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      /  Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
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blizz1220 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 17-Jul-2015 9:13:00
#21 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2013
Posts: 437
From: Unknown

@number6

It actually means a lot when your legal claim is "we have
nothing to do wit company xyz" , it means you are creating
your own trademark or company.

Let's say you want official Amiga Inc. T-Shirt , only one able
to give you that license is Amiga Inc.On the other hand let's
say you want T-Shirt that has "Amiga" written on it but with
some similarity (99.9 % even) with Amiga logo but NOT official
Amiga Inc. licensed T-Shirt.

So long story short Commodore Corp. have rights to trademark
(where and for what is unknown because they didn't say) while
CBM has right to their own trademark.First company's trademark
is the one that dates to days of original Commodore , CBM trademark
is new company (fanmade lol , they could use more research to be
called die-hard fans).

So it's two distinct trademarks.Purpose of "trademark" as legal
institute is so that nobody can make fake Coca-Cola drink and
sell it using real Coca-Cola advertising budget.If there is no way
to mix up products between these two Commodore companies
there is no ground (or even reason) for legal actions.

If Commodore USA went "ignore trademark" road , which is something
that many solicitors would suggest their case would be cheaper to
make.Let's not kid ourselves , Amiga or Commodore is not same as
Apple that is big company even today and probably registered properly
for all kinds of goods and services worldwide.

P.S. Phone suck , instead logo 5 extra buttons would do wonder to play
those emulated games.

Last edited by blizz1220 on 17-Jul-2015 at 09:15 AM.

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number6 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 17-Jul-2015 12:12:32
#22 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9647
From: In the village

@blizz1220

Quote:
So long story short Commodore Corp. have rights to trademark
(where and for what is unknown because they didn't say)


this is "not saying"?

Quote:
Mark Description:

The mark consists of The letter "C" followed by two horizontal bars with slanted tips followed by the word "Commodore".


#6

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blizz1220 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 17-Jul-2015 15:06:04
#23 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2013
Posts: 437
From: Unknown

@number6

I only read the website.No products were made for a very long time
though and they said all rights worldwide (for me same as not saying).

From what I read they can make official Commodore smartphones and
sell them in which case they could sue CBM.Problem is they didn't.

In Asiarim vs Commodore Int. case court awarded damages for licensing
issues but not loss of profit for unfair competition (my guess is that the
reason is again no products to sell so no loss of profit).

I would be interested to see what kind of hardware Commodore Corporation
has to show for themselves because registration by itself , without making
hardware or software , may be invalid in some countries.Also , is this
trademark really registered internationally and based on what international
copyright treaty.

Last edited by blizz1220 on 17-Jul-2015 at 03:09 PM.

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blizz1220 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 17-Jul-2015 15:06:24
#24 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2013
Posts: 437
From: Unknown

Double post but logo seems a little strange to me.

Was it filled that way just for reference or is it because
someone used graphic search ?

Commodore Business Machines has some trademarks
registered in UK:

https://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmowner/Owner/Results?Name=Commodore

Some of them date to 1984 and as far as I know company isn't
around anymore.Clear answer to who can do what with C= logo
and trademark would need a lot more investigation and
correspondence.New CBM seem confident they are legally good
to go.I'm more fascinated how the very word Commodore
followed by "makes new ..." gets instant chain reaction on
tech sites.

Last edited by blizz1220 on 17-Jul-2015 at 03:30 PM.
Last edited by blizz1220 on 17-Jul-2015 at 03:10 PM.
Last edited by blizz1220 on 17-Jul-2015 at 03:07 PM.

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number6 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 17-Jul-2015 15:30:53
#25 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9647
From: In the village

@blizz1220

Quote:
In Asiarim vs Commodore Int. case court awarded damages for licensing
issues but not loss of profit for unfair competition (my guess is that the
reason is again no products to sell so no loss of profit).


It was... (let's try to be accurate here):
Quote:
C=HOLDINGS B.V.,
Plaintiff,
VERSUS
ASIARIM CORPORATION,
Defendant.


And until the case was concluded you have to remember that anything about income related to the two licensees of Asiarim - CommodoreUSA and Manomio.
So, of course C=Holdings B.V. had no profit to declare and no way to prove they had products. The licensees were Asiarim's licensees and C=Holdings B.V. hadn't even won the right yet to do their own licensing.

#6

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blizz1220 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 17-Jul-2015 15:36:31
#26 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2013
Posts: 437
From: Unknown

@number6

Yes but I think court would award all damages (loss of profit for
license issues and product sales , loss of reputation etc.).

Edited post above.What made me think that this new CBM company
will have a free lunch is that they managed to register company in
hardware with disputed name and logo in UK.No doubt legal checks
were made before registration was complete.

This is Commodore B V trademark as registered in UK :

https://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00001216344

I just read paper and dropped the subject.

Last edited by blizz1220 on 17-Jul-2015 at 03:41 PM.

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number6 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 18-Jul-2015 18:14:30
#27 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9647
From: In the village

@thread

Just posting what appears to have been a direct question from one of the early reviewers to Commodore Business Machines LTD and their personally unsigned response.

Info after *update*

Some unusual statements on the site to be sure...

#6


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blizz1220 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 18-Jul-2015 19:42:12
#28 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2013
Posts: 437
From: Unknown

@number6

Seems they started from zero , hired attorney , did checks
and are now free to do what is within their rights.Probably
best way to approach either Amiga or Commodore trademark
because both are so fragmented that even though you pay for
license some other company (or 2 or 3) may come claiming
you are violating their property.

If they survive for more than a 6 moon cycles maybe they could
lend trademark to actual Commodore and Amiga projects to gain
popularity or support them in some way.

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number6 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 18-Jul-2015 21:38:35
#29 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9647
From: In the village

@thread

Semantics here seem to express a contrary thought.

Quote:
The team also is working with unnamed software houses to bring some of the 1980's best games on the PET before shipping.

from the Wired source most other articles referred to


Quote:
there won't be any games at it's launch however.

newest source

#6

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blizz1220 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 19-Jul-2015 5:15:58
#30 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2013
Posts: 437
From: Unknown

@number6

Here is something interesting I found about trademarks
in UK (may apply to other countries but I can read English).

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/
attachment_data/file/308759/revokingnonuse.pdf

To sum it up , if trademark isn't used for 5 years it can be
revoked by anyone and the proprietor must supply evidence
of products and services , sale records or such data to
avoid trademark being revoked.

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number6 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 21-Jul-2015 16:55:58
#31 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9647
From: In the village

@thread

Another article questioning the Wired content:

including comments from general manager

#6

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damocles 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 21-Jul-2015 20:11:42
#32 ]
Super Member
Joined: 22-Dec-2007
Posts: 1719
From: Unknown

@number6

Quote:

number6 wrote:
@thread

Another article questioning the Wired content:

including comments from general manager

#6


Funny, I am having a strong sense of Deja vu for some reason after reading those posts.

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number6 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 21-Jul-2015 20:19:28
#33 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9647
From: In the village

@damocles

Quote:
Funny, I am having a strong sense of Deja vu for some reason after reading those posts.


Been having that myself based on the links I've posted in particular. Heh.

#6

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number6 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 21-Jul-2015 22:18:01
#34 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9647
From: In the village

@thread

http://www.commodore-pet.com/shop/

apparently available?

And after checking, for what it's worth...

http://www.commodoresmart.com (until now a write for info page) now redirects to the above.

#6

Last edited by number6 on 21-Jul-2015 at 11:31 PM.

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LimoU.Sin 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 21-Jul-2015 22:44:02
#35 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 3-Jul-2015
Posts: 133
From: Unknown

How can a game console meant for big TV screens be replaced with small phone screens with crappy controllers?! I know kids are small in size but they grow.!

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blizz1220 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 22-Jul-2015 6:55:50
#36 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2013
Posts: 437
From: Unknown

@LimoU.Sin

They are registered for smartphones only so they couldn't
make anything else even if they wanted unless they apply
for broader registration.

Kinda lost interest but depending on sales they might create
interesting product in future , nothing stopping their (hired)
factories to do something like Commodore ARM desktop or
laptop.

So if anyone has desire to become even newer Commodore
and make something else now the proper way has been
established.

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number6 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 22-Jul-2015 21:03:37
#37 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9647
From: In the village

@thread

The designer of the product as reported:

Quote:
But designer Massimo Battaglia decided to reimagine the Commodore 64 for the modern age, as an Android smartphone. The attention to design goes deeper than simply adding the commodore logo between two haptic navigation keys.


Source

mentioned here as well

Name also appears many places including facebook.

Today disavows any connection to this product and to this company.

Quote:
"The Commodore PET is just a rebranded Chinese phone with two free emulators preinstalled," said Massimo Battaglia, an Italian industrial designer who was credited in some media reports with having designed the phone.

"Google the Orgtec Wa1, which was presented in December for only US$145 ," he told TechNewsWorld.

Although he acknowledged designing a concept for the Commodore PET a couple of months ago, "it was completely different," Battaglia said.

He now emphatically distances himself from the device: "I did not design the Commodore PET, I am not linked with Commodore Business Machines, and I don't want to be associated with that rebranding operation."


Source

#6

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blizz1220 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 22-Jul-2015 21:52:36
#38 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2013
Posts: 437
From: Unknown

@number6

He made the one that looked like Amiga mouse ...

Maybe more accurate to say cross between Amiga case
commodore shape and amiga mouse , frankenphone ...

They say that emulators will be "integrated" so they might
still save face if they invest in software side just a little like
SID/MOD player Android app and errr ... something

Last edited by blizz1220 on 22-Jul-2015 at 10:04 PM.

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damocles 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 22-Jul-2015 23:03:51
#39 ]
Super Member
Joined: 22-Dec-2007
Posts: 1719
From: Unknown

@number6

Quote:


Today disavows any connection to this product and to this company.

Quote:
"The Commodore PET is just a rebranded Chinese phone with two free emulators preinstalled," said Massimo Battaglia, an Italian industrial designer who was credited in some media reports with having designed the phone.

"Google the Orgtec Wa1, which was presented in December for only US$145 ," he told TechNewsWorld.

Although he acknowledged designing a concept for the Commodore PET a couple of months ago, "it was completely different," Battaglia said.

He now emphatically distances himself from the device: "I did not design the Commodore PET, I am not linked with Commodore Business Machines, and I don't want to be associated with that rebranding operation."


Source

#6


Sounds like either he was in a pissing match with CBM or perhaps C= Holding has awakened. Guess time will tell if there is another reason why.

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number6 
Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London
Posted on 22-Jul-2015 23:20:15
#40 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9647
From: In the village

@damocles

For what it's worth:

Google images for the designer

#6

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