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      /  It's time to join the forces - Part IV
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wawa 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 14:48:16
#61 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 6259
From: Unknown

@Srtest

Quote:
Just like you could see on that Arstechinka article when all the ones who live on whatever happens in 4.1 land, came out to try and use that article to hurt 4.1 and steer the ship.


you think everybody who commented on some astechnica article about os4 is a troll coming from here and has an agenda to dimnish os4? how convenient. but maybe its just the average public expressing their opinions?

Quote:
BTW, I see that on Amiga.org when someone does the same to you on you precious Vamp you lose your senses because you get to taste some of your own medicine.


id love to be linked to where i lose my senses about vampire ;)

Quote:
No thank you. If I need to choose between the agenda-driven personalities here and perhaps some small minded leadership it's not a choice at all.


ok so how "small minded leadership" differs from "agenda-driven personalities"? given some historical references it may occur to be one and the same.

Last edited by wawa on 21-Jan-2018 at 02:48 PM.

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Srtest 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 15:04:03
#62 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Nov-2016
Posts: 259
From: Israel, Haderah

@wawa

"ok so how "small minded leadership" differs from "agenda-driven personalities"? given some historical references it may occur to be one and the same."

Fine they are the same so we might as well let the current situation continue... you see? I have actually some different stuff to do other than linger here doing the exact same old same ole routine. You just proved your own arguments as futile. I prefer to focus on the positives in the time that I'm here and not having to deal with the haters.

Amigablitter had all good intentions yet the discussion was once again hijacked. I for one had never anything bad to say about Aros or Morph as far as their effort into sustaining an OS. As far as hardware that's is all part of the argument which the current direction is as good as whatever else is suggested by the agenda people who can't seem to know anything about current trends in tech, markets and usages.

The only way to see anything as the next step is to put anything self-serving aside and try to see how can I add to what Amigablitter suggested. You might try something along these lines from time to time.

Last edited by Srtest on 21-Jan-2018 at 03:05 PM.
Last edited by Srtest on 21-Jan-2018 at 03:05 PM.

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AmigaMac 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 15:06:30
#63 ]
Super Member
Joined: 26-Oct-2002
Posts: 1094
From: 3rd Rock from the Sun!

There is no good excuse for the 3 major factions (AOS, MorphOS, and AROS) can't collaborate for the common good of the Amiga platform. This goes beyond the technology differences and is more about the cultures needing to come together.

In short, the red versus blue debate must die!

Last edited by AmigaMac on 21-Jan-2018 at 03:08 PM.
Last edited by AmigaMac on 21-Jan-2018 at 03:08 PM.
Last edited by AmigaMac on 21-Jan-2018 at 03:06 PM.

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Signal 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 15:15:42
#64 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 1-Jun-2013
Posts: 664
From: USA

@ntromans

Fantasy mode is just fine. SO many times fantasy becomes reality that it should not be discouraged or relegated to the realm of "crazy talk".

Your modular system (post #46) is is VERY close to Black Boxing the original Amiga. The custom chips, (processing units), actually did all the work and the OS acted mostly as coordinator.

This is also close to how the dual CPU G5 (POWER4) Macs worked.

You also mentioned the three OS's that could run on it. Now everybody is at least playing the same game and the competition becomes reasonable, and beneficial.

Got more?

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vision 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 16:23:44
#65 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 8-Jun-2005
Posts: 480
From: Unknown

@AmigaBlitter
Great effort, but the only viable way is AROS and most people here refuse to accept it, so end of the story: the other two camps will die of greed and arrogancy, and aros will continue to languish until new devs come.

I know you will say these are harsh words, but life is hard and you have been living in fantasy worlds for too many time, and throwing the Amiga platform to death because you cheat to yourselves.

The sad thruth is:
- Corrent owners of the 2 camps will never accept other camp becuse of economic and personal reaons, they would see that as a "surrender", so it won´t happen.
-The only viable processors right now are x64 (or arms 64). Support for 32 bits has ended, and it has sense because memory needs actually make them obsolete.
- The only platfom which support the required technologies to survive and don´t suffer from "licenses" or "machito" problems is AROS ABI1 64.

Accept this or keep wasting your time.

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OneTimer1 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 16:48:45
#66 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 3-Aug-2015
Posts: 962
From: Unknown

@wawa

Quote:


counceling and consultation is what is within doable. and it happens in particular cases. imagine the situation, where you need to prove behaviour of some os function on different targets, or even someone who has insight into internals and can take part in some clean room process.


I remembered the discussions with AfA Author Bernd Roesch about compatibility (with AOS3 and other AmigaOIDs) and he refused to be compatible as long as he could patch some functions and higher version numbers into his code.

I remembered the discussions between Strohmeier and others about compatibility issues on SFS.

All this discussions didn't help the system, the Fanboys who where defending their current OS coders, made cooperation even worse.

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wawa 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 17:24:31
#67 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 6259
From: Unknown

@OneTimer1

ixemul library wasnt compatible along its versions and across its os4 and morphos forks. so bernds unorthodox approach, even if questionable, didnt make it exactly worse. i leave the other example uncommented, but these isolated cases do not necessarily prove to be a rule.

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wawa 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 17:46:48
#68 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 6259
From: Unknown

@Srtest

Quote:
Amigablitter had all good intentions yet the discussion was once again hijacked.


among others i have indicated vialble field for cooperation. sorry if it deosnt match your expectations, but we dont have any influence on os4 development. if you tink its incorrect, you might offer an alternate patch in simple words.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 17:56:35
#69 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 12795
From: Norway

@AmigaBlitter

So how is this going to work, you wont me write code for 7 operating system instead of just 1 and and get no pay for it same deal as now? I don't have lot free time as it is.

1. WarpOS (PPC),
2. PowerUP (PPC),
3. pOS (68k),
4. AROS (68k, PPC, 32bit intel, 64bit intel, ARM)
5. MorphOS (PPC/((680x0 emu)))
6. AmigaOS 3.x and below. (68k)
7. AmigaOS 4.x (PPC/((680x0 emu)))

As soon as there are no developers working on a platform, it is EOL, it just how it is.

There is like 8 different hardware platforms.

* Draco computers
* OCS/ECS Amiga 500/600/2000/3000 (AmigaOS1.3)
* AGA Amiga 1200/4000 (AmigaOS3.1)
* PowerPC AmigaONE/Pegsaus (MorphOS/AmigaOS4.x)
* 32bit Intel PC (AROS)
* 64bit Intel PC (AROS)
* Rasbary Pe (AROS)
* 68080 (FPGA)

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 21-Jan-2018 at 06:27 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 21-Jan-2018 at 06:23 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 21-Jan-2018 at 06:22 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 21-Jan-2018 at 06:20 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 21-Jan-2018 at 06:11 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 21-Jan-2018 at 06:10 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 21-Jan-2018 at 06:08 PM.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 18:32:26
#70 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 12795
From: Norway

@AmigaBlitter

Maybe what your rally asking is can we please stop making Amiga software and write SDL software instead.

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wawa 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 19:54:10
#71 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 6259
From: Unknown

@NutsAboutAmiga

you forgot a1222/tabor/spe which is an upcoming diffeent os4 target.

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wawa 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 19:58:01
#72 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 6259
From: Unknown

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:
Maybe what your rally asking is can we please stop making Amiga software and write SDL software instead.


or simply contribute source code to aros repository (contribs) equipped with necessary ifdefs, where appropriate for different platforms. this way code is being rendered portable, endian agnostic, 64bit safe and compilable for maximal amount of targets. it might be very convenient for eventual architecture switch or adaptations, even as slight as in case of tabor/spe.

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Signal 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 19:58:37
#73 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 1-Jun-2013
Posts: 664
From: USA

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

NutsAboutAmiga wrote:

So how is this going to work, you wont me write code for 7 operating system instead of just 1 and and get no pay for it same deal as now? I don't have lot free time as it is.

There is like 8 different hardware platforms.


And just how much time do you waste sleeping?

Since it seems you like tinkering with various OS's, would it be easier to do it on a single hardware platform with various stages of complexity/usability . Not talking cost here.

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wawa 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 20:04:45
#74 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 6259
From: Unknown

btw, as we are speaking someone is reviving ppc target (sam440/460branch) of aros. the nightly should be available for testing any moment now. i wont be able to test it, but i might be able to compile for ppc or look into making it compile.

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OneTimer1 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 20:18:10
#75 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 3-Aug-2015
Posts: 962
From: Unknown

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:


Maybe what your rally asking is can we please stop making Amiga software and write SDL software instead.


There are a lot of people hwo are still working on AGA Games. Sadly this Games will never be ported to AOS4, MorphOS or AROS but they would be needed there.

Last edited by OneTimer1 on 21-Jan-2018 at 08:19 PM.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 20:32:26
#76 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 12795
From: Norway

@wawa

AltiVec too.. if thinking about optimizing stuff.
SEE and SEE2 on INTL/AMD cpu's

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 21-Jan-2018 at 08:35 PM.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 20:37:59
#77 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 12795
From: Norway

@OneTimer1

Can always run it in UAE,

ideal you write one program that worked every where like do on portable E or Hollywood, I can see that happening for AMOSPro.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 21-Jan-2018 at 08:41 PM.

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wawa 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 20:38:23
#78 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 6259
From: Unknown

@NutsAboutAmiga
Quote:
AltiVec too..

exactly.

Quote:
then we kill that excuse.


thats exemplraric. not being intersted in os4 requires an "execuse".

Last edited by wawa on 21-Jan-2018 at 08:40 PM.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 20:42:50
#79 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 12795
From: Norway

@wawa

your just too quick, edited my comment, sorry

Anyway the idea that you can at least write Amos programs without need of UAE, to be start.

anyway there are some advantages being able to use normal text editor, like cooperation on GITHUB, team of developers working on the same AMOS game, might then be possible.
Being able to use diff tools compare different sources codes.

copy and paste, spell checking thins things are not so easy to do when using the AmosPro editor.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 21-Jan-2018 at 09:34 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 21-Jan-2018 at 08:49 PM.

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Srtest 
Re: It's time to join the forces - Part IV
Posted on 21-Jan-2018 20:48:08
#80 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Nov-2016
Posts: 259
From: Israel, Haderah

@NutsAboutAmiga

Is writing software "for everything" means it is the opposite of it being optimized for specific situations or hardware/software combinations?

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