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   /  Classic Amiga Hardware
      /  News about Vampire and Apollo
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kolla 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 2:45:16
#561 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 592
From: Trondheim, Norway

@QuikSanz

What's wrong with USB? The point with serial port directly on the board is that it is very usefull for debugging the OS, doing diagnostics and other fairly critical things. A parallel port for ancient printers you can buy cheaply for USB.

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Leo 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 9:36:36
#562 ]
Super Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 1544
From: Unknown

The standalone version is good news, but what about the OS ? I'd be surprised if they could get a licence of the OS. Same question for p96: it seemed to me they didn't ask for a licence.

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OlafS25 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 11:27:23
#563 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 4927
From: Unknown

@Leo

Gunnar said Aros 68k would be the OS for the standalone version. I assume that they will also try to offer drivers for 3.X as far it is possible.

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Yasu 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 11:34:13
#564 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 13-Oct-2015
Posts: 224
From: Stockholm, Sweden

Can't they license it from Cloanto?

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OlafS25 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 11:42:18
#565 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 4927
From: Unknown

@Yasu

I am not directly involved. At the start people had to proof that they own a license and then got the board.

"(Please have a copy of your 3.1 Kickstart available)."

I do not know how current handling is. But licensing it is one thing, how do you extend roms without sources? You can patch of course but only to a certain degree

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Yasu 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 12:10:05
#566 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 13-Oct-2015
Posts: 224
From: Stockholm, Sweden

@OlafS25

I was thinking of the stand-alone version.

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OlafS25 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 12:16:00
#567 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 4927
From: Unknown

@Yasu

I am not directly involved so cannot answer that

Some time ago gunnar said Aros would be first choice for the standalone version. Reason is not only license fees but to have access to the sources including the rom. Something that is not possible on 3.X, I am not sure if any rom sources exist today at all.

Even with rom you need RTG and propably USB and LAN support. Patching of roms has its limits.

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tangoone 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 12:28:46
#568 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 2-Jul-2014
Posts: 146
From: Norway

If stand alone version happens I hope it will be a AmigaOS 3.x system.

I dont want aros.

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OlafS25 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 12:45:45
#569 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 4927
From: Unknown

@tangoone

you will have to accept what they offer or not buy

simple as that

I assume that they will try to support 3.X either as far as possible. But that has its limits.

But I am no longer interested to take part in this weird "I do not like Aros" discussion

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Overflow 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 13:35:44
#570 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2012
Posts: 1208
From: Norway

@OlafS25

I assume AROS wont be a requirement with the standalone..? It might come with AROS preinstalled
, but people can install AOS IF they so please?

That said, I welcome AROS. I will most likely have a AOS CF/Drive too, like I do with V600.
Ive just used my V600 a few hours so far, so havent gotten around to making AROS CF yet, and now my A600 is in for repairs. But in a week or so, Ill defintly install AROS to get familiar with it.

Last edited by Overflow on 15-Aug-2016 at 01:39 PM.

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OlafS25 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 13:42:00
#571 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 4927
From: Unknown

@Overflow

at least one fan

I assume that they will try to get 3.X working on it as far as possible

but without sources and the rights to change them it has its limits but I do not think they would restrict it somehow as a pure aros device

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OlafS25 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 13:44:33
#572 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 4927
From: Unknown

@Overflow

Aros 68k was not working on it at the moment, I know that one aros developer now is working on driver support to get it faster and they will certainly fix the errors

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J'Bar 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 16:41:34
#573 ]
Member
Joined: 20-Feb-2010
Posts: 67
From: Unknown

@OlafS25

I love AROS always have and i make no bones about loving it ,i like it so much because of its Amiga 3.1 heritage and it runs on modern hardware,it gives me an Amiga kick that i need from time to time without the need to drag out my CBM Amiga's (lack of room for permanent setups )

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 15-Aug-2016 19:17:32
#574 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10443
From: Norway

@OlafS25

AmigaOS3.x too old, AROS too bloated, or some thing right?

200 / 300Mhz is fast for classic Amiga standards, but it's so easy to waste CPU cycles you have. I'm sure it possible to do some interesting codec stuff in FPGA, or things like that make it go faster, but for general program it won't help, and so it will be stupid not to optimize every single byte of OS code. This where I think AROS that mostly C code is just a bad choice.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 15-Aug-2016 at 07:22 PM.

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Leo 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 16-Aug-2016 9:45:57
#575 ]
Super Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 1544
From: Unknown

Quote:

Gunnar said Aros 68k would be the OS for the standalone version. I assume that they will also try to offer drivers for 3.X as far it is possible.

Last time I checked, AROS 68k was far too slow and very uncomplete/unstable for serious usage on a real 68k Amiga. Not to mention compatibility problems with WB apps. Maybe this has changed now.

Last edited by Leo on 16-Aug-2016 at 10:09 AM.

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OlafS25 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 16-Aug-2016 9:58:38
#576 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 4927
From: Unknown

@Leo

too slow on real hardware yes. That is one of the main areas that has to be addressed. I cannot confirm that it is unstable (at least on UAE where I use it). Uncomplete? Where? You can add anything, you can even replace components like Zune with MUI as long the desktop not relies on it. Of course there are libraries that not fully implement everything from 3.5 (what I used for comparation) but also add other routines. It might be "bloated" compared to 3.1 but it is a modern system implementing many components not included in 3.1 like Themes, RTG, network stack, USB (Poseidon), AHI and so on and patches are included in rom

And it avoids all the legal problems arising with 3.1. P96 and related discussions are known already, if LAN and USB is added the same will happen there. Example is USB. In Aros Poseidon is included (the version that was opensourced). The current 68k 3.1 version of Poseidon is commercial and copyrighted. To be legal you could either use aros or backport poseidon from aros to 3.1. The easier route is to use aros. My guess (and what gunnar said) aros will be the platform supporting everything and my guess is 3.1 will be supported with drivers as far as possible (as it was the case with P96). The user can decide what he wants to run, in this case 3.1 would offer less hardware support than aros but still working.

Last edited by OlafS25 on 16-Aug-2016 at 10:05 AM.
Last edited by OlafS25 on 16-Aug-2016 at 09:59 AM.

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OlafS25 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 16-Aug-2016 10:13:30
#577 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 4927
From: Unknown

@NutsAboutAmiga

3.X is not too old for many, many people in community use it for retro purpose and for fun. It is certainly not competitive in todays terms (even when heavily patched) but people like it that way.

The big problem is availability of sources to adapt it and legal problems (P96 was just a first example)

AROS of course has higher requirements but also offers everything out of the box and it is free from legal problems. I am aware that some of the people prefer 3.X to aros and even reacted hateful (weird community). From what gunnar said Aros is planned to get optimised and have full driver support on vampire/apollo, 3.X certainly will get driver support as far as possible and legal but not everything will work. Optimisations on OS level and rom are not possible because of no sources.

So users can decide what they prefer.

Last edited by OlafS25 on 16-Aug-2016 at 10:14 AM.

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Overflow 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 27-Aug-2016 19:54:06
#578 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2012
Posts: 1208
From: Norway

Kookytech/Dan Wood and Ravi Abbott has posted a interview with Gunnar about the current state of the Vampire project:

https://soundcloud.com/the-retro-hour

Interview starts at around 9 minutes into the show.

Talks about Standalone Vampire with 1 gigabyte of memory.

Last edited by Overflow on 27-Aug-2016 at 08:03 PM.

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Mr-Z 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 28-Aug-2016 7:51:25
#579 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 24-May-2005
Posts: 173
From: De Keistad, Netherlands

@OlafS25

Would love to see an optimized AROS version for Apollo-core/Vampire that does have everything out of the box, cannot wait to try it!
I really like my OS 3.9 config with all it's patches and hacks to keep it somewhat up to date-ish, probably be running them both in the future on my V600.

And with hopefully faster Apollo/Vampire's in the future AROS will run just fine.
Right now I'm already having so much fun with my V600, it plays MP3,surf the web,chatting on IRC, running in 720P and it does it all at the same time with no sweat at all.


Now hopefully they'll release the x13 core version soon so i can get my black edition running at full speed

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tangoone 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 28-Aug-2016 9:23:24
#580 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 2-Jul-2014
Posts: 146
From: Norway

@Overflow

all my wet dreams will be reality.

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