@Plaz

Quote:

Plaz wrote: MIPS anyone? http://www.imgtec.com/mips/ Plaz

That P5600 looks pretty interesting.

@cdimauro

Quote:

See above...

So it was you who ended crime career of Al Capone! Well done!

@Plaz

Quote:

Plaz wrote: MIPS anyone? http://www.imgtec.com/mips/ Plaz

I don't see any advantage on going to MIPS: it's a very niche architecture.

The only good thing that I see is that Imagination continue to improve it, and presents new micro-architectures. That means that the architecture is still alive.

However, I don't know how long they can continue against ARM (which is their primary competitor) and x86.

@cdimauro

Quote:

MIPS: it's a very niche architecture

Such irony in that statement.
So is 68K, so is PPC, so once was arm in the low power gap.
MIPS apparently plans to start in the wearable tech niche. And then from there?
I find it appealing in it's relation to RISC and 68k.
I have two of their dev boards, but no time recently to do much with them.

CI20 MIPS Dev Board

Plaz

Last edited by Plaz on 19-May-2015 at 12:32 AM.
Last edited by Plaz on 19-May-2015 at 12:25 AM.

As also Cavium seems to invest in ARM instead of MIPS, I doubt MIPS can have better future than Power Architecture.

So, IMO, PowerArchitecture or x64 are the sane options today.
(PowerArchitecture, because all our current NG flavours run on it and it also is available also for Classic systems etc.)

Our systems are starting to use e5500 cores, and after that there's still the e6500 to explore ( if "NGCore" or some IBMLowEndPowerSoC never come ). During that period (10+years) we can try to master multicore & 64bit etc. before ISA switch.

(noticed that intel has now xeon with integrated FPGA ... silly dreamers can start to drool after AAAAHombreCaipirinha SoC ?)

Last edited by KimmoK on 19-May-2015 at 01:02 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 19-May-2015 at 01:01 PM.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@KimmoK

xeon? yeah that'll be cheap affordable hardware.

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

@Plaz

Quote:

Plaz wrote: @cdimauro Quote: MIPS: it's a very niche architecture Such irony in that statement. So is 68K, so is PPC, so once was arm in the low power gap.

True, but we were talking about a possible replacement for PowerPCs, and IMO doesn't make sense to seek for another niche architecture. That's all.
Quote:

MIPS apparently plans to start in the wearable tech niche. And then from there?

There are many competitors for wearables, and IoT too. I don't know if MIPS/Imagination has the (economic) power to compete.
Quote:

I find it appealing in it's relation to RISC and 68k.

Honestly I fail to see the relationship between 68Ks and MIPS. For me they are one the nemesis of the other.
Quote:

I have two of their dev boards, but no time recently to do much with them. CI20 MIPS Dev Board Plaz

Benchmarks? Consumption? Cost?

@KimmoK

Quote:

KimmoK wrote: As also Cavium seems to invest in ARM instead of MIPS, I doubt MIPS can have better future than Power Architecture.

I think the same.
Quote:

So, IMO, PowerArchitecture or x64 are the sane options today. (PowerArchitecture, because all our current NG flavours run on it and it also is available also for Classic systems etc.)

Power = POWER I believe, but that's only for servers, and costs A LOT.
Quote:

Our systems are starting to use e5500 cores, and after that there's still the e6500 to explore ( if "NGCore" or some IBMLowEndPowerSoC never come ).

Nothing interesting here.
Quote:

During that period (10+years) we can try to master multicore & 64bit etc. before ISA switch.

Consider that fully supporting 64-bits (I mean: both o.s. and applications can handle >4GB of memory without tricks like the infamous "bank switching") already requires a big effort, similar to an ISA switch.
Quote:

(noticed that intel has now xeon with integrated FPGA ...

Only some of them.
Quote:

silly dreamers can start to drool after AAAAHombreCaipirinha SoC ?)

I think that such systems have already enough horse power to emulate AAA or Hombre without requiring an FPGA.

@Plaz

Quote:

MIPS anyone?

Isn't that a bit slow? I thought millions of instructions per second is considered rather basic these days and BIPS, TIPS or even GIPS would be more acceptable.

@cdimauro

>I think that such systems have already enough horse power to emulate AAA or Hombre without requiring an FPGA.

Sure. That's why I added one A etc...


SPAMMINK:
Freescale price list (does not include VAT etc):
T1024 USD37
T1042 USD50...67
T2080 USD100...130
T4080 USD262
T4160 USD276
T4240 USD412...542
P5010 USD180...286
P5020 USD202...320
P5040 USD173...293

Observation... they do not yet list any layerscape mid or high performance parts. Only some ARM based on the low end.

(PA6T starts bo be rare
http://www.bristolelectronics.com/pa6t1682mfcxes5-p-a-semi-inc/?utm_source=supplyFrame&utm_medium=buyNow )

Last edited by KimmoK on 27-May-2015 at 08:17 AM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 27-May-2015 at 08:15 AM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 27-May-2015 at 08:10 AM.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@cdimauro

Quote:

True, but we were talking about a possible replacement for PowerPCs, and IMO doesn't make sense to seek for another niche architecture. That's all.

And that is a very good point. ARM is acceptible to me as well. MIPS sounds fun as well IF it goes anywhere.

Plaz

@Hypex

Arr Arr Arr

In my case it stands for Multitudes of Indescribable Pizza Slices.

Plaz

@KimmoK

That T1022/T1042/T2081 triple-design I keep bringing up is starting to look more and more like the only useful design.

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

@olegil

I have been toying around with how to place all the stuff.

Some things:
-so far I have dropped my very old idea of CPU+GPUetc that are plugged on "passive" bus-board
-nano-ITX
--looks like plenty of space to fit everything (2...4 PCIe/mPCIe, 0...2 SATA etc.)
--but non-standard (to ATX or mini-ITX) PCIe slot locations are not nice
--how to arrange suitable cases ... could this be on 5'25" drive bay
--there are some examples how nano-ITX boards can house one PCIe, though (why not two)
--for better placing, for various GPU options, ribbon risers or busboards can be used
-mini-ITX
--everything+more fits on it
--Full size DIMM fits on it (compensates the price of larger board???)
--can simply use normal ATX + ITX cases
--simple to have space for MXM GPU if needed (just not yet sure if they bring up the system price too much)
--mini-ITX motherboard in mini-DTX capable case gives room for large GPU on standard located PCIe slot
--would it be sane to fill the "empty/free" space with traces&connectors&sockets for Geeks (Arduino shields compatible even???) just to leave that unpopulated by components untill support exist
--also this size could easily fit PCIe to multiPCIe bridge and existing & supported SATA and audio chip. But I'm afraid it starts to become complex. Rather see minimalistic low end with open/free expansion slots.
-mini-DTX
--if large GPU is on upper slot, not much fit in lowest slot
--if large GPU is on lower slot, the case needs to be larger than tight mini-DTX case (flex-ATX case?)
--I rather use mini-ITX with one standard and one non-standard slot location

And I still think DIU might be usefull. (before prototype it should be tested on T10x2RDB)
(T2081 does not have it, but is the T1042-T2081 compatible configuration compatible with DIU. FFS)

And I'm open for 3-4xPCIe/mPCIe + 1...2SATA (not T2081 compatible?) and for 2xPCIe configuration. (initially it anyway must be booted from SD card before other drivers are done)

+++++++++
It would be very nice to have design open to use T1014/T1012/T1022/T1042/T2081.
If we get multicore supported, then T1042 or even T2081 would be worthwhile release.
Otherwise T1022 is already overkill for Amiga niche, even if it's bare minimum for Linux geek.

Last edited by KimmoK on 27-May-2015 at 10:04 AM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 27-May-2015 at 10:03 AM.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@KimmoK

FFS? For ****s sake?

T1040 DIU shares pins with the QE, which was the only place except IFC and PCIe you could have put some sound signals. QE pins are also GPIO, two of them are I2C

T2081 lacks both DIU and QE, so there you simply get an extra I2C and some GPIO if you can be bothered to wire that. I don't think it's useful.

The serdes configurations are similar enough, but 2081 lacks SATA. I am THINKING it would be best set up as two x4 PCIe (2081 0xAA, 10x2 0x00), with a SB chip providing the single lane PCIe ports needed.

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

@olegil

>FFS? For ****s sake?

Something like that!

Then for ... SB options...
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=40266&start=0&post_id=760863&order=0&viewmode=thread&pid=0&forum=15#760863



About audio... the XCORE USB way...
http://m.eet.com/media/1160852/fundamentals_of_usb_audio_fig3.jpg
another... not X...
http://www.pavouk.org/hw/usbdac/en_index.html

Last edited by KimmoK on 27-May-2015 at 01:27 PM.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@KimmoK

To get enough USB for audio you need some extra chips, a SB will provide you with USB and audio so that's a simpler solution. I replied in your SB option thread

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

Freescale heading towards 16nm (in general) etc:
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/freescale-takes-its-next-generation-qoriq-multicore-platform-to-16nm-finfet-technology-2015-06-23
http://ir.freescale.com/investor-relations/press-releases/2015/06-23-2015-120146206.aspx

More ARM multicores:
http://linuxgizmos.com/first-quad-and-octa-core-qoriq-socs-unveiled/

FCL+NXP + IoT:
http://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1326956

Last edited by KimmoK on 29-Jun-2015 at 10:42 AM.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@KimmoK

Quote:

More ARM multicores: http://linuxgizmos.com/first-quad-and-octa-core-qoriq-socs-unveiled/

From the above URL,"The company still offers several dozen Power-based QorIQ and QorIQ Qonverge processors, but ARM seems to be the future direction here."

Last edited by damocles on 29-Jun-2015 at 02:32 PM.
Last edited by damocles on 29-Jun-2015 at 02:32 PM.

_________________
Dammy

@damocles

Yep, everybody reading freescale material get that feeling.

PowerArchitecture is mentioned with future new Layerscape chips etc. but that's all.

Someone might think "ARM" is just good PR.
Realists predict that Freescale can not maintain performance lead with PPC vs ARM.

Time will tell. I could bet that after next 10 years there is no more PPC in Freescale QorIQ chips. And few years after that perhaps no PPC cores in high end either.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?