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   /  Classic Amiga Hardware
      /  News about Vampire and Apollo
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PosterThread
Rob 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 23-Sep-2016 12:08:26
#621 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 20-Mar-2003
Posts: 5263
From: S.Wales

@Yasu

Quote:

Yasu wrote:
Apparently Kipper has got so much flame for him having to raise the price that he decided to stop developing the Vampire.

Congratulations you nagging ass hats, you have ruined yet another awesome project!


I was always concerned that he'd end up feeling burned out with all the orders he was expected to fulfill but never expected people would start abusing him over it.

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Signman 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 23-Sep-2016 15:21:24
#622 ]
Member
Joined: 16-Aug-2016
Posts: 35
From: Unknown

@Rob

I have been in business a long time dealing with the public.
People in the business I am in sometimes complain about working too many hours, stressed and not really having time for family and finally not really seeing any real income.

Many always suggest to raise their prices a lot. You lose a lot of the time wasters and those that stay with you finally get taken care of better and appreciate you. One doubled his prices and lost some but finally made some money, cut his hours and increased his profits.

You go too high, a few buy and that's it.
What were they going to charge, $160? If you go the ebay route the magic will be long gone soon after the excited ones are gone.

I would rather sell 500 at $250 or so and make a $100 each profit (just a guess here) then sell 50 or so at double or more that price.

Just thoughts, they are smart men who will come to grips with this and forget the " community" BS.

Personally, I would pay $250 or so but not what is going on ebay now. If that is just an anomaly and just selling a few to get money, sure why not.

Sometimes there is just no market for a product at the price you need to sell it at. Hope they do well.

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Overflow 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 17-Nov-2016 23:38:52
#623 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2012
Posts: 1175
From: Norway

Some small videos/demostrations of CPUMon080

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jO0_SkHogrI&

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ees1PExo4PA

Mac Emulation Game Marathon 2

https://vimeo.com/191262075

Last edited by Overflow on 17-Nov-2016 at 11:54 PM.
Last edited by Overflow on 17-Nov-2016 at 11:53 PM.

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ErikBauer 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 18-Nov-2016 12:34:22
#624 ]
Super Member
Joined: 25-Feb-2004
Posts: 1013
From: Italy

Like it, for once a CPU monitor that gives real time MIPS "consumption".
And 280MIPS looks like an impressive amount of power (14 times faster than my 030/50!).

Can't wait for NatAmi or Vampyre 1200

_________________
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SKOLMAN_MWS 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 18-Nov-2016 13:38:19
#625 ]
Member
Joined: 19-May-2006
Posts: 77
From: Poland

@ErikBauer

last photo 85 MIPS http://arananet-net.kinja.com/instalacion-de-la-aceleradora-vampire-v2-en-mi-a600-c-1782458393?rev=1466635541360

_________________
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IanP 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 18-Nov-2016 14:10:52
#626 ]
Member
Joined: 27-Mar-2008
Posts: 34
From: Unknown

@SKOLMAN_MWS That's running an older core at x11 (~78MHz), the CPUMon080 videos show the newer (pre-release Gold2) core running at x14 (~100MHz, it's is hoped the V500 V2+ will run at least that fast). Sysinfo uses algorithms to guestimate a MIPS figure for the CPU under test, CPUMon80 is using performance counter registers to accurately report (peak?) values, which are probably just as meaningless as Sysinfo in terms of measuring actual system performance.

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ErikBauer 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 18-Nov-2016 14:22:07
#627 ]
Super Member
Joined: 25-Feb-2004
Posts: 1013
From: Italy

@SKOLMAN_MWS

Second CPU Monitor video shows 279/280 MIPS near the firs half of the video.

_________________
Love, be Humble, give Thanks, Smile and Celebrate!

Check my Amiga gameplays (ITA)!

God created Paula so that Allister Br

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pavlor 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 18-Nov-2016 15:18:45
#628 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 7952
From: Unknown

@Overflow

Unlike real world performance (like Mac emulation, nice!), artificial benchmarks with inflated scores are useless...

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SKOLMAN_MWS 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 18-Nov-2016 15:46:14
#629 ]
Member
Joined: 19-May-2006
Posts: 77
From: Poland

@IanP

Do tests on Vampire? https://youtu.be/ezi0afzgxEk

Link to Quake_noopt in the description below the video.

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SKOLMAN_MWS 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 18-Nov-2016 15:53:16
#630 ]
Member
Joined: 19-May-2006
Posts: 77
From: Poland

@ErikBauer

I watched the video and it is nonsense.

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Beans 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 18-Nov-2016 18:11:49
#631 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 26-Aug-2016
Posts: 249
From: Bear Delaware USA

@SKOLMAN_MWS

Well, I've been skeptical about the MIPS figures and the frequency quotations for some time now.
But why would they prevaricate?
Especially when it looks like they are finally on to something?
This isn't the Natami project.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 18-Nov-2016 18:31:54
#632 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10431
From: Norway

@Beans

Well there is defiantly a lot of effort going into this project, it's nice that can play 640x480 videos, but that’s not a lot when everyone else is playing 720p, 1080p and 4K videos. Normally doubling the size of a video fore doubles the CPU needed to play it. with AMMX stuff maybe they be barley able to play 720p, with a not too demanding codec.

Anyway they need to get the FPU stuff working, modern videos often uses audio in float format. Anyway AHI, is not really designed to deal with float, this one of this things that bugs me, about AmigaOS.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 18-Nov-2016 at 09:52 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 18-Nov-2016 at 06:37 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 18-Nov-2016 at 06:36 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 18-Nov-2016 at 06:36 PM.

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Beans 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 18-Nov-2016 18:45:19
#633 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 26-Aug-2016
Posts: 249
From: Bear Delaware USA

@NutsAboutAmiga

I don't doubt they are getting results, but Gunnar has a knack for getting sidetracked.
Like why pursue multimedia extensions when the fpu isn't ready yet?

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utri007 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 18-Nov-2016 19:04:27
#634 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 12-Aug-2003
Posts: 872
From: United States of Europe

@Beans

sidetracked that is true, AMMX has no point there is a one app wich supports it.

Most of 68040/68060 specifig apps / games need FPU. So if they just like tinkering AMMX is nice Project, but it is not usefull.

What they need is AGA and FPU, other vice it is not a one monitor solution and most late time apps and games woun't work.

Compared Netsurf performance, Vampire is about 200mhz 68060.

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ErikBauer 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 18-Nov-2016 19:06:37
#635 ]
Super Member
Joined: 25-Feb-2004
Posts: 1013
From: Italy

EDIT: Nonsense was spoken by myself.

This empty post is here to replace them

Last edited by ErikBauer on 18-Nov-2016 at 07:08 PM.

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Check my Amiga gameplays (ITA)!

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wawa 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 18-Nov-2016 20:49:04
#636 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 5314
From: Unknown

a cpu benchmarking itself realtime cannot be precise, but the presentation is impressive nonetheless. i hope they will find the ways to patch the os to save the additional register content, so that it can be used along with system friendly multitasking.

Last edited by wawa on 18-Nov-2016 at 08:50 PM.

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Zylesea 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 19-Nov-2016 0:51:53
#637 ]
Super Member
Joined: 16-Mar-2004
Posts: 1970
From: Ostwestfalen, FRG

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

NutsAboutAmiga wrote:
@Beans

it's nice that can play 640x480 videos, but that’s not a lot when everyone else is playing 720p, 1080p and 4K videos.

Everyone? Everyone except most Amiga related things. I mean fastest OS4 and MorphOS systems stll have a hard time with full hd videos (and don't even dream about 4k videos!). Hence, in "our world" it is actually still remarkable to replay 640x480 videos.

_________________
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MorphOS user since V0.4 (2001)

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Mr-Z 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 19-Nov-2016 5:17:00
#638 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 24-May-2005
Posts: 171
From: De Keistad, Netherlands

Implementing AMMX did not take that long, Gunnar took care of that pretty fast.
That only one app supports it currently is because it is new, but can be very useful to speedup a lot of things, maybe an AMMX version of MPEGA library or data types just to name something.
Riva was updated with AMMX to give an example how much faster software can run with it.

The reason the FPU is not implemented yet is that they First had to implement the new memory controller so that Apollo core is ready for V1200, that as we know will have better specs then v500/v600.
The new memory controller that will be in Gold core 2 also has benefits for the current V600, it's much faster then before.
The FPU is already done and is being tested by Gunnar and the team, I do agree it should be the next goal to implement now.
And from Gold 2 you have some really nice tools to profile now (with he performance counters for example) a feature we never had before on classic Amiga.

All I'm trying to say is, they are a small team and doing some wonderful work here, cut them some slack and please be supportive.
In my humble opinion this is the coolest project in Classic Amiga since a long time and finally we can have something faster then a 68060 and RTG for the masses.

I use my A600 Vampire 2 every single day, the last time i had so much fun with my Amiga was when i bought my Blizz PPC and Bvision 16 years ago!



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Seiya 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 19-Nov-2016 13:11:41
#639 ]
Super Member
Joined: 19-Aug-2006
Posts: 1321
From: Italia

@Mr-Z

Quote:

finally we can have something faster then a 68060 and RTG for the masses.


no, it is a project for an elite of users with much money to spend on.
Raspberry Pi is a project for masses, but you know, when talking about Amiga someone thinks price over 300 is for masses.

Last edited by Seiya on 19-Nov-2016 at 01:15 PM.
Last edited by Seiya on 19-Nov-2016 at 01:13 PM.
Last edited by Seiya on 19-Nov-2016 at 01:12 PM.

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Overflow 
Re: News about Vampire and Apollo
Posted on 19-Nov-2016 13:22:37
#640 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2012
Posts: 1175
From: Norway

@Seiya

Its all relative.

Getting the original 060 and RTG hardware for your 680x0 hardware, it will set you back ALOT more, and for old hardware that might fail at any moment. If you are not a decent hardware tinker, you have to ship it off for repairs, which will add up to 100s of euros rather quickly.

Amiga related products are hobby products, and the price will always reflect that. Fewer units to recover the development/production cost. Simple math really.

If you find it to be too expensive, there is always emulation.

Last edited by Overflow on 19-Nov-2016 at 01:29 PM.
Last edited by Overflow on 19-Nov-2016 at 01:29 PM.
Last edited by Overflow on 19-Nov-2016 at 01:28 PM.
Last edited by Overflow on 19-Nov-2016 at 01:24 PM.

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