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   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  AmigaOne X5000 News Update
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PosterThread
klx300r 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 3-Oct-2015 21:23:55
#41 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 4-Mar-2008
Posts: 3833
From: Toronto, Canada

congrats again to A-Eon for the successful completion of the successor to the A1-X1000! More REAL NEW hardware for our favourite OS is aweosme news

I use my X1000 everyday and never once regretted selling my Samflex@800 to get it! Now both AmigaOS and MorphOS have a solid standard future platform to build on

_________________
____________________________
c64-2sids, A1000, A1200T-060@50(finally working!),A4000-CSMKIII
! My Master Miggies- Amiga 1000 & AmigaOne X1000 !
mancave-ramblings
X1000 I BELIEVE

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pavlor 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 3-Oct-2015 21:27:50
#42 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@cdimauro

Quote:
that enable to access physical memory above the (normal) 4GB limit.


And that is most important part.

Quote:
They also put again the "One" word with the same font size used for "Amiga".


They use one colour for "Amiga" and "X5000" and other for "One". New logo looks good and is really clever: embracing both distinct AmigaOne brand and Amiga heritage.

Last edited by pavlor on 03-Oct-2015 at 09:28 PM.

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Boot_WB 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 3-Oct-2015 23:20:58
#43 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Feb-2006
Posts: 1134
From: Kingston upon Hull, UK

@iggy

Hi Jim,

I meant the invalid domain (www.a-eon/) in A-Eon's facebook posting. No pages will ever exist at that address.

_________________
Troll - n., A disenfranchised former potential customer who remains interested enough to stay informed and express critical opinions.
opp., the vast majority who voted silently with their feet.

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cdimauro 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 5:35:24
#44 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Oct-2012
Posts: 3621
From: Germany

@pavlor

Quote:

pavlor wrote:
@cdimauro

Quote:
that enable to access physical memory above the (normal) 4GB limit.


And that is most important part.

I have nothing to say if the o.s. uses internally such mechanism to implement the Ram Disk, caching filesystem blocks, putting some (private) structures away from the precious 2GB address space (to free some space here).

However, if you expose a public API and force developers to use such crap, well, I totally disagree because it's an anachronistic mechanism which goes in the exact opposite direction of the Amiga heritage that you often recall, which gave us a fully linear address space with no "8-bit-like" memory banks switching.

We made jokes of PCs because 8086 had segmentation, and even harder ones because of the EMS memory expansion which is... based exactly on the same mechanism of extended memory objects.

Instead of putting dirty patches over an old and 32-bit strict o.s., it's better to move to a 64-bit one. Look at the calendar: in less than 2 months the 2016 arrives...
Quote:
Quote:
They also put again the "One" word with the same font size used for "Amiga".


They use one colour for "Amiga" and "X5000" and other for "One". New logo looks good and is really clever: embracing both distinct AmigaOne brand and Amiga heritage.

I saw. It's an interesting expedient. But still the Amiga is not alone, and the computer is an "AmigaOS" one.

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pavlor 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 7:32:34
#45 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@cdimauro

Quote:
Instead of putting dirty patches over an old and 32-bit strict o.s., it's better to move to a 64-bit one. Look at the calendar: in less than 2 months the 2016 arrives...


And lose all compatibility?

Quote:
I saw. It's an interesting expedient. But still the Amiga is not alone, and the computer is an "AmigaOS" one.


Exactly as it should be.

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Overflow 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 7:36:15
#46 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2012
Posts: 1628
From: Norway

@pavlor

You cant hold on to compatability forever.

Even many programs that worked on A500 doesnt work on A1200, so nothing new per see.

If you want AOS to be a OS alternative for the future, then performance is a big issue.
Compatability thru emulation

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cdimauro 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 7:40:10
#47 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Oct-2012
Posts: 3621
From: Germany

@pavlor

Quote:

pavlor wrote:
@cdimauro

Quote:
Instead of putting dirty patches over an old and 32-bit strict o.s., it's better to move to a 64-bit one. Look at the calendar: in less than 2 months the 2016 arrives...


And lose all compatibility?


Yes! (FS|Win)UAE is here for the legacy stuff, and provides a good enough integration with the host o.s., in order to share some resources.

Much more can be done, but of course it requires more effort, which can be leveraged if all post-Amiga devs join the forces at least for this purpose, which brings A LOT of benefits for all post-Amiga o.ses.

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pavlor 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 7:52:47
#48 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@cdimauro

Quote:
Yes! (FS|Win)UAE is here for the legacy stuff, and provides a good enough integration with the host o.s., in order to share some resources.


I see you can´t understand very reason of OS4/MorphOS existence: bring new features without losing to much from the past.

If you interrupt that link to Amiga past, you may well use any other host OS with UAE (like you do now). Why maintain own out-dated OS then?

Quote:
which can be leveraged if all post-Amiga devs join the forces at least for this purpose


Time to join the forces? Oh no, not again...

Ask Olaf, how hard is to get even minimal cooperation from Red and Blue camps. They hate each other vigorously.

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cdimauro 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 8:07:22
#49 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Oct-2012
Posts: 3621
From: Germany

@pavlor

Quote:

pavlor wrote:
@cdimauro

Quote:
Yes! (FS|Win)UAE is here for the legacy stuff, and provides a good enough integration with the host o.s., in order to share some resources.


I see you can´t understand very reason of OS4/MorphOS existence: bring new features without losing to much from the past.

MorphOS will do this step. Think about it...
Quote:
If you interrupt that link to Amiga past, you may well use any other host OS with UAE (like you do now). Why maintain own out-dated OS then?

I understand it if your only goal is to run only legacy Amiga 68K apps.

However I use AROS (but the same can be applied to AmigaOS4 and MorphOS) because I want to enjoy a different o.s. experience which is clearly linked to the Amiga past through the Amiga o.s. infrastructure.

I already have Windows 10 for the "daily needs", while AROS is for fun.
Quote:
Quote:
which can be leveraged if all post-Amiga devs join the forces at least for this purpose


Time to join the forces? Oh no, not again...

Ask Olaf, how hard is to get even minimal cooperation from Red and Blue camps. They hate each other vigorously.

I know it, but DOpus and OWB show that for big and important projects a collaboration can be made, and it worked at the end.

Enhancing UAE/Janus and integrating it on MorphOS/x64 and, eventually, in AmigaOS4/(PowerPC64 | any-other-64-bit-architecture) is another project which is even more important.

All IMO, of course.

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pavlor 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 8:19:57
#50 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@cdimauro

Quote:
MorphOS will do this step. Think about it...


Once done, we will see both pros and cons of such move...

Quote:
I understand it if your only goal is to run only legacy Amiga 68K apps.

Quote:
However I use AROS (but the same can be applied to AmigaOS4 and MorphOS) because I want to enjoy a different o.s. experience which is clearly linked to the Amiga past through the Amiga o.s. infrastructure.


I use AROS too, but my user experience is hindered by lack of compatibility (speaking about AROS "x86").

Quote:
I already have Windows 10 for the "daily needs", while AROS is for fun.


That is exactly, what I wrote: your needs aren´t the same as these of current OS4/MorphOS users. They want (at least some) "daily needs" and fun together.

Quote:
I know it, but DOpus and OWB show that for big and important projects a collaboration can be made, and it worked at the end.


Two applications (although important) can´t be compared to new OS developement. Here you would fight with overgrown egos...

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OlafS25 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 8:44:52
#51 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 6321
From: Unknown

@cdimauro

regarding MorphOS "NG" we will see how it will look like (in some years). It will break compatiblity not only to 32bit 68k world (you need UAE) but also to existing MorphOS. One of the MorphOS devs admitted that (except 68k via emulation) no 3rd party software will work on it (and because they want to implement modern features like MP and SMP and 64bit I assume that no existing MorphOS software will work by simply recompiling). They also want to drop legacy concepts like datatypes and only offer wrappers for the old APIs. If all that becomes real it is for me nothing more than a tech demo with no software. There is no huge activity on MorphOS regarding 3rd parties right now and then they even split their small platform. To me it is a risky bet.

regarding cooperation I would use the famous "Oh No!" from Lemmings

The fanboys in the two communities and the OS devs really hate each other, even people later joining one of the two platforms are taking this over. Of course there are always some exceptions but overall. So no chance. Magellan and OWB are 3rd party software with common interest so some people joined (most not OS developers). On OS level I do not see that. I had discussions on morphzone recently trying to explain that the "red vs. blue" war finally harms everyone but I think it so deep now that people will never overcome that ever. Also basically all "NG" platforms are more and more heading in different directions so that at some point working together makes no sense anymore. I personal thought cooperation between MorphOS and AROS would have made sense (both share code, both have many components in common) but (besides MorphOS is simply the best and 10 years ahead why working together attitude in MorphOS camp) with "MorphOS NG" the common base will vanish. In my view MorphOS will not be "Amiga" anymore, at best "Amiga inspired". But there we will see...

Last edited by OlafS25 on 04-Oct-2015 at 08:49 AM.

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duga 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 9:00:30
#52 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 1-May-2012
Posts: 227
From: Unknown

@CarasGhant

Quote:

CarasGhant wrote:
Well I'm done. Could never upgrade my SAM at those prices. One less OS4 user.


Then keep it. I'm sure it will get AmigaOS 4.2 support when it is eventually released.

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umisef 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 10:22:38
#53 ]
Super Member
Joined: 19-Jun-2005
Posts: 1714
From: Melbourne, Australia

@Rob

Quote:
So £426 cheaper than the base price for the X1000.


Actually, the exact same price the First Contact X1000 were announced at.

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TrevorDick 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 10:33:09
#54 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Dec-2004
Posts: 2678
From: Wellington

@umisef

The X1000 price was without OS4 or sales tax IIRC.

TrevorD

Edit:

PS: I need to change my strap line, Posted on the AmigaOne X5000 using Odyssey

Last edited by TrevorDick on 04-Oct-2015 at 10:41 AM.

_________________
No, I don't need no reason, I'm just breezin'

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Vistaus 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 11:01:13
#55 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 29-Jul-2013
Posts: 332
From: Unknown

Why compatibility through emulation? You don't need emulation for that. Look at Haiku's experimental GCC4 branch. It uses a layer (which is not the same as an emulator) to run old GCC2 BeOS apps.

_________________
Proud user of AmigaOS 4.1 on an AmigaONE 500. This is the first Amiga I've ever had so I don't know all the ins and outs of AmigaOS yet, so I'm sorry if I'm asking noob questions and stuff.

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pavlor 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 11:13:06
#56 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@Vistaus

Such solution is not useable on "alien" CPU architecture.

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Tuxedo 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 12:48:35
#57 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Nov-2003
Posts: 2341
From: Perugia, ITALY

@TrevorDick

Hi Trevor!
I think X5000 project was quite interesting also if price was still a bit too high for "every" Amiga users...
However...any news on when we all can look at effective x5000 horse power with some test?

_________________
Simone"Tuxedo"Monsignori, Perugia, ITALY.

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number6 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 13:04:57
#58 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 11540
From: In the village

@TrevorDick

Quote:
The X1000 price was without OS4 or sales tax IIRC.


The .pdf clearly says WITHOUT license, so you do recall correctly. heh.


Holiday season 2013 there was a limited time offer of a system with AmigaOS 4.1 at a lower price, but it's not fair to compare a launch price of one model with a short lived sales price of another.

Quote:
For a time limited period you can purchase a Nemo motherboard complete with AmigaOS 4.1 for £1366 or a complete AmigaONE X1000 system with AmigaOS 4.1 pre-installed from £1,707.50 (prices exclude shipping & VAT where applicable).

Source

#6

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This posting, in its entirety, represents solely the perspective of the author.
*Secrecy has served us so well*

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kyle 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 13:11:58
#59 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 15-Oct-2006
Posts: 866
From: Livorno, Italy

@TrevorDick

Hi Trevor, it will be possible to preorder only Cyrus+, RAM and OS4 (and eventually a soundboard) instead of a complete system?

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Hypex 
Re: AmigaOne X5000 News Update
Posted on 4-Oct-2015 15:31:27
#60 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 11180
From: Greensborough, Australia

@Aslak3

Quote:
It says 64 bit, and dual core, but we all know that under AmigaOS4 these things are inaccessible.


Depends how you look at it. Is the hardware 64 bit and dual core? Well yes the CPU is. And Linux can certainly run in that configuration. What OS4 is doing or not isn't bound by the hardware. But I hope they have picked hardware than OS4 can support. And do so in less than five years fully stable. Otherwise there is no point and the argument of it being built for OS4 will be false. You don't get hardware built for an OS without drivers and claim it is designed for that OS while charging a fortune unless you really wanna piss off your consumers and drive them out. I may be a bit harsh here but I think we need to look at the facts.

For example, for years it was said that Macs were expensive bacuse they used this exotic PowerPC. So what happens when they shift to Intel? The prices are still expensive and the hardware still limited in some Apple way!

I also hear, at least in my club, talk that PPC CPUs aren't expensive and available. But when they end up on OS4 boards somehow they are expensive and rare.

Last edited by Hypex on 04-Oct-2015 at 03:35 PM.

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