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billt 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 4-Mar-2017 20:14:56
#21 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 24-Oct-2003
Posts: 2999
From: Maryland, USA

@Raziel
While they might choose to charge for it, I do not see any announcement. I see simeone asking about a price, and someone else abbreviating the Fry from Futurama meme about "Shut up and take my money." Nowhere does anyone, at the time I looked and thus after your post here, suggest that will make us pay.

@Vulture
Nothing about MPL or LGPL3+ forbid selling the end product for profit, so they could end up doing this. The licenses do require source code availability, so a recompile could be available shortly after first purchase... But it isnt GPL, so there could be other files created for the overall effoet which are not open-sourced, and thus must be decyphered and reumplemented, slowing down a simple recompile release without cost.

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Raziel 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 4-Mar-2017 21:17:01
#22 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 17-Apr-2004
Posts: 2391
From: A haunted Castle somewhere in the Bavarian Mountains

@all

I don't use facebook, i was merely c&p'ing the fb item from amiga-news.de where they claim that it will be commercially distributed...and yes, rereading what i wrote and rereading the amiga-news.de item, i found nothing where it said that they will charge anything for it, rather put it in a package with other software one has to pay for --> Enhancer i.e.

Last edited by Raziel on 04-Mar-2017 at 09:18 PM.

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StantheAmigaMan 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 4-Mar-2017 21:32:58
#23 ]
Member
Joined: 29-Aug-2015
Posts: 70
From: Havre de Grace, MD

@Niolator

It will be mine, too, when this comes out.

now if I can just find the right printer. Postscript or PCL3? HP or Xerox?

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cgutjahr 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 4-Mar-2017 21:59:09
#24 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 779
From: Unknown

@Raziel

Quote:

from amiga-news.de where they claim that it will be commercially distributed...

This has actually been communicated from the very start. LibreOffice was announced at AmiWest 2012, and during that weekend Robert Bernardo recorded a video interview with Trevor, where the latter confirms that the software will be sold. The video used to be available here but blip.tv always required flash and the link seems to be down now. Our German summary is available here.

@ferrels:

Quote:

Wasn't this announced years ago under OpenOffice before it forked into LibreOffice?

Different project. You are talking about this effort from 2005/2006, which was initiated by Thomas Frieden but only resulted in a website and a few ported dependencies before it got abandoned.

@ExiE:

Quote:

Is it really a problem? LO is usually using its own GUI toolkit except file requesters

LO is always using its own GUI toolkit, but said GUI toolkit can be adapted to emulate the native one or even use it as much as possible. I think there still not 'there' for Mac OS (which is why an independent team is working on a separate port which is using the native GUI), but the Windows and Linux ports look like a perfectly normal, native application.

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cgutjahr 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 4-Mar-2017 22:18:53
#25 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 779
From: Unknown

@ExiE

Quote:

Is it really a problem?

This is done by one (or maybe even both) of the guys responsible for the Timberwolf debacle. Instead of already making up excuses again ("LO is not really native anywhere"), you should encourage people to hold back their money and try out a demo version of the software first.

Maybe this time it will work out - I'm all for it, LibreOffice would be a milestone. But nobody involved with this should get the benefit of the doubt.

We don't know the price, the amount of features that will be missing, what version it will be (again: this was started five years ago), what - if any - efforts will be made to make this more Amiga-like (Intuition menus? Support for screens? ARexx port? Button layout in requesters?) or if the complete source code will be made available. Let alone what happens once the initial release is out the door - will the next update cost money aswell?

If I hear somebody say "shut up and take my money", I'll hurt him or her.

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pavlor 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 4-Mar-2017 23:24:44
#26 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 8103
From: Unknown

@cgutjahr

Quote:
If I hear somebody say


Shut up and take my money!

Quote:
I'll hurt him or her.


Talk is cheap...

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ne_one 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 4-Mar-2017 23:47:10
#27 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Jun-2005
Posts: 679
From: Unknown

@cgutjahr

Quote:
If I hear somebody say "shut up and take my money", I'll hurt him or her.


It is a bit much considering the announcement was an informal request for beta testers but the same applies to any other conjecture.

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klx300r 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 5-Mar-2017 4:48:50
#28 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 4-Mar-2008
Posts: 3087
From: Toronto, Canada

be nice as we've been a waitin a loooong time BUT first we need someone to complete Timberwolf as we were soon close until the bros gave up.....

Last edited by klx300r on 05-Mar-2017 at 04:49 AM.

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outrun1978 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 5-Mar-2017 7:07:15
#29 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 22-Feb-2015
Posts: 170
From: Stockport, England

@StantheAmigaMan

If it helps I use a Xerox 3225 workcentre with my current Amigaone 500 set up. Works great with PostScript and supports PCL3 emulation also 😀

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mr2 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 5-Mar-2017 7:19:31
#30 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 3-Feb-2004
Posts: 619
From: Poland

@StantheAmigaMan

...or try cloud printing. I bought cheap HP printer and send e-mails (witch attached pdf/doc/txt/docx/jpg)
via HP servers to my printer. Not 100% reliable but no need to have drivers.

Last edited by mr2 on 05-Mar-2017 at 07:21 AM.

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ExiE 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 5-Mar-2017 9:56:20
#31 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 18-May-2004
Posts: 430
From: Czech Amiga News

@cgutjahr

Quote:
This is done by one (or maybe even both) of the guys responsible for the Timberwolf debacle. Instead of already making up excuses again ("LO is not really native anywhere"), you should encourage people to hold back their money and try out a demo version of the software first.


Quote:
We don't know the price, the amount of features that will be missing, what version it will be (again: this was started five years ago), what - if any - efforts will be made to make this more Amiga-like (Intuition menus? Support for screens? ARexx port? Button layout in requesters?) or if the complete source code will be made available. Let alone what happens once the initial release is out the door - will the next update cost money aswell?


There You put two different things together (from my point of view). I don't care that much about native GUI as long as it is GUI I know from linux/pc version of LO.

But I do care about the other things coz I remember Timberwolf fiasco very well (even though I also admit misconduct on the side of bounty administrator).

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Raziel 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 5-Mar-2017 10:26:17
#32 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 17-Apr-2004
Posts: 2391
From: A haunted Castle somewhere in the Bavarian Mountains

@GUI

Actually if you take a look at the beta version it doesn't look alien to me...

Mason did a great job with his AISS icons and the ones in the picture fits in to that style.

I could easily live with that, then again i was using LO on a PC/Linux for years now

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Seiya 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 5-Mar-2017 10:58:41
#33 ]
Super Member
Joined: 19-Aug-2006
Posts: 1345
From: Italia

LibreOffice is a free and open source office suite;
LGPL3/MPL 2.0 license;
free for Windows, Mac, Gnu/Linux and Android

LibreOffice is not the first and will not the last that on Amiga is commercial and for any other OS is free with LGPL licence.


Last edited by Seiya on 05-Mar-2017 at 11:01 AM.

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ChrisH 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 5-Mar-2017 11:02:06
#34 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2005
Posts: 6669
From: Unknown

@Raziel Quote:
Actually if you take a look at the beta version it doesn't look alien to me...

One of the main "problem" with ports that use foreign GUI toolkits is that they don't use Amiga-style menus, and instead embed the menu in the window itself. That's a really small thing, but it does shout out "Not made for Amiga".

I'm not even sure why it's still a problem. Recent versions of OS4 support arbitrarily deep menus, so I can't see what else is stopping the use of Amiga menus, apart from it being a lot of conversion work.

I suppose a second common issue (with ports that use foreign GUI toolkits) is that resizing windows is often strangely done, and I believe this is much harder to solve due to technical differences in how Intuition handles resizing windows. (But I don't know if this is an issue with the LibreOffice port.)

Last edited by ChrisH on 05-Mar-2017 at 11:07 AM.
Last edited by ChrisH on 05-Mar-2017 at 11:02 AM.

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ExiE 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 5-Mar-2017 12:11:10
#35 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 18-May-2004
Posts: 430
From: Czech Amiga News

@ChrisH

Quote:
I'm not even sure why it's still a problem. Recent versions of OS4 support arbitrarily deep menus, so I can't see what else is stopping the use of Amiga menus, apart from it being a lot of conversion work.


This will sound like blasphemy but Amiga style menus on the top of the screen are not such a good idea anymore on big screens and applications where you use the menu a lot...

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kas1e 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 5-Mar-2017 12:41:54
#36 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Jan-2004
Posts: 3140
From: Russia

@Raziel
Quote:

Actually if you take a look at the beta version it doesn't look alien to me...

I probably wasn't clear enough on that : i mean not only images in the toolbar , but mostly RMB menus. I.e. masons icons are good, and toolbar with aiss icons is nice , but RMB menu is more important (at least for me). When it usuall "amigaos menu", its all feels good and nice. When its like in timberwol, it feels alien, and, what is more important than just looks : slower in navigation, slower in responce. Not _THAT_ slower, but i can notice the difference.

In QT (as you know for sure) Alfkil add that native menu support, and if the same can be done for LibreOffice, that will be for sure nice. Code of QT port even on sourceforge, so can be done, but i doub't it will be done , as it wasn't done for timberwolf :)



Last edited by kas1e on 05-Mar-2017 at 12:43 PM.

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DC_Edge 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 5-Mar-2017 12:58:24
#37 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 1-Oct-2003
Posts: 172
From: France

@Seiya

Being gpl doesn't mean they can't ask fir money.
BUT they'll have to redistribute the sourcecode anyway or they break gpl licence. That way i'll be the first to inform fsf....
If source code is there then no problem

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Trixie 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 5-Mar-2017 13:35:53
#38 ]
Super Member
Joined: 1-Sep-2003
Posts: 1576
From: Czech Republic

@DC_Edge

LibreOffice is primarily licensed under MPL 2.0, which means that Amiga-specific parts can remain closed and proprietary. In other words, the things needed to compile an Amiga version will not be made available. A-EON would be foolish to invest heaps of money into something that every Tom, Jack and Harry will then be able to compile for themselves.

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cgutjahr 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 5-Mar-2017 14:35:54
#39 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 779
From: Unknown

@ExiE

Quote:

There You put two different things together (from my point of view). I don't care that much about native GUI as long as it is GUI I know from linux/pc version of LO.

Yeah, I actually confused you and Pavlor - and thinking that Pavlor had just stated that the "GUI is never native anyway" got me all worked up ;) Apologies.

Quote:

This will sound like blasphemy but Amiga style menus on the top of the screen are not such a good idea anymore on big screens and applications where you use the menu a lot...

Even if that would be true - the most important aspect of a GUI is consistency - all applications should behave the same way. And the LibreOffice menu not being a native menu has nothing to do with ergonomics, it's just cheaper this way.

And it's not just about the location: think of keyboard shortcuts, or the ability to multi-select that Amiga menus give you.

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wawa 
Re: LibreOffice coming for AOS4
Posted on 5-Mar-2017 14:51:26
#40 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 5500
From: Unknown

@cgutjahr

Quote:
the most important aspect of a GUI is consistency - all applications should behave the same way


actually on genuine amiga there were a lot of inconsistent guis not following the style guide. among that many if not most major applications, lightwave, brilliance, adpro, imagefx, trackers, some further graphic, video and porphing apps. i liked that. had some unique flair.

the right button menu issue is probably important though.

i dont see too much to complain about the subject here. it is good that after ten years of debacle libre office writer for os4 has arrived in a state where you can actually post a screenshot of it on internet. not that it particularly attracts me to os4, but it is certainly good for os4 users.

Last edited by wawa on 05-Mar-2017 at 02:52 PM.
Last edited by wawa on 05-Mar-2017 at 02:51 PM.

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