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      /  Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF?
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Hypex 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 14:04:55
#21 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 8692
From: Greensborough, Australia

@drHirudo

Quote:
Recently I have been late to work up to 55 minutes thanks to my addiction to OWB.


Now this is interesting. So it was OWB you were addicted too,. and not the internet?

Quote:
Of course with OWB I don't use the others any more.


I still do. I use OWB when I need CSS and IBrowse for eveything else. Sometimes I like a password filler, download manager, history, cache, ... If OWB at least had a hoptlinks bat at the top it would be more bearabll. But OWB is not a desktop browser, it's a mobile browser. Still, until OS4 I'd never heard of it! Maybe they should port OpenWave to OS4.

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Tomppeli 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 14:26:57
#22 ]
Super Member
Joined: 18-Jun-2004
Posts: 1592
From: Home land of Santa, sauna, sisu and salmiakki

I agree that the thread title is misleading without a question mark in it !

@Kronos

Quote:
but than we have Fab claiming that the MorphOS-OWB is pretty much a sperate WebKit-browser with very few OWB-leftovers these days

Wasn't Sputnik WebKit based as well ? If true, makes one wonder why not concentrate on Sputnik all this passed time instead of OWB at all.

@drHirudo
Btw. The latest AmigaOS OWB version is 3.30. And because OWB bug tracker is closed, I guess, it means it really is discontinued. (I personally hope a new Timberwolf release is around a corner and waiting for a new OS update. Or something like that...)

Last edited by Tomppeli on 26-Oct-2010 at 02:30 PM.
Last edited by Tomppeli on 26-Oct-2010 at 02:27 PM.

_________________
Rock lobster bit me, so excuse me. If you'll plan to deal with me, be serious !
X1000 + AmigaOS4.1 FE. Be authentic.
"Anyone can build a fast CPU. The trick is to build a fast system." -Seymour Cray

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Hypex 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 14:29:09
#23 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 8692
From: Greensborough, Australia

@Fairdinkem

Quote:
OWB to provide AmigaOS4.x with a CSS HTML5 capable browser,


I tested some apparent HTML5 video with OWB and it worked! But I couldn't get anywhere with the youtube HTML5 betatest program. (Haha.) It just brought back flash.

Quote:
Realistically you have to be honest, OWB on AmigaOS4.x is soooooooo behind the times and practically featureless.


I agree. If it didn't have an interface we'd use it for a dongle.

Here's an idea. We need a modern HTML datatype. Something that does the hardwork while MultiView provides a GUI.

Quote:
OWB on MorphOS


It seems now they've dropper Voyager, and adopted OWB. And I wonder, why is theirs in better development? Perhaps Hyperion should pay the coder for an OS4 port!

Quote:
AmigaOS4.x needs to move on and into the future when it comes to web-surfing, and Timberwolf is the answer.


IMHO Timberwolf was too early to released to us. Okay it was Alpha and we kept asking. But it was buggy and just unsable for surfing. Without a Beta following it's still just a blimp on the radar and I went back to OWB after five minutes.

I'd much prefer the features of FF adapted to OWB. Timberwolf gave me a warning, of what is to come to have a modern browser on the Amiga, and I didn't like it. When I use an Amiga application I like to have the look and feel of a real Amiga application. Timberwolf just didn't do this. It had it's custom GUI designed for Windows trying to work on Amiga and it doesn't look like it will get much better with the Gecko interface. But I have used FF on Windows and it looked and felt like a Windows application so why does it still have to look and feel like a Windows application on Amiga. If I wanted to use a Windows application I switch on the PC.

MUI is better, and kind of in-between. But Timberwolf reminds me of using AmiCygnix. Like an emulated program on another OS. Well, AbiWord spins my HD for 30 secs before coming up. Except it's like an AmiCygnix program on the Workbench. Well I not looking forward to that!

In any case, when I used FireFox on the PC recently to sde what we were getting, I wasn't that impressed. I expected more features from the download manager. And IIRC it annoyed me by not remembering past sites or history or something lie that. I'd only used it three or so times so where did it go? I expcted better for a big Windows-beats-all application.

Then again. WindowsXP can't even view a PDF. It doesn't know what one is! And needs t download a viewer. Even if it's old, OS4 has PDF viewer built in! So OS4 wins that race!

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Tomppeli 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 14:36:44
#24 ]
Super Member
Joined: 18-Jun-2004
Posts: 1592
From: Home land of Santa, sauna, sisu and salmiakki

@Hypex

WebKit rendering engine inside IBrowse and actually released to public/us all ?

_________________
Rock lobster bit me, so excuse me. If you'll plan to deal with me, be serious !
X1000 + AmigaOS4.1 FE. Be authentic.
"Anyone can build a fast CPU. The trick is to build a fast system." -Seymour Cray

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djrikki 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 14:45:00
#25 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2010
Posts: 2075
From: Grimsby, UK

@Hypex

The friedens already confirmed that FF *cough* I mean Timberwolf will have Amiga menus and such other Amiga-like features so there is no need to worry about. Just the long waiting game huh...

My oh my so much banter about TW all caused my some wally typing a ! instead of a ? on the thread title... if you ask me it was delibrate =P

Last edited by djrikki on 26-Oct-2010 at 02:45 PM.

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opi 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 14:56:13
#26 ]
Team Member
Joined: 2-Mar-2005
Posts: 2752
From: Poland

@Hypex

Quote:
I tested some apparent HTML5 video with OWB and it worked! But I couldn't get anywhere with the youtube HTML5 betatest program.


To use HTML5 [video] tag you'd need some codecs and a browser that's capable of using it. MorphOS OBW supports [video] tag thanks to ffmpeg.

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Fab 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 14:56:22
#27 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Mar-2004
Posts: 1178
From: Unknown

@kronos

OWB was mainly a "reorganization" of WebKit in a couple places:
- rewritten CMakeFiles
- platform (os-dependant) files copied and renamed in another directory
- cloned WebKit-windows API
- Embedded device additions for the Pleyo products
- a SDL backend (slow, buggy, incomplete), but useful as a proof of concept.

At each merge, WebKit can be substancially changed regarding platform files and makefiles, so the OWB part that remains is actually more a burden to me. I think i'll start on a fresh WebKit checkout someday. That will save me time when merging.

Last edited by Fab on 26-Oct-2010 at 03:15 PM.
Last edited by Fab on 26-Oct-2010 at 02:59 PM.

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Hypex 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 15:08:09
#28 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 8692
From: Greensborough, Australia

@Tomppeli

Yes that will do.

Though I think the honour belongs to AWeb.

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Fab 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 15:12:21
#29 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Mar-2004
Posts: 1178
From: Unknown

@Hypex

Quote:

I use OWB when I need CSS and IBrowse for eveything else. Sometimes I like a password filler, download manager, history, cache, ... If OWB at least had a hoptlinks bat at the top it would be more bearabll.


OWB MorphOS has all that (except disk cache).

Quote:

But OWB is not a desktop browser, it's a mobile browser. Still, until OS4 I'd never heard of it! Maybe they should port OpenWave to OS4.


But OWB *is* WebKit, and a WebKit-based browser can obviously be as feature-rich as one would expect from a desktop browser (but that'sobvious, considering Safari and chrome). This argument that OWB for OS4 should stay as limited as a mobile browser is just an excuse to slack (which is morally questionable when you have received sputnik bounty and several donations before).


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EntilZha 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 16:04:08
#30 ]
OS4 Core Developer
Joined: 27-Aug-2003
Posts: 1679
From: The Jedi Academy, Yavin 4

@realize

Started to migrate to 4.0beta, but noticed that the betas still have rendering problems on some systems, even on Windows. Therefore, the whole migration is put on hold until Firefox 4.0 final source code is available.

_________________
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"I don't have a frigging clue. I'm norwegian" -- Ole-Egil

All opinions expressed are my own and do not necessarily represent those of Hyperion Entertainment

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EntilZha 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 16:06:16
#31 ]
OS4 Core Developer
Joined: 27-Aug-2003
Posts: 1679
From: The Jedi Academy, Yavin 4

@drHirudo

Quote:
Who cares about Timberwolf, when OWB is so cool nowadays?


Just shows that you don't think beyond the browser. Firefox is not only a browser, it's technology.

Quote:
I can hardly say this about Timberwolf


That's why it's called a pre-alpha. It's hardly fair to compare pre-alpha with anything that has been stable for a while.

Quote:
Timberwolf is just a proof of concept to me, nothing more


See above. Pretty short-sighted.

_________________
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"I don't have a frigging clue. I'm norwegian" -- Ole-Egil

All opinions expressed are my own and do not necessarily represent those of Hyperion Entertainment

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TheDungeonDelver 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 16:25:12
#32 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 17-Apr-2004
Posts: 812
From: Unknown

@EntilZha

Quote:

EntilZha wrote:
@drHirudo

Quote:
Who cares about Timberwolf, when OWB is so cool nowadays?


Just shows that you don't think beyond the browser. Firefox is not only a browser, it's technology.


Everyone read this. This is pretty much the truth.

Plus, I'm entirely sure Hyperion understands the absolute need for a technology like Firefox if the platform to advance. Under-developed "home grown" browsers won't cut it when it comes to bringing back users. You go out there with OWB, WebKit, etc. and 90% of people will say "oh, that's nice, where do I download Firefox for it?"

Truth.

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Rogue 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 17:37:08
#33 ]
OS4 Core Developer
Joined: 14-Jul-2003
Posts: 3999
From: Unknown

@realize

Since I never had the impression you cared anything about AmigaOS 4.x, I have to wonder why you ask that question? I also see you started some other threads on AmigaOS 4.x.

Why?

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samo79 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 17:37:52
#34 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 13-Feb-2003
Posts: 3352
From: Italy, Perugia

@Fab

Quote:
But OWB *is* WebKit, and a WebKit-based browser can obviously be as feature-rich as one would expect from a desktop browser (but that'sobvious, considering Safari and chrome). This argument that OWB for OS4 should stay as limited as a mobile browser is just an excuse to slack (which is morally questionable when you have received sputnik bounty and several donations before).


I totally agree with you, it's a shame ... OWB can be an excellent and complete web browser, having a minimal UI is only an ideological choice :-/

@EntilZha

Thanks for the news, i'm really looking forward for it, good luck !!

BTW: is there any other things that you are able to show ? I mean about the "integration" with the AmigaOS style UI, i think about the actual Windows's style menu and so on ..

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delshay 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 17:46:10
#35 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 20-Sep-2008
Posts: 447
From: Unknown

what are the system requirements needed to run this browser?

memory & processor speed.

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TheDungeonDelver 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 17:54:55
#36 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 17-Apr-2004
Posts: 812
From: Unknown

@delshay

This is a bad example, but I ran FF3 (at least I think it was 3, it may have been late in the life of FF2) on a P133 with 96mb RAM (win '98SE). It was an old "emergency" notebook I had pulled out when my main system died.

Make of that what you will.

_________________
The problem with AmigaOS on PPC isn't that PPC is big-endian. The problem with AmigaOS on PPC is that PPC is dead-endian.

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virgolamobile 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 17:55:19
#37 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 23-Feb-2004
Posts: 163
From: Bergamo, Lombardy, Italy

@Rogue

All people that do web development everyday have clearly in mind the advantages of having the Mozilla platform available.
Amonga others:
- W3C standards conformance
- javascript interpreter performance (well, version 4 will boost that)
- available plugins
- XUL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XUL) technology

Just as a curiosity I want to mention that XUL supports fully featured applications, for example the Komodo editor.

So: keep it up Rogue!

Last edited by virgolamobile on 26-Oct-2010 at 05:55 PM.

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Troels 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 17:57:21
#38 ]
Super Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 1974
From: Unknown

@Fab
Quote:
...(which is morally questionable when you have received sputnik bounty and several donations before).

Just to clarify this: As the remains after the refund was divided between Jörg and Chris (Netsurf), Jörg only got part of the Sputnik bounty money.

Everyone who requested a refund got their money back.

Donations made to Jörg was of course for the work he already did, not for stuff that might never happen.

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billt 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 19:57:38
#39 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 24-Oct-2003
Posts: 3023
From: Maryland, USA

@EntilZha

Quote:
Started to migrate to 4.0beta, but noticed that the betas still have rendering problems on some systems, even on Windows. Therefore, the whole migration is put on hold until Firefox 4.0 final source code is available.


IMHO this is well worth waiting for, and is fantastic news!

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kas1e 
Re: Status Update on OS4 TIMBERWOLF!
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 20:06:08
#40 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Jan-2004
Posts: 3184
From: Russia

@billt

Quote:

IMHO this is well worth waiting for, and is fantastic news!

Did you mean its cool that whole migration is put on hold until Firefox 4.0 final source code is available ?:)

Why it looks not so cool for others: its that always will be new versions of FireFox, and better to have 3.6 working fine, than every year have only alpha of every major-new version of FF.

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