown 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 9-Apr-2015 16:17:34
#1403 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Aug-2003
Posts: 5120
From: Right here...

@OlafS25

You need to edit the thread title.

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Hate tends to make you look stupid...

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pavlor 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 9-Apr-2015 18:14:25
#1404 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@sundown

Quote:
You need to edit the thread title.


And destroy our troll infested thread?

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sundown 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 9-Apr-2015 19:54:29
#1405 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Aug-2003
Posts: 5120
From: Right here...

@pavlor

Quote:
And destroy our troll infested thread?

No worries, with just having "Hyperion Entertainment" in the topic, it remains a troll magnet.

_________________
Hate tends to make you look stupid...

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resle 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 0:04:24
#1406 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 28-Nov-2005
Posts: 500
From: shanghai

@sundown

Quote:

sundown wrote:
@pavlor

Quote:
And destroy our troll infested thread?

No worries, with just having "Hyperion Entertainment" in the topic, it remains a troll magnet.


That would be the right title. In this thread Hyperion generated more Entertainment than it ever did, finally becoming true to the name it bears.

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realize 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 0:36:31
#1407 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Apr-2003
Posts: 1797
From: nyc

@resle

Im still waiting for Mr Hermans to answer my post.. but i guess he just posts to "Troll" or write useless posts. its not personal he seems a nice enough guy but many of us are really tired of the bs. I know one thing if it was any other company you guys would have been fed up years ago but i guess fanboyism never dies.

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agami 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 2:37:18
#1408 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1637
From: Melbourne, Australia

How many of you are familiar with Information Theory? Or Graph Theory?

I think the title is apt as it is a question and not a declaration. And there are a lot more demoralising things occurring in the Amiga business and user community than this title.

Now, back to my question. If you have an understanding of one or both of those theories and their field uses, then you would see that Hyperion Entertainment is indeed bankrupt.

In the strictest sense they are at present time not financially bankrupt. But as far as I can see they are organisationally bankrupt, socially bankrupt, and perhaps even ethically bankrupt.

Is that intellectual enough for this thread?

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sundown 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 5:32:15
#1409 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Aug-2003
Posts: 5120
From: Right here...

@realize

Quote:
Im still waiting for Mr Hermans to answer my post

Why? We all lie, no one will ever say anything trolls will believe, any info given would only be used to start another troll thread, so best to say NOTHING.

Quote:
but i guess fanboyism never dies.

So sick of ppl with their head up theit arse using that label on others that think different.

Last edited by sundown on 10-Apr-2015 at 05:33 AM.

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QuBe 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 6:16:43
#1410 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Dec-2006
Posts: 1075
From: Dunes of Uridia

@bison

Haha... Very good Bison... it arose my colleagues around when I burst out in laughter...

Q!

"i am home"

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sundown 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 6:17:26
#1411 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Aug-2003
Posts: 5120
From: Right here...

@agami

Quote:
In the strictest sense they are at present time not financially bankrupt. But as far as I can see they are organisationally bankrupt, socially bankrupt, and perhaps even ethically bankrupt.

I can say with some authority, that description fits every company I've worked for in my life.

_________________
Hate tends to make you look stupid...

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agami 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 6:23:19
#1412 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1637
From: Melbourne, Australia

@sundown

Quote:
Why? We all lie, no one will ever say anything trolls will believe, any info given would only be used to start another troll thread, so best to say NOTHING.


Oh, did da widdle twolls huwt youw feewings

So because of a handful of trolls the rest of us don't deserve the truth?? If this is what you mean by "thinking different" then there is a different label for it.

And a simple wave of the hand with the accompanying "these are not the droids you are looking for" does not work on all of us.

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All the way, with 68k

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sundown 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 6:24:46
#1413 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Aug-2003
Posts: 5120
From: Right here...

@resle

Quote:
That would be the right title.

The title was changed from a question to a fact for the front page only.

Thanks OlafS25

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agami 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 6:30:02
#1414 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1637
From: Melbourne, Australia

@sundown

Should that be an excuse to keep doing it? And specifically amidst the peers who aren't as bankrupt on as many fronts.

I too have worked for many that fit that description and some that were even worse. But at the same time I have had the unique privilege to work for an organisation that isn't any of those things.

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sundown 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 6:32:14
#1415 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Aug-2003
Posts: 5120
From: Right here...

@agami

Quote:
Oh, did da widdle twolls huwt youw feewings

So because of a handful of trolls the rest of us don't deserve the truth?? If this is what you mean by "thinking different"

Tells me your head is in the same place, feel better, I do.

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agami 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 6:48:27
#1416 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1637
From: Melbourne, Australia

@sundown

As tiresome as trolls can be, using the trolls as an excuse for lack of communication is equally tiresome.

Let's for now dismiss the notion of truth in communication. What you are practically saying is that you're damned if you do, and you're damned if you don't, so you may as well not. This is not the only logical conclusion to an 'all things being equal' preposition. It's just as logical to go the other way since you're damned either way.

Truth and facts are not interchangeable. Providing a simple fact does not provide truth. One can possess many facts and lie, and vice versa. And for the most part, any perceived truth in a communication is found somewhere between what is said and what is not said (information theory). So by saying very little one practically rings the bell for trolls.

Last edited by agami on 10-Apr-2015 at 06:51 AM.
Last edited by agami on 10-Apr-2015 at 06:50 AM.
Last edited by agami on 10-Apr-2015 at 06:49 AM.

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OlafS25 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 8:38:42
#1417 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 6321
From: Unknown

@sundown

you are welcome

Last edited by OlafS25 on 10-Apr-2015 at 08:59 AM.

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OlafS25 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 8:51:28
#1418 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 6321
From: Unknown

@agami

bankruptcy is a financial and legal issue and in that sense they are certainly not (if I understand it right they now officially never were). The court checked numbers, what is on deposit, what income do they have, they are not responsible to check the business model and if it has future or not (something a judge cannot check anyway), you can be profitable if you are serving even a small market. The concept of developing a OS for rare expensive hardware without obvious advantages is often discussed and there will never be agreement to all. People obviously decide themselves for buying the hardware despite knowing the facts and all (with perhaps some exceptions) know that is a small hobby market and propably only few outside will even think about buying the expensive hardware. So they are basically satisfying the small remaining community. Is that a future proof concept? For me not but is the decision of the AmigaOS user and interested people. The known alternatives are there and as long as there is no downtalking and bashing against other camps and even spreading obviously wrong informations I am fine with it. Sometimes discussions are very difficult because many are only using emotions and no facts but as long facts are used and discussions stay politely I have no problem.

@thread

To the "troll" discussion (even mentioned on the blog of a known person recently). I have a little problem with it because often it is used for everyone else not sharing the same view (and even expressing that). I understand that it is sometimes annoying if people appear in a thread and "spoil the fun" but what I would like to know is how people define "Troll". Is it already trolling if you (as a example) run benchmarks on different hardware and post the results and these are much faster? I think people from outside will always compare it with their hardware, the "emotions" are mostly not relevant to them. If these people read threads where people cheer certain things and know that their existing hardware is much better they will not take the community serious. "Trolls" (like some call it) are pointing to the facts. Or we do not compare anymore and retreat on our own sites and cheer there any little progress we have. Is that better? I do not know.

Example from other thread:

http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=40099&forum=32&start=20&viewmode=flat&order=0

gregthecanuck

"Riiiiiiight.... PS2 = 300MHz CPU, 148MHz GPU, 32MB RAM, ...

I suggest you owe A-Eon an apology for this ridiculous comment.

They are investing heavily in hardware and software. Their choices in CPU are entirely logical taking into account what is available on the market.

Trevor deserves major kudos for investing heavily into the Amiga marketplace. I don't think he will be seeing a profit anytime soon - he is taking a long-term view on things which is commendable.

Back to your cave, troll."

If I say it is not "long-term view" to try to make expensive PPC custom hardware when there are much cheaper and better X86/X64 or ARM based options and investing the money in a port to another ISA would have been a better decision would that qualify me as "troll" even though propably 99,99999% of people will say that too?

And even if gregthecanuck disagrees then why not answering with facts showing that the X... models are much better than PS2. I know that collecting facts and presenting them makes much more work than just reacting like this but that would make discussions less harsh and at the end annoy the "real trolls" because people that just are interested in annoying others are happy about reactions like this.

Last edited by OlafS25 on 10-Apr-2015 at 09:24 AM.
Last edited by OlafS25 on 10-Apr-2015 at 09:20 AM.
Last edited by OlafS25 on 10-Apr-2015 at 09:19 AM.
Last edited by OlafS25 on 10-Apr-2015 at 09:18 AM.
Last edited by OlafS25 on 10-Apr-2015 at 09:09 AM.
Last edited by OlafS25 on 10-Apr-2015 at 09:08 AM.

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agami 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 9:27:22
#1419 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1637
From: Melbourne, Australia

@OlafS25

I too am generally interested in friendly and constructive discourse. I am partial to the occasional jab, but I try to do that in the spirit of fun and I try to be a good sport about it. There really is no need to resort to name-calling and deliberate inflammatory insults.

I never consider any of the people to be a fool because they put down an objectively very high some of money to obtain what can only be described as a beta product. But as a student of sociology and a naturally curious person I can't restrain my fascination with the way individuals choose to talk about their purchasing choices.

How one spends their money is up to them, they really don't need to explain themselves to anyone even if they are asked nicely, but going on for 3-4 years now, on this and other Amiga forums, there is an interesting collection of X1000 apologists. I find it fascinating is all. It tends to bring out the epistemologist in me, and this is after all a place where people congregate to discuss the Amiga and related topics.

On the other topic; For me a troll is someone who's writing is intended to entice a negative reaction. They are not participating to further the conversation but rather to play a stupid game and boost their own ego. Sometimes they may use facts, they may be passive-aggressive, and at other times they can be outright aggressive. That's how I see it.

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Boot_WB 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 10-Apr-2015 9:57:37
#1420 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Feb-2006
Posts: 1134
From: Kingston upon Hull, UK

@TrevorDick

Quote:

TrevorDick wrote:

TrevorD

"Supporting all Amiga-inspired flavours"



Just wanted to clarify that I was not implying anything about individuals, and I have a great deal of respect for both you and A-Eon as seperate entities.

I'm also extremely relieved on your (both personally and with A-Eon hat on) behalf that there is a way forward with AmigaOS in the immediate future.

Best regards

Rich

_________________
Troll - n., A disenfranchised former potential customer who remains interested enough to stay informed and express critical opinions.
opp., the vast majority who voted silently with their feet.

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