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PosterThread
Chris_Y 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 23-Aug-2016 23:00:58
#21 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2003
Posts: 3203
From: Beds, UK

@cgutjahr

Quote:

Does really dr2d handle everything SVG/EPS does?


Probably not, but basic line drawing, fills, etc are the same. The superclass isn't necessarily limited to supporting only DR2D attributes (although copy/paste will be - but the DR2D spec can always be added to for interchange purposes)

Quote:
Does that support formatting?


AmigaGuide is a document subclass, so yes. Although I must admit I don't really understand how document subclasses work, so the AmigaGuide datatype is probably doing most of the work itself. My point was more that it is possible, not that it is easy

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Raffaele 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 24-Aug-2016 7:28:08
#22 ]
Super Member
Joined: 7-Dec-2005
Posts: 1906
From: Naples, Italy

@cgutjahr

Quote:

cgutjahr wrote:
@Raffaele

As for XML: There already is a shared library for handling XML, no? Not sure why you'd need a datatype for that.


Well, dunno!

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broadblues 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 24-Aug-2016 11:14:27
#23 ]
Amiga Developer Team
Joined: 20-Jul-2004
Posts: 4446
From: Portsmouth England

@Chris_Y

You are confusing groups and classes. amigaguide is GID_DOCUMENT but it's not subclass of anything (apart from DATATYPESCLASS obviously) same goes for SimplHTML a Rich Text class would likely also be it's own root as it is totally different in nature from the above two types.

There isn't a document root class per seh, nor does there need to be, thought if there were several simlar types of document, they might be designed it inherit code from a common class.



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broadblues 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 24-Aug-2016 11:26:43
#24 ]
Amiga Developer Team
Joined: 20-Jul-2004
Posts: 4446
From: Portsmouth England

@Raffaele

Quote:

As long as build new productivity software with advanced features such as capable tomdeal with XML, Excel files, Word for windows files, HDR graphic files, nd so on, it requires lots of efforts and long time to develop, what if in the meanwhile is it more easy and feasable to just build datatypes capable to show these kind of files, just in read mode only.


I thnk you underestimate the work involved even in 'read ony' for some of those formats.

Quote:

XML,


Trivial, ust add some syntax highlighting for clatity, otherwise it's a straight text.datatype subclass.

Quote:

Excel files,


Spread sheets are never read only as such they perform calculations and all sorts so datatype for these is meaning less.

Quote:

Word for windows files,


Lots of work to make good viewer class, you could add PDFs and a few other to this group, even some amiga native formats, but it would be no trivial job even for those.

Quote:

HDR graphic files,


picture.datatype classes "trivial" though loading of the HDR data rather than converting to 32bit would require a new picture.dataype , but it's of limited use in most contexts anyway.


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amigakit 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 24-Aug-2016 12:34:11
#25 ]
Amiga Kit
Joined: 28-Jun-2004
Posts: 2515
From: www.amigakit.com


I wish there was a sound.datatype that supported streaming ...

Last edited by amigakit on 24-Aug-2016 at 12:34 PM.

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kamelito 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 24-Aug-2016 13:07:33
#26 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 26-Jul-2004
Posts: 813
From: Unknown

@amigakit

Isn't Kalametee from the Aros team working on such datatype?
Kamelito

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eliyahu 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 24-Aug-2016 13:07:53
#27 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2010
Posts: 1957
From: Waterbury, Connecticut (USA)

@amigakit

oh, you tease....

-- eliyahu

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kamelito 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 24-Aug-2016 13:29:39
#28 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 26-Jul-2004
Posts: 813
From: Unknown

how about PowerPoint ?
http://amigadev.free.fr/pointrider/index.html

Kamelito

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RodTerl 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 24-Aug-2016 16:16:14
#29 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 6-Sep-2004
Posts: 589
From: Rossendale

Im always puzzled when it comes to IFF claiming not to support streaming and other discontinous data styles?

Isnt that what CAT, Catalog of IFF chunks is supposed to be for, and the substructure ability?

As in, like MPEG movies, IFF ANIM uses Temporal interframe compression, Sigma Delta for IFF, Predicted for MPEG? therefore, wouldnt it be that each P Frame would be an IFF file, and have however many associated 8SVX or associate audio channel samples for that particular frame?

Headers means you get which frame it is of a sequence so far, and can use a negative number or NAN etc to show its an unknown file size, for real time streaming, or fixed value for streaming from prerecorded?

IFF supports 2 gigabyte files in 32 bit mode and its possible to get 700 Meg ISO Movies?

Please dont limit next gen IFF to only 64 bit, we are already looking to exceed that limit in cloud servers, and UUID are much larger.

I also thought the whole point behind Datatype>RAW>Datatype was to avoid the Whole Exponential explosion in translation code needed for each and every single possible mix of data.

Dpaint can put text in graphics and with Brush, put graphics in text, and it would be intresting to see that text be in image processable by locale and other translation methods as required.

First rule of computers. Everything that a human wishes to interact with, is just Bits in the machine.

EVERYTHING IS TRANSLATED FOR HUMANS.

This is why I dislike XML, C and other American English enforced interfaces.

Tokenised BASIC with computer based optimisation and compilation of reusable libraries.

You only need one overloaded neuron and one overloaded synapse to duplicate everything from a slug to Deep Thought.

If a standard bolt isnt long enough to fix two things together, create a sub function for a longer bolt, as long as it passes all other requirements, instead of totally redesigning the idea of the fixing.

If a function is used enough, stick it in hardware.

Whyfor no hardware accelerated FFT function for MPEG, MP3, JPEG and the other 99.9% of all system load these days?

I used to like accessing the Met Office website using HTML.datatype on Multiviewer with OpenURL.library. the front page doesnt look all that different but theres an awful lot of extra junk on there now, like Flash video, adverts etc.

Did I see in Dr Dobbs somewhere that unlike an infinitely complex Operating System, XML cannot be verified?

Sorry. Too enthusiastic again.

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Raffaele 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 24-Aug-2016 17:33:05
#30 ]
Super Member
Joined: 7-Dec-2005
Posts: 1906
From: Naples, Italy

@broadblues

Quote:

broadblues wrote:
@Raffaele

Quote:

As long as build new productivity software with advanced features such as capable tomdeal with XML, Excel files, Word for windows files, HDR graphic files, nd so on, it requires lots of efforts and long time to develop, what if in the meanwhile is it more easy and feasable to just build datatypes capable to show these kind of files, just in read mode only.


I thnk you underestimate the work involved even in 'read ony' for some of those formats.


I just made some examples.
It is up to the developers to tell community if work is feasable or not or if requires an amount of work so heavy that it is better to make a whole program to handle it, such as a new database.

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amigakit 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 24-Aug-2016 20:20:51
#31 ]
Amiga Kit
Joined: 28-Jun-2004
Posts: 2515
From: www.amigakit.com

@kamelit0

I am not sure.

Just musing, I was just wondering wouldn't it be nice if AmigaOS had an enhanced sound.datatype that supported streaming, multichannel 16-bit/32-bit/fp 64bit with internal support for up to named 19 channels..

Last edited by amigakit on 24-Aug-2016 at 08:28 PM.
Last edited by amigakit on 24-Aug-2016 at 08:25 PM.
Last edited by amigakit on 24-Aug-2016 at 08:21 PM.

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terminills 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 24-Aug-2016 20:32:56
#32 ]
AROS Core Developer
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 1472
From: Unknown

@kamelit0

Quote:
Isn't Kalametee from the Aros team working on such datatype?



Yes he is.


He likes to post pics and videos...


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCMRKRD_DakLKYuS4UfqyWRA

Last edited by terminills on 24-Aug-2016 at 08:36 PM.

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Chris_Y 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 24-Aug-2016 23:04:43
#33 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2003
Posts: 3203
From: Beds, UK

@broadblues

Well, I did say I wasn't sure how it worked
Good explanation, thanks.

@RodTerl

I don't think anybody has ever claimed IFF doesn't support streaming. IFF ANIM streams fine, as does CDXL (although I'm not 100% sure that's IFF). So do 8SVX and AIFF and WAVE (little-endian IFF), come to that.

Last edited by Chris_Y on 24-Aug-2016 at 11:06 PM.
Last edited by Chris_Y on 24-Aug-2016 at 11:05 PM.

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Templario 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 27-Aug-2016 18:51:26
#34 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2004
Posts: 3663
From: Unknown

@Raffaele
And for new web graphic format as "apng" or animation png and WebP? To use with the Amiga browsers for example or graphic programs.

Last edited by Templario on 27-Aug-2016 at 06:53 PM.

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Raffaele 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 27-Aug-2016 20:51:10
#35 ]
Super Member
Joined: 7-Dec-2005
Posts: 1906
From: Naples, Italy

@Templario

Sounds nice, but why you asked me? I agree on any new datatype supported by our platforms.

P.S. AFAIK aPNG seems me already supported in OWB, but dunno if in any Amiga porting or in MorphOS only...

And by BTW sure launching an entire browser just to see a little anim pic seems me very few pratic and not sure Amiga Style, but more Windows Style.

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Templario 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 28-Aug-2016 9:22:38
#36 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2004
Posts: 3663
From: Unknown

@Raffaele
I'm sorry, I only give the idea.

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itix 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 28-Aug-2016 9:52:14
#37 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Dec-2004
Posts: 3398
From: Freedom world

@Chris_Y

Quote:

I don't think anybody has ever claimed IFF doesn't support streaming. IFF ANIM streams fine, as does CDXL (although I'm not 100% sure that's IFF). So do 8SVX and AIFF and WAVE (little-endian IFF), come to that.


IFF does not have streaming capabilities comparable to MPEG. IFF file can be read like a stream but it is not suitable for broadcasting.

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itix 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 28-Aug-2016 10:03:27
#38 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Dec-2004
Posts: 3398
From: Freedom world

@RodTerl

Quote:

As in, like MPEG movies, IFF ANIM uses Temporal interframe compression, Sigma Delta for IFF, Predicted for MPEG? therefore, wouldnt it be that each P Frame would be an IFF file, and have however many associated 8SVX or associate audio channel samples for that particular frame?


Not really. It is difficult to synchronize stream if you jump to arbitrary position in a stream. You would have to locate next IFF frame but also detect and discard false positives.

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Chris_Y 
Re: New datatypes?
Posted on 28-Aug-2016 11:01:17
#39 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2003
Posts: 3203
From: Beds, UK

@itix

Quote:

itix wrote:
IFF does not have streaming capabilities comparable to MPEG. IFF file can be read like a stream but it is not suitable for broadcasting.


I understood the context to be streaming from disk, rather than broadcasting which needs special handling. I daresay you could invent an IFF style format which supported it, although I'm not sure I see the point.

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