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      /  AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
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elatour 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 16-Sep-2010 18:53:12
#601 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 18-Jan-2005
Posts: 936
From: Toronto, Canada

@T-J
Quote:
The saddest thing though is that CommodoreUSA's money men are coming in and stamping all over the efforts of smaller groups of engineers and developers. You know, people who actually do stuff?


Hmm... I hate to be the one to point this out, but I'm sure that is how many AROS, MorphOS, Amithlon and/or UAE developers and users felt in the early part of the past decade when Hyperion (supported to some extend by Amiga Inc.) painted them all with the same brush, accusing some of doing illegal things, when at the time, all they actually had was a license from Amiga Inc. but still nothing to show anyone...which only came many years later. And these developers were...you know, people who actually HAD DONE stuff by that point.

Bottom line is that it's business and they've all done something that could be perceived as trampling on others' their efforts, although it was probably not their intention.

I see each new Amiga venture, including but limited to EON's X1000 platform and C= USA's systems, as an opportunity to re-ignite, re-envirogorate and revitalize the Amiga brand, platform and/or spirit of creativity and innovation that once used to be so prevalent in this community to different and wider audiences... Many things Amiga were not "it can't be done" or "you can't do that"...it was instead "watch me do it/get it done"...usually followed by a "WOW! How'd they do that?!?!?!?!" This is after all a large part of what Amiga was known for and this is what I would like to see again some day.

I'm not expecting any of these things to happen over night or without substantial resources and money, and I am realistic that it is unlikely to ever happen, but I'm nevertheless hopeful and applaud anyone that has the cojones to try to make something/ANYTHING happen/move forward.

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ChrisH 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 16-Sep-2010 19:08:15
#602 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2005
Posts: 6673
From: Unknown

@elatour Quote:
all they actually had was a license from Amiga Inc. but still nothing to show anyone...which only came many years later. And these developers were...you know, people who actually HAD DONE stuff by that point.

Prey tell what you think C=USA might actually do to justify the Commodore/Amiga name? Even if they eventually produce their own custom PC case (rather than just rebadging existing ones), it's still only going to run Windows or Linux. The CEO has made it abundantly clear that he has absolutely no interest in AROS now, never *had* any serious plans for AROS, and certainly won't be putting any money towards it now. And Commodore/Amiga wallpaper on Linux, and/or a bundled Amiga Forever package, doesn't count in my book.

@thread
Dunno if it has already been discussed, but I'll believe $30 million for adverting when I see it. Same as for Amiga Inc's $10 million of the naming rights for the Kent Stadium (oops). All I see at the moment is some PR fuzz.

Last edited by ChrisH on 16-Sep-2010 at 07:15 PM.
Last edited by ChrisH on 16-Sep-2010 at 07:08 PM.

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Kronos 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 16-Sep-2010 19:12:02
#603 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 2091
From: Unknown

@ChrisH

Quote:

ChrisH wrote:
..... doesn't count in my book.



Didn't you hear ? Your "book" doesn't count

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Manu 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 16-Sep-2010 19:15:11
#604 ]
Super Member
Joined: 4-Feb-2004
Posts: 1561
From: Unknown

@ChrisH

Well I hope the CEO can change his mind. It's not like the AROS community has bashed Commodore USA to death or anything. If there's bad blood between them two already I would be surprised. The question is how keen is CUSA to tango ? They should know it takes two to tango. AROS needs a lot polishing until it's ready to go, now worries it gets there but it happens at it's own pace are they going to help out there or just sit and watch it develope ?

Last edited by Manu on 16-Sep-2010 at 07:15 PM.

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hardware-intensive solutions. And they'd go faster.-- D.Haynie

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elatour 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 16-Sep-2010 19:31:05
#605 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 18-Jan-2005
Posts: 936
From: Toronto, Canada

@ChrisH

Quote:
The CEO has made it abundantly clear that he has absolutely no interest in AROS now, never *had* any serious plans for AROS, and certainly won't be putting any money towards it now.

Yeah, many in this community pretty much guaranteed that will now be the case as a result of all of the endless vitriol he was subjected to for even suggesting that having AROS ship on their AIO A1200-like systems would help spur interest, benefit and support for all things Amiga including for Hyperion, EON, A-Cube, and all other developers for the Amiga platforms. Anything that gets the Amiga brand and platform noticed in a positive light benefits everyone in this community even if indirectly, regardless of what camp you're in. It would sure be nice if we were all just in the Amiga camp for a change....but that is clearly just to much to ask for from too many folks in this community.

But one thing is for sure, there is alot more of a chance of something positive happenning when you extend your hand and wish people well or provide constructive criticism where and when warranted/encouraged. Not much chance of it when there is no cooperation or discourse present, but only only shouting. Problem is that too many people in the community prefer shouting over discource or elitism/segregation/isolation over cooperation/inclusion.

We all seem to be stuck in this perpetual arm-chair CTO role in that we all seem to think we know exactly what the Amiga needs and should do/be and/or subscribe to a narrow view of what that could/should be, and resist or shout down anything that does not fit that vision. The sad thing is that we can't/don't/won't actually do anything about it but we're more than willing to shoot anyone that is/does/can if their vision doesn't match our own.

The ironic thing is that if C= USA are tremendously successful with their Commodore-Amiga plans and get noticed, then everyone, including the ones that currently think of them as being the devil incarnate, will benefit indirectly, because none of them really have a real chance or the resources at the moment to make any real in-roads into the mainstream technology market any time soon and C= appears to. Only time will tell of course, whether this proves out to be correct or not, but I'd rather be hopeful than be a nay sayer.

Last edited by elatour on 16-Sep-2010 at 07:46 PM.
Last edited by elatour on 16-Sep-2010 at 07:43 PM.
Last edited by elatour on 16-Sep-2010 at 07:40 PM.
Last edited by elatour on 16-Sep-2010 at 07:32 PM.

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eliyahu 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 16-Sep-2010 19:51:16
#606 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2010
Posts: 1729
From: Waterbury, Connecticut (USA)

@ChrisH

Quote:
Prey tell what you think C=USA might actually do to justify the Commodore/Amiga name? Even if they eventually produce their own custom PC case (rather than just rebadging existing ones), it's still only going to run Windows or Linux. The CEO has made it abundantly clear that he has absolutely no interest in AROS now, never *had* any serious plans for AROS, and certainly won't be putting any money towards it now. And Commodore/Amiga wallpaper on Linux, and/or a bundled Amiga Forever package, doesn't count in my book.

as much as it pains me to say this -- and trust me, it does -- they've already justified the brand. they bought it. that's all the justification they need.

now, if you're talking about whether their products will be worthy of the sticker on their case, that remains to be seen. indeed any of their products remain to be seen. if they ever ship anything to the general public, i think we can make a few predictions:

1. commodore USA will end up funding AROS developers here and there
2. it will either not end up being bundled, or if it is, will not be a commercial success
3. any customization to differentiate their PCs from others will be limited to the cases and artwork/themes in a linux DE or windows

i don't know how commercially successful they'll be, but then again, success for me is innovation, not profit. that's why i'm an engineer and not sales guy. as for money, everyone needs to eat, so, good luck to them.

other than their licensing a name near and dear to our hearts, they're just another PC distributor. the most they'll do is spec case design work to a chinese firm and call it their own. they will not innovate. they will just sell.

@BigBentheAussie

leo, if it turns out otherwise, i'll be pleased to eat my words. make a liar out of me and show us up! make something great and be worthy of the name you have assumed! execute!

-- eliyahu

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cicero790 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 16-Sep-2010 19:57:02
#607 ]
Member
Joined: 9-Oct-2009
Posts: 26
From: Unknown

Things have been said in the fog of war and confusion, body parts flying in the air. Brains exploding. If this IMHO splendid project gets air under the wings, AROS could suddenly find itself having a massive following with many helping hands.


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WolfToTheMoon 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 16-Sep-2010 20:00:37
#608 ]
Super Member
Joined: 2-Sep-2010
Posts: 1252
From: CRO

@cicero790

Quote:
If this IMHO splendid project gets air under the wings, AROS could suddenly find itself having a massive following with many helping hands.


Not that I care or find that likely, but, IMHO, +1

AROS could be made into a really nice retro OS for die-hard amiga fans. And maybe a GEOS-like version for Commodore line, but let's leave that for the future and see what comes out of it first.

Last edited by WolfToTheMoon on 16-Sep-2010 at 08:00 PM.

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cicero790 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 16-Sep-2010 20:05:58
#609 ]
Member
Joined: 9-Oct-2009
Posts: 26
From: Unknown

@WolfToTheMoon

+1

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ChrisH 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 16-Sep-2010 20:08:23
#610 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2005
Posts: 6673
From: Unknown

@eliyahu Quote:
if they ever ship anything to the general public, i think we can make a few predictions:

1. commodore USA will end up funding AROS developers here and there

How on earth did you come to that conclusion? I mean, it's one thing for the "CTO" to want to do something with AROS, it's another thing entirely to get the "CEO" to go along with it (and I'm sure he's the one holding the purse strings).

I get the feeling that people have short memories about what the CEO said regarding AROS.

Last edited by ChrisH on 16-Sep-2010 at 08:09 PM.

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WolfToTheMoon 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 16-Sep-2010 20:14:25
#611 ]
Super Member
Joined: 2-Sep-2010
Posts: 1252
From: CRO

@ChrisH

CEO said, in his reply to a member on a.org, that his first idea was to support AROS and him/they thinking it would be fun. Then all hell broke loose and he seems to not be sure of that anymore, but he did not state they will change their plans just yet.
That means that option is still open, if I understood what he wrote correctly.

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eliyahu 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 16-Sep-2010 20:21:19
#612 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2010
Posts: 1729
From: Waterbury, Connecticut (USA)

@ChrisH

Quote:
How on earth did you come to that conclusion? I mean, it's one thing for the "CTO" to want to do something with AROS, it's another thing entirely to get the "CEO" to go along with it (and I'm sure he's the one holding the purse strings).

I get the feeling that people have short memories about what the CEO said regarding AROS.

no, no. i remember the comments well. had a right good laugh on that one. let's just say barry didn't come off well there.

the reason i think that at some point there will be some monies going to AROS devs -- and by monies i mean something on the order of contributing to open bounties -- is i think leo will convince barry to throw a few hundred at the AROS community. by being tied to something amiga-like they might get a few piddling sales out of it. i figure barry will probably do it just to make leo happy and so he can quit hearing about it.

barry's opinion of AROS is much more in line with mine than the position of the 'CTO,' but it only costs a few bucks and he'll get the rabid fandom only apple can dream of when AROS users can start talking about it being supported by commodore: 'AROS IS THE OFFICIAL AMIGA OS! OMG! OMG! THE REEL AMIGA HAS RETURND!!11!' you know, that kind of nonsense.

off-topic: by the way, many thanks for the addition of CD32 support in your recent build of RunInUAE! very much appreciated.

-- eliyahu

Last edited by eliyahu on 16-Sep-2010 at 08:24 PM.

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T-J 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 16-Sep-2010 22:33:37
#613 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 31-Aug-2010
Posts: 596
From: Unknown

@BigBenTheAussie



Quote:
WTH? How the hell is that our problem???? They don't even want to port to x86. What you seem to be suggesting is like paying Microsoft a huge sum up front just for the honour of them being able to sell Windows to us?



If you read my suggestion, you'd have noticed that I am actually not hugely bothered about an x86 port of OS4. What I really want to see is C=USA pointing computing enthusiasts interested in a machine that is in the tradition of the A4000, ie, an enthusiasts box, towards the X1000 while keeping the customers interested in a machine in the A500 tradition, that is, a gaming machine, to themselves.

You wouldn't lose any customers, because the enthusiasts won't buy your PCs and the gamers won't buy the X1000. But it would make the community more content to know that the custom hardware AmigaOne running AmigaOS isn't going to be drowned out in the advertising kerfuffle surrounding your CommodoreAmiga machines.

Those are my selfish goals. Your side benefits in that it can point to its promotion of the X1000 for enthusiasts and say 'look, we're supporting the original products' continuation! Aren't we good?'. This is something Acorn (2006) failed to do. The tech media took a rather negative view of that and look where they are now. Their company is dissolved and their x86 RISCOS-less PCs are regarded by their financial backers as a big mistake.

Quote:
You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.


Clearly.


@elatour

Sorry, the events you're talking about rather pre-date my interest in computers. Like I said, I'm new around here. Anyway, here and now the way I see it, there are little companies doing work having their parades rained on by the money men. I kept my 'little companies' comment vague, because I wanted to include the other Amiga-likes - CommodoreUSA's 'Commodore-Amiga' PCs and their big advertising budget will pull the limelight away from all of them.

Last edited by T-J on 16-Sep-2010 at 10:39 PM.

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number6 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 17-Sep-2010 0:23:26
#614 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9890
From: In the village

@BigBentheAussie

Quote:
And for that matter, on the subject of trademarks, how come Hyperion or A-Eon aren't granting ACube the AmigaOne name?


Can you point me to a link or similar where (1)Acube expresses the desire to carry the AmigaOne name and/or (2)Where Hyperion states they are denying the name AmigaOne to Acube?

#6

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terminills 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 17-Sep-2010 0:25:11
#615 ]
Super Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 1234
From: Unknown

@eliyahu

Quote:
rabid fandom only apple can dream of when AROS users can start talking about it being supported by commodore: 'AROS IS THE OFFICIAL AMIGA OS! OMG! OMG! THE REEL AMIGA HAS RETURND!!11!' you know, that kind of nonsense.


And what Aros fans have done that yet? Maybe a couple of x86 fans have. but I don't recall seeing any Aros fans. Many of us don't care about the name at all.

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number6 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 17-Sep-2010 0:27:10
#616 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9890
From: In the village

@BigBentheAussie

Quote:
I said we contacted A-Eon well before Amiga Inc.


From your post #578 last page:

Quote:
We spoke to Ben.


According to Trevor's recent interview, Ben, Anthony, and he are involved.
Unless Ben has some majority say in this, you might have received a minority opinion for all I know.

#6

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number6 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 17-Sep-2010 0:29:12
#617 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9890
From: In the village

@BigBentheAussie

Quote:
Yes... They wanted confirmation of the Amiga license being granted.


Are you sure they didn't want confirmation of who had final say in granting said license?

#6

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eliyahu 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 17-Sep-2010 0:36:43
#618 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2010
Posts: 1729
From: Waterbury, Connecticut (USA)

@terminills

Quote:
And what Aros fans have done that yet? Maybe a couple of x86 fans have. but I don't recall seeing any Aros fans. Many of us don't care about the name at all.

there were a few AROS users already proceeding down a dark path of commodore fanboy-ism, as we have seen in the piles of posting hereon. but i would never suggest a plurality of the AROS community would ever give in to such insanity nor would i in any way impugn the AROS user-base. if it came across that way, please know that it was not my intention.

-- eliyahu

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nrj1200 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 17-Sep-2010 0:41:22
#619 ]
Member
Joined: 17-Sep-2008
Posts: 42
From: Unknown

here what we know so far they have 30 mil for ads
and are useing this music in their ads :
http://www.ubetoo.com/aciddads/33622

they are going to sell the computers in
stores in your towns worldwide so if they sell with
aros this will be a very good amiga

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elatour 
Re: AMIGA Name bought by Commodore!
Posted on 17-Sep-2010 2:56:22
#620 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 18-Jan-2005
Posts: 936
From: Toronto, Canada

@T-J

Quote:
Sorry, the events you're talking about rather pre-date my interest in computers. Like I said, I'm new around here. Anyway, here and now the way I see it, there are little companies doing work having their parades rained on by the money men. I kept my 'little companies' comment vague, because I wanted to include the other Amiga-likes - CommodoreUSA's 'Commodore-Amiga' PCs and their big advertising budget will pull the limelight away from all of them.

Well, regardless, the point I was making was that some of those very same "little companies" did the same to others littler than them in the past, even when most in the community were imploring them to cooperate and/or partner with each other rather than attempt to destroy each other and further splinter/fracture the user & developer community.

Last edited by elatour on 17-Sep-2010 at 03:45 AM.
Last edited by elatour on 17-Sep-2010 at 02:57 AM.

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