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   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  Hyperion Entertainment is not bankrupt
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cdimauro 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 18:31:53
#741 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Oct-2012
Posts: 1832
From: Germany

@paolone

Quote:

paolone wrote:
@Robert

Quote:

Why do you want to lock a thread that other people are enjoying?
Bit Nazi like, isn't it?
We all know that's what Hitler would have done too.


Hi. Don't nominate Hitler's name here, or you'll be reported (like just happened to me) for indecency.

There are people, here, with very bad issues about text comprehension and freedom of speech.

kind regards


The same happened to me. The "funny" thing is that there's nothing on the TOS regarding this. And I still fail to see how it's possible to configure it as "indecency" (at least according to the Collins).

Only Amiga makes it possible...


@Massi

Quote:

Massi wrote:
@cdimauro

Quote:
The Javascript test stresses a lot the single core/thread performance of a processor. It's a good test of the "general purpose" computing abilities of a system.

Since web browsers are really heavy beasts, big name firms have put lots of engineers on the task, I am pretty sure dedicated hardware and software solutions have been developed for speed (smartphones, tablets).
I guess heavy computations are done via dedicated hardware, the same way the graphics are handled by the GPU.

That's not the case, since the latest web browsers available for post-Amiga o.ses use the same web engines developed by the big IT names. So they "inherit" for free the effort that such companies make for developing them, included possible accelerations.

Here I'm talking about Javascript interpretation & acceleration, which is what we are talking about.
Quote:
Does it make sense benchmarking different web browsers running on different operating systems based on different hardware? Has the result any accurate valency?

It depends on what do you want to achieve. To measure something you have to ideally change only one variable. So, to measure a new CPU you have to keep ALL the rest the same (memory, chipset, GPU, and o.s.) and compare the results which came from the same system but running with an old CPU.

Unfortunately it's not always possible, because at least the chipset usually changes (because it's strictly connected to the CPU). Other times memory changes as well (because, for example, the old CPU uses only old memories). And the o.s. can change as well (because only some o.s. is ported to such CPU).

But we can make a different measure here, and focus on what a certain class of users will get on their hands, using a particular software (which is the "constant" variable: the same for all tests). What counts can be the performance of a whole system, o.s. included, running a certain application.

That's what makes sense test, IMO.
Quote:
From my side, OS4, the available browsers are often "1 man" work, meaning that there is certainly much room for improvements. This also shows the great ability of OS4 developers.

ExiE and Boot_WB already answered here, but take also a look at Timberwolf, which is still unfinished.
Quote:
Thus I believe on web browsers OS4 systems could perform much better than they actually do.

That can happen for anything for any o.s..

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Massi 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 18:52:15
#742 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 2-Feb-2011
Posts: 516
From: Rome, Italy

@cdimauro

If a system is slower than another one at the JavaScript browser test case, it doesn' t necessarily mean that it has overall worse performances.

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cdimauro 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 19:25:32
#743 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Oct-2012
Posts: 1832
From: Germany

@Massi: as I already stated, the Javascript test is a good one to stress the CPU for "general purpose" computation.

Another useful test can be Blender to stress the SIMD unit.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 19:28:23
#744 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10736
From: Norway

@cdimauro

Quote:
good one to stress the CPU for "general purpose" computation.


Yes but what if we added JIT to JavaScript in the browser and we got 10x the speed we have now, does that mean that PA5T has become 10x faster over night?

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-Mar-2015 at 07:30 PM.

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cdimauro 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 19:53:31
#745 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Oct-2012
Posts: 1832
From: Germany

@NutsAboutAmiga: I haven't talked about an absolute performance measure. I've clearly talked about stressing the CPU for "general purpose" computation.

It means that, once you have a JIT, you can run the same browser on all hardware & o.ses platforms and look at the results to see the tendency of each system.

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broadblues 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 19:56:56
#746 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 20-Jul-2004
Posts: 4132
From: Portsmouth England

@cdimauro

Quote:

Another useful test can be Blender to stress the SIMD unit.


Apart from ffmpeg modue blender doesn't not do SIMD, certainly not altivec.

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cdimauro 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 20:07:01
#747 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Oct-2012
Posts: 1832
From: Germany

@broadblues. I see these:
http://yellowblue.free.fr/yiki/doku.php/en:dev:blender:start
"2012-02-25 Blender 2.62 (Altivec only)
[...]
Raytrace: Altivec support added."

https://github.com/dfelinto/blender-git/tree/master/extern/Eigen3/Eigen/src/Core/arch/AltiVec

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 20:18:23
#748 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10736
From: Norway

@cdimauro

That might well be, but AltiVec is not some thing that is automatically used, you need to optimize and compile Blender with that to enable it, so if broadblues says that has not been done, than he is right.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-Mar-2015 at 11:27 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-Mar-2015 at 08:29 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-Mar-2015 at 08:19 PM.

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cdimauro 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 20:25:21
#749 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Oct-2012
Posts: 1832
From: Germany

@NutsAboutAmiga: it seems that Blender can be compiled for Altivec, at least for MorphOS.

So the problem is only for OS4? Just to understand.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 20:33:08
#750 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10736
From: Norway

@cdimauro

We do not know what they have done or have not done on MorphOS, that make it also hard to know way things are the way they are.

When I updated Mplayer I used a cgx_wpa from MorphOS Mplayer, just as a foundation for my work (To speed up development), but as it turned out they used RGB and it was running slow on my system, so switched to ARGB and got a major speed up. I do not know if RGB is ideal on MorphOS or not, but differences between the two operating systems can play a big part in speed differences.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-Mar-2015 at 09:00 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-Mar-2015 at 08:36 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-Mar-2015 at 08:35 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-Mar-2015 at 08:33 PM.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 23:39:47
#751 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10736
From: Norway

x

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-Mar-2015 at 11:57 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 04-Mar-2015 at 11:52 PM.

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broadblues 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 23:40:06
#752 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 20-Jul-2004
Posts: 4132
From: Portsmouth England

@cdimauro

You blurted

Quote:

@NutsAboutAmiga: it seems that Blender can be compiled for Altivec, at least for MorphOS.

So the problem is only for OS4? Just to understand.


because you failed to comprehend

Quote:


Apart from ffmpeg module blender doesn't not do SIMD, certainly not altivec.


The os 4 build of blender comes witha seperate altivec enabled libbffmpeg.so which can be swapped in.

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broadblues 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 23:41:35
#753 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 20-Jul-2004
Posts: 4132
From: Portsmouth England

@NutsAboutAmiga

Er... see above.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 4-Mar-2015 23:58:30
#754 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10736
From: Norway

@broadblues

Deleted my comment as your answer is more correct.

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cdimauro 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 5-Mar-2015 6:15:45
#755 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Oct-2012
Posts: 1832
From: Germany

@broadblues

Quote:

broadblues wrote:
@cdimauro

You blurted

Quote:

@NutsAboutAmiga: it seems that Blender can be compiled for Altivec, at least for MorphOS.

So the problem is only for OS4? Just to understand.


because you failed to comprehend

Quote:


Apart from ffmpeg module blender doesn't not do SIMD, certainly not altivec.


The os 4 build of blender comes witha seperate altivec enabled libbffmpeg.so which can be swapped in.


I know, you already reported it. But haven't you seen this:

"2012-02-25 Blender 2.62 (Altivec only)
[...]
Raytrace: Altivec support added."

?

Raytrace != libbffmpeg

As I already stated, it seems that Blender supports Altivec. And there are a couple of files on Blender (look at the link at the repository) to let use Altivec. Do you understand it now?

Whereas OS4 is only limited to the libbffmpeg part, as you reported.

@NutsAboutAmiga: the RGB vs RGBA issues are another problem.

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Massi 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 5-Mar-2015 9:45:24
#756 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 2-Feb-2011
Posts: 516
From: Rome, Italy

@cdimauro post #681

1)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNbazlHmbvo
Time 59:07

It seems you have only contributed to Fightin' Spirit with "some very good ideas" as mentioned by Dario Merola the game programmer, see the game ending titles. No credited involvment in the programming (as you stated before post #669).

2)

Does any public footprint of USA Racing exist?

===

You are "inside Intel" ... now I get your attitude ... am I wrong?

Last edited by Massi on 05-Mar-2015 at 03:13 PM.
Last edited by Massi on 05-Mar-2015 at 09:48 AM.

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broadblues 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 5-Mar-2015 12:25:25
#757 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 20-Jul-2004
Posts: 4132
From: Portsmouth England

@cdimauro

Looking at the link and also googling it appears that there is one or two files in an extern library related to vector maths that now use altivec, that lib isn't used in the 2.48/9 AmigaOS 4 version.

Apologies if I was a bit abrubt in the earlier post, too easy to get drawn into the general conflict ethos of this thread.

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paolone 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 5-Mar-2015 15:00:34
#758 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 24-Sep-2007
Posts: 932
From: Unknown

Just to keep this topic a little focused on its title's subject...

Today is March 5th so the court should have already ruled something about Hyperion's claims.

Any news about this?

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 5-Mar-2015 15:39:34
#759 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10736
From: Norway

@cdimauro

Quote:
@NutsAboutAmiga: the RGB vs RGBA issues are another problem.


Sure, it is but if you want to know the best potential of something, it has to be optimized to OS and hardware, and because something might not be done the same way, there will always be different issues to deal with.

Even let's say you did a standard test simple loop that does CPU intensive, this be problem, differences between CPU's different memory alignments, different vector exceptions, most likely code like that won't run at full speed because it be too general in nature.

Therefore, you might as well stick to manufactures mips rating, even if that also might be bogus.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 05-Mar-2015 at 03:40 PM.

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eliyahu 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 5-Mar-2015 15:52:14
#760 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2010
Posts: 1729
From: Waterbury, Connecticut (USA)

@paolone

Quote:
Just to keep this topic a little focused on its title's subject...

Today is March 5th so the court should have already ruled something about Hyperion's claims.

Any news about this?

i've been searching, but haven't found anything yet. the date specified for the final report was yesterday. i'd love to get some clarification from someone.

-- eliyahu

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