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/  Forum Index
   /  Amiga OS4 Hardware
      /  What should "entry level hardware" be like?
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PosterThread
Crumb 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 8-Feb-2006 8:54:22
#161 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Mar-2003
Posts: 2208
From: Zaragoza (Aragonian State)

@Troika

contact Dennis, the miniMig guy to integrate his FPGA implementation of custom chips and make a PPC AGA compatible miggy ;-P

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CodeSmith 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 8-Feb-2006 9:10:01
#162 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 3045
From: USA

@olegil

Um, IIRC the 2272 is a peripheral controller, meaning that it can't be used in host mode.

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olegil 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 8-Feb-2006 11:31:18
#163 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Aug-2003
Posts: 5887
From: Work

@CodeSmith

Doh!

Ok, I didn't see that at all. So, it'll unfortunately have to be PCI based, which completely sucks, layout wise.

PCI topology will be something along the lines of:
Bus 1: SoC PCI2 - ATX slot 7
Bus 2: SoC PCI1 - ATX slot 6 - PLX6150 66MHz
Bus 3: PLZ6150 33MHz - USB controller - ATX slot 5 - ATX slot 4

And before you ask, the slot numbers refer to the ATX specification.
So far I've made a ATX-compliant starting point, with screw holes, IO backplate and PCI slots. We've got quite some distance ahead of us

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

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olegil 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 8-Feb-2006 13:11:10
#164 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Aug-2003
Posts: 5887
From: Work

@olegil

Ok, new chip. It's got 2 OHC and 1 EHC controllers, 5 external ports, and will route signals to the corresponding controller based on bitrate (so a 480Mbps port will be connected to the EHC, and a 12Mbps will be connected to one of the OHCs).

So, is the USB driver in OS4 OHC or UHC, and who do I have to sleep with to get an EHC driver?

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

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olegil 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 8-Feb-2006 16:13:13
#165 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Aug-2003
Posts: 5887
From: Work

@olegil

Seems the SoC is even cheaper than I feared. Just found the price $91 quoted at the EBV websearch.

16 weeks lead time, so I should order up a handful right away if I want to have them by summer

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

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CodeSmith 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 8-Feb-2006 17:33:14
#166 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 3045
From: USA

@olegil

Yeah, sorry to rain on your parade... I knew about this chip, because it's the one that the gp2x handheld uses internally. There was some hope initially in the user community for the ability to plug all manner of USB peripherals to it, but after some research it was discovered (by the user community, I'm sure the company that makes the device knew all along ) that the chip is for peripherals only. I was actually half-hoping that you'd slap me silly and tell me "see, here in the datasheet it says it can do host too"

Here's a crazy idea... can't you use a PLD (CPLD/FPGA) as glue logic so that the PCI USB chip talks to the system like it was an SRAM? would that simplify layout or not really make a difference?

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olegil 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 8-Feb-2006 19:19:53
#167 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Aug-2003
Posts: 5887
From: Work

@CodeSmith

That would just be silly, since there are already three PCI busses on the board

I'll be placing a NEC 5-port USB host controller (3 controllers and 5 ports in one chip) next to the PCI bridge, on the 33MHz PCI bus. All in all, it ain't too bad.

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

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olegil 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 8-Feb-2006 19:22:08
#168 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Aug-2003
Posts: 5887
From: Work

@CodeSmith

Btw, can't you just make a really simple USB host based on a 48MHz Atmel AVRUSB microcontroller that acts like a repeater between two peripherals? Should be doable, and cheap

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

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nzv58l 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 8-Feb-2006 20:20:02
#169 ]
Super Member
Joined: 7-Oct-2003
Posts: 1640
From: Michigan

@olegil

Olegil, I'm not that much of a tech with hardware. In laymans terms, how hard would it be to make a board with a backbone on it? Are the connectors too expensive or could you use any kind of cheap connector and just wire it in?

I would like to see a board with a backbone type design with a through port so as you add devices you could sort of daisy chain them together and turn a small system into a monster. That way you could add things to your system without having much wasted space or problems with running out of room.

I think if it could be done it would make sense because you not only get to sell a mainboard, but you could also sell expansion boards that piggyback onto the backbone.

Would it be difficult to make a backbone that would be for any of the following expansion units? :

PCI
PCIE
Floppy Drive with a PCI port for a catweasle
CPU for a co-processor. ( I know OS4 is not there yet, but it looks like multiCPU support is at least a thought at this time)
Extra memory
AGP port
A legasy support expansion - zorro, video slot, AGA for compatability.

I see the expansions as sort of a simple board that allows extra things to be added to the system. I think the PCI or PCI E or AGP would probably be easy to do, however the legasy support expansion might be a bear. CPU co-processor I see might be a challange as well.

I tried to post my idea, but I am not sure how to get a picture to stick so I will send you the picture directly in a PM to see what you think.

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olegil 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 9-Feb-2006 13:04:48
#170 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Aug-2003
Posts: 5887
From: Work

@olegil

Hmm, seems the OS4 driver is UHCI.

Ok, I really really really need OHCI and EHCI drivers for this to become a reality.

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

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Coder 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 9-Feb-2006 13:07:31
#171 ]
Team Member
Joined: 15-May-2003
Posts: 4523
From: The Netherlands

@olegil

Quote:
Ok, I really really really need OHCI and EHCI drivers for this to become a reality.


How about setting up a site on which you can ask what you need and other relevant info? I always seem to miss info. Everything in one place.

Coder

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olegil 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 9-Feb-2006 14:23:35
#172 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Aug-2003
Posts: 5887
From: Work

@Coder

I'm still in the brainstorming phase of operation

Needless to say, in a short while I'll either shut up or go official on y'all

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

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Coder 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 11-Feb-2006 12:09:18
#173 ]
Team Member
Joined: 15-May-2003
Posts: 4523
From: The Netherlands

@olegil

I hope you go on.

Coder

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Samwel 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 11-Feb-2006 12:21:38
#174 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 7-Apr-2004
Posts: 3396
From: Sweden

@olegil

Hey wasn't they supposed to be working on a OHCI driver for OS4 final?!
I remember someone (Rogue?) saying as much. I could be wrong though.

EHCI was a totally other matter which they would not make a clear statement
about. If you don't take "Maybe", "If we got time" and "when it's done" as
clear statements.

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PhantomInterrogative 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 26-Jul-2017 18:02:32
#175 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 10-Sep-2004
Posts: 742
From: The Interrogative Lair

After doing some thought about the A1222, I remembered starting this thread over ten years ago. Looking over many of the comments, I found some interesting things. Olegil began making plans for an AMC440 based system. A year later ACube brought out the SAM440ep. This thread may have been more important than I thought it would ever be to the Amiga community.

Our threads are rifled with negative attacks on how underpowered the A1222 is. Yet, it fits many of the requirements this 2006 thread required. It is under 400 Euro. It is an entry level machine running at 1.2 GHz. It runs AmigaOS 4.1 FE. The only thing that it lacks is expandability (single slot). With that said, it is now 2017. Should our idea of an entry level PPC AmigaOS machine be brought up to date, or are our current hardware offerings sufficient for AmigaOS needs, and Amiga user wallets?

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I sold my SAM460ex lite... waiting for money to buy the X5000... or Amiga Reloaded... or an A1222... and OS4.2 FE update 9

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pavlor 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 26-Jul-2017 18:42:19
#176 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 8486
From: Unknown

@PhantomInterrogative

Hail fellow thread Necromancer!

Tabor has enough expansion possibilities (PCIe for GFX, RAM expansion, SATA, USB). This is much better than uA1 or SAM440ep. If the price is right, it could be ideal entry level machine.

Quote:
Our threads are rifled with negative attacks on how underpowered the A1222 is.


Slow and noncompatible FPU for sure is not good choice. We dont know real performance penalty, so there is plenty of space for speculations.

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PhantomInterrogative 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 26-Jul-2017 19:09:00
#177 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 10-Sep-2004
Posts: 742
From: The Interrogative Lair

@pavlor

Quote:
Hail fellow thread Necromancer!


Good threads don't die, they merely are archived.

You are quite right about expansion. I overlooked the expansion possibilities opened up by something as simple as a USB port. USB is not just for keyboards, mice, printers, scanners, and storage devices, but for audio expansion, video capture, and a whole host of other things.

With your point taken, the A1222 meets all of the requirements of this "walking thread."

_________________
I sold my SAM460ex lite... waiting for money to buy the X5000... or Amiga Reloaded... or an A1222... and OS4.2 FE update 9

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iggy 
Re: What should "entry level hardware" be like?
Posted on 26-Jul-2017 19:23:45
#178 ]
Super Member
Joined: 20-Oct-2010
Posts: 1175
From: Bear, Delaware USA

@PhantomInterrogative

Quote:
..."walking thread"


Ah, where is Rick Grimes when you need him?

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