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   /  Classic Amiga Hardware
      /  News about Vampire and Apollo
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kolla 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 28-Aug-2016 13:07:11
#581 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 592
From: Trondheim, Norway

@Leo

Quote:

Leo wrote:
The standalone version is good news, but what about the OS ?


Why is this suddenly a concern? Did Minimig come with OS? Does MIST come with OS? Does FPGA Arcade? No? Why would a Vampire board need to come with OS?

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kamelit0 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 28-Aug-2016 13:59:15
#582 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2011
Posts: 548
From: Unknown

@kolla

To be able to use new features not available on Amiga.
Kamelito

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Leo 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 28-Aug-2016 15:02:51
#583 ]
Super Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 1544
From: Unknown

Quote:

Why is this suddenly a concern? Did Minimig come with OS? Does MIST come with OS? Does FPGA Arcade? No? Why would a Vampire board need to come with OS?

The time you write a standalone board, you need an OS so this becomes a concern.

Arcade/Minimig don't come with a kickstart, and that make it only accessible to hardcore Amiga fans. If you ask me, that's a problem.

Having to add a kickstart make things more difficult to use than they should be. But in the case of the Minimig you need a non modified existing Amiga ROM, so that's ok, for hardcore fans. In the Amiga days, most users didn't even know what the kickstart was and simply inserted disks to play games. By having to add a copy of the kickstart, your prevent these people from buying your board. And I think that it represents most of the potential buyers.

With the Vampire this is different, because you have to heavily patch the OS, add drivers,... having a legal option for the OS is a necessary thing: without that, your hardware is totally useless.

Seeing how problems & fights we have seen (& still see) in the Amiga market for rights to the OS, if I was working on hardware, I wouldn't start anything before having the green light for the OS (be it rights to the existing one, or AROS, etc...).

_________________
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kolla 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 28-Aug-2016 17:30:58
#584 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 592
From: Trondheim, Norway

@Leo

So you're saying a Vampire board will have compatibility issues.

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Zylesea 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 28-Aug-2016 17:32:23
#585 ]
Super Member
Joined: 16-Mar-2004
Posts: 1985
From: Ostwestfalen, FRG

@Leo

These boards are intended not for Joe Average, hence I doubt adding a kickstart rom would be a major show stopper. And dealers are free to add whatever they like. you make a problem where ther'es rather none.

_________________
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MorphOS user since V0.4 (2001)

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Overflow 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 28-Aug-2016 18:35:09
#586 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2012
Posts: 1208
From: Norway

For my current Vampire, I purchased a lisence for Kickstart which was installed by Kippa during production. No hassle for me.

Wether or not people will use AROS or AOS (I got 3.0, 3.1 and 3.9 legally) on their standalones, isnt any of Team Apollos buissniss. Personally I will have a AROS and AOS 3.9 CF to use with the standalone, whenever its available.

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BoingBear 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 28-Aug-2016 20:09:06
#587 ]
Member
Joined: 28-Oct-2015
Posts: 70
From: Unknown

@Leo

I think you are incorrect in your assumption of who the target market is for this product, and since it is not being mass produced, I don't see hundreds of uneducated (in Amiga Kickstart terms) users buying this product and having problems installing the correct Kickstart and drivers, so they can use it.

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Rob 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 29-Aug-2016 15:07:37
#588 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 20-Mar-2003
Posts: 5352
From: S.Wales

The ACA500 came with Kickstart 1.3 and 3.1 ROMs licensed from Hyperion. The deal covers future cards and also access to the source code of the IDE driver.

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Samurai_Crow 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 3-Sep-2016 18:25:54
#589 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 18-Jan-2003
Posts: 2051
From: Ft. Collins, Colorado, USA

@Leo

Patches to the Cloanto 3.X ROM and AROS are being explored.

_________________
Member of Apollo Accelerator team.

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kolla 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 4-Sep-2016 1:45:24
#590 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 592
From: Trondheim, Norway

@Samurai_Crow

Why not just make it clear and open what needs to be patched, why and how? Many of us are used to assembling our own custom kickstarts.

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Samurai_Crow 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 5-Sep-2016 20:17:47
#591 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 18-Jan-2003
Posts: 2051
From: Ft. Collins, Colorado, USA

@kolla

The AROS ROM needs SAGA graphics drivers because the P96 support for SAGA relies heavily on software fallbacks. The memory map also changed slightly to accomodate more registers for the SAGA chipset thus requiring the patched Kickstart also.

_________________
Member of Apollo Accelerator team.

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kolla 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 6-Sep-2016 5:49:51
#592 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 592
From: Trondheim, Norway

@Samurai_Crow

Is there some technical document somewhere describing what changes are needed? What needs done to Piru's exec44 for it to work with Vampire for example.

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Hypex 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 6-Sep-2016 13:44:37
#593 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 8236
From: Greensborough, Australia

@Leo

Quote:
The time you write a standalone board, you need an OS so this becomes a concern.


Really this shouldn't be a problem as the Vampire plugs into a computer that has hardware ROMs on board. All that should be needed is to read it and cache it locally on the Vampire board. Given the Vampire acts as an accelerator there should be no problem here.

After all it is supposed to be perfectly legal to extract the Kickstart to a file provided you own the machine you extract it from. And keep it around.

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Samurai_Crow 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 6-Sep-2016 14:28:38
#594 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 18-Jan-2003
Posts: 2051
From: Ft. Collins, Colorado, USA

@Hypex

Quote:

Hypex wrote:
@Leo

Quote:
The time you write a standalone board, you need an OS so this becomes a concern.


Really this shouldn't be a problem as the Vampire plugs into a computer that has hardware ROMs on board. All that should be needed is to read it and cache it locally on the Vampire board. Given the Vampire acts as an accelerator there should be no problem here.

After all it is supposed to be perfectly legal to extract the Kickstart to a file provided you own the machine you extract it from. And keep it around.


Ummm... Leo wasn't talking about a Vampire accelerator, he was talking about an Apollo-core based stand-alone motherboard.

_________________
Member of Apollo Accelerator team.

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Samurai_Crow 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 6-Sep-2016 15:40:22
#595 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 18-Jan-2003
Posts: 2051
From: Ft. Collins, Colorado, USA

@kolla

The Apollo public wiki tells what the addresses used by the SAGA core are. Specifically the current register map will tell you some of it.

_________________
Member of Apollo Accelerator team.

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Yasu 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 21-Sep-2016 9:53:02
#596 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 13-Oct-2015
Posts: 224
From: Stockholm, Sweden

Apparently Kipper has got so much flame for him having to raise the price that he decided to stop developing the Vampire.

Congratulations you nagging ass hats, you have ruined yet another awesome project!

_________________
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My MorphOS Blog

"Free speech includes other peoples right to offend you."

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TheAMIgaOne 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 21-Sep-2016 10:32:08
#597 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 10-Jan-2004
Posts: 764
From: United Kingdom

@Yasu

Not good news, but understand his reasons.

He could be back, but maybe next time we could have a middle man for the customer service like A-Eon. I'm guessing he just too much on board, whereas A-Eon or similar could plan imports/exports/customer service/ and manufacturing financing planning

_________________
Cross-developer on Windows, OS3, OS4, Linux; Current Projects:-
Nephele Cloud App OS4
UserProfile System OS4
AmigaOneXE OS4.1.6

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Birbo 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 21-Sep-2016 10:44:38
#598 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 5-Apr-2007
Posts: 503
From: Zurich, Switzerland

@Yasu

Is this official news? I couldn't find anything on apollo-core.com

_________________
I want to die peacefully in sleep like my grandfather did, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

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olegil 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 21-Sep-2016 11:09:36
#599 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Aug-2003
Posts: 5886
From: Work

@Yasu

I don't see this announced anywhere. And specifically, the price hike wasn't even discussed here, so it's not US being ass hats.

And this is simple supply and demand. If he has so much demand that he can't supply, he should have raised prices a long time ago.

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

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Daedalus 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 21-Sep-2016 11:11:30
#600 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Jul-2003
Posts: 1533
From: Glasgow - UK, Irish born

@Birbo

It was reposted on Facebook last night, and also here from Kipper2K himself.

_________________
RobTheNerd.com | InstallerGen | SMBMounter | Atoms-X

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