Just uploaded this to my YouTube channel...

LightWave 3D on the AmigaONE X1000

It's a 15-minute video about how I run my favorite classic Amiga package, NewTek's LightWave 3D, on my new AmigaONE X1000 with AmigaOS 4.1 Update 5. The video was processed and edited entirely on my X1000 using ktadd's ffmpegGUI frontend to ffmpeg, as well as a pre-release version of his upcoming VideoClipper program. Also got some use out of ADPro with Fred -- another favorite old workhorse.

I tried playing this on YouTube using ClipDown on my Sam440 computer, but unfortunately sound and picture did not remain in sync very long. I used ClipDown/getvideo to save the .mp4 file on the Sam440 from YouTube. Unfortunately, it still gets out of sync after a very short while. I'll experiment more later and perhaps make a version that will fare better on slower systems. But now I go to sleep!

Thanks to ktadd for letting me test his program (some notes coming for you, Kevin!) and to Kicko for proving it can be done with his excellent video tutorial about HD-Rec. That's on YouTube, too.

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@mbrantley

Excellent job Mike.

Quote:

I tried playing this on YouTube using ClipDown on my Sam440 computer, but unfortunately sound and picture did not remain in sync very long.

Yep. h264.

The Micro played it perfectly in sync start to finish 640x360.

#6

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@number6

How many screens and systems!

But very nice setup and video. nice to see and hear video editing may be possible on the Amiga soon.

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@amigang

Maybe it is the X1000 with 6 screens?!

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@mbrantley

Ultra cool video! Keep it up man!

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@mbrantley

Great video mike, really informative.

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@mbrantley

Very impressive video! Well done.

Video Clipper also looks very interesting too!

TrevorD

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@mbrantley

Great video! I enjoyed that

Steve

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Nice video!

If we had it ported to PPC native, we could have better working GUI and it should be pretty much enough for bedroom Babylon5-remake productions.

(but I assume it's about as far fetched as it is to hope for Realsoft 4D getting ported... old LW would be simpler perhaps, unless it's in assembler, Realsoft is bigger and licences need to be agreed again ... and perhaps some money needs to move...)


btw. how does rendering speed compare with PA6T+petunia vs JanusUAE?
Or trance vs petunia?

(with JanusUAE one might be able to set rendering cluster to run on Linux side of AEROS, to use multicore x86 HW????)


(and no, I do not suggest trying to set rendering nodes to run on xena threads )

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@KimmoK

Quote:

(with JanusUAE one might be able to set rendering cluster to run on Linux side of AEROS, to use multicore x86 HW????)

What? How? What will work as a transport/communication layer? Also, clustering hardware (with three layers of API and one CPU emulator, no less!) to render a clip that will look like a cheesy commercial you could see on shopping network in 90s is as pointless as clustering smartphones to get a decent performing server.

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I do not suggest trying to set rendering nodes to run on xena threads

Good to hear; it makes my hearth glow with warmth. After three years people finally are getting that you can't use I/O driven controllers for a CPU bound tasks. Sniff.

Last edited by opi on 30-Jul-2012 at 11:32 AM.

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@opi

>What? How? What will work as a transport/communication layer?

Screamernet SW exist there somewhere. If JanusUAE can talk to outside world via TCP/IP, it should/could be possible.
Clusters would be run natively, they support heterogenous processing on many different kind of CPUs.

>Also, clustering hardware (with three layers of API and one CPU emulator, no less!)

At the time when B5 production was starting one could use networked A4000 and other workstations to render a movie. Initially MIPS screamer HW was used, but later with sreamernet introduction you could also use x86. And Linux executables should also exist (not sure about the source & workings with modern linux).

> to render a clip that will look like a cheesy commercial you could see on shopping network in 90s

Have you ever seen B5? I think it's little better than cheesy commercial, even if not on the level of renderings of this millennium.
(B5 might have been in VHS resolution, but I imagin Lightwave5 should be able to render to any resolution, B5 in full HD would look better than the old version.)

Surely best thing might be a more artist friendly GUI for Blender + cluster support.

some related info

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@KimmoK

b5 is pretty bad when it comes to 3d, really.. but lets say its just my taste. however it can qualify as bedroom3d even today. and that leads me to a question, what exactly displeases you in lightwave (the one in video is 3.5 or 4 i guess, last version for amiga was 5.6 afair) and its gui?

if it was enough to produce tb5 at its time, if it was enough for professionals once upon a time, why isnt it enough for you today? and why should companies release the source code to bedroom coders on an obscure platform that claims being successor of one they ve dropped?

last but not least, how would that compare to the effort of porting - say - firefox, both financially and in therms of results? lightwave is commercial software, ive paid for my v9 pc copy some 1k eur. even if you are going to pay that + port/development costs then i would suggest easier tasks like porting open office, spotify, or even said firefox should go in advance.

@wawa

" what exactly displeases you in lightwave ... its gui?"

To my understanding it's GUI gadgets are designed for mid 1990's screen resolution.
And on modern HD displays those gadgets might be too small.
(and I think not everything of the GUI works 100% on the NG)

"if it was enough to produce tb5 at its time, if it was enough for professionals once"

Sure. It got a lot of good reviews of being the best towards artists that do not like windows menus etc.
(IIRC, only bad reviews came for PC mags that never knew 3D movie work anyway)

"and why should companies release the source code to bedroom coders on an obscure platform that claims being successor of one they ve dropped? "

Perhaps they already have? (not checked what was released with OpenToaster etc.)
UPDATE: code is not with the OpenToaster
http://www.discreetfx.com/openvideotoaster.html

Other than that, they could release it if they consider it not to have any financial value any more + to please their old diehard fans. (some grazy? companies have done it sometimes)

...

Good and easy to use 3D apps (+modernizations) are needed on our platform. A lot of Amigans prefer to do everything on top of their favourite OS.

Last edited by KimmoK on 30-Jul-2012 at 01:13 PM.

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@amigang

Quote:

nice to see and hear video editing may be possible on the Amiga soon.

Part of his goal was to use the tools presently available from start to finish to show it can all be done on Amigaoid systems.
I wouldn't use the word "soon" here regarding an NLE suite. Heh.

@clusteruk

Part of the reason this was done, I'm sure, was to assist others since we saw a lot of curiosity even from MorphOS devs/users and even an AROS dev here. Some guy called clusteruk. Heh. If it helps people who wondered how this was done, that's got to be a plus:

Running Lightwave 5.0 on MorphOS 2.5

@opi

Quote:

to render a clip that will look like a cheesy commercial you could see on shopping network in 90s

Well, he did this for many reason. And as stated above, one was to help others who might still enjoy using Lightwave as a hobby.
Besides that, even in those 90's if you handed a talented person VHS equipment and someone not quite so talented -better- equipment, the talented person produced the better product...every time.

@Kimmok

Quote:

I imagin Lightwave5 should be able to render to any resolution

No need to "imagine". That's what he was doing when he rendered to 1080P sized frame. No problem.

#6

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@number6

Quote:

The Micro played it perfectly in sync start to finish 640x360.

Excellent! That's great to hear. And thank you, number6, for your advice not only on this little project (thanks to ajk too) but also for your assistance in getting both LightWave and ADPro going on my AOS4 systems. Being able to use familiar and favorite old tools under the latest AmigaOS is the top appeal for me.

Meanwhile... boy, I really hate hearing my own voice in the video.

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@KimmoK

Quote:

IIRC, only bad reviews came for PC mags that never knew 3D movie work anyway)

dont need any magazines reviews, im able to judge that myself.

Quote:

Other than that, they could release it if they consider it not to have any financial value any more + to please their old diehard fans. (some grazy? companies have done it sometimes)

so here you go asking:
http://www.newtek.com/lightwave/
i should have somewhere my european support contact from few years back within my pi**ed off email exchange, but im not going after this subject.

Last edited by wawa on 30-Jul-2012 at 01:57 PM.

@mbrantley

Wow! Really nice video! Good work!

Can you tell me which version of lightwave you are using, and which tools you used to assist you - for example, when you speak of the cybergraphix render, is that a seperate software plugin, and if so, what version?
Thanks for such an informative video!

Scott

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@scabit

Hey there. This is LightWave 5.20a (NOTE: POST EDITED TO CORRECT VERSION AFTER I GOT HOME TO LOOK) that I am using, and I have also run version 5.0a and even version 3.5 under AOS4. You do not have to use the CyberGraphics plugin ... it's just to enable the 24-bit render preview. number6 here I believe uses mode promotion to get the built-in ham render preview to work on his Micro.

I have a interesting situation... I have been copying application drawers, config files and data from Amiga to Amiga to AmigaONE, ahem, for years now and no longer have original installation files or media for very much of my stuff. And I have no memory of where this CyberGraphics plugin came from. Maybe somebody else can chime in here.

I know I used it on my A4000D to use LightWave with my CyberVision3D graphics card and was pleasantly surprised to find that it worked on my Sam440 and now X1000 using AOS4's Picasso support. I don't know how it works, but it does. PM me if you need to. :)

ModePro can be found on Aminet. OS4's Screens prefs editor will do some of its functions and maybe enough for this job, but I'm partial to old tools as you can tell. Heh.

I have two VideoToaster cards and much of my LightWave support files (example scenes, objects, etc.) came from the CD-ROMs that go with the Toaster cards.

Dave and Stephen here both have reported a problem with LightWave crashing upon rendering in Layout on their X1000s. This was before I got my X1000 and so I was worried. I do not have that problem, thank goodness, so I hope I can help them get LW working on their machines. The empty animation preview box apparently is NOT a problem for number6 under OS4.0 on his Micro, so I am really curious about that. Before learning this, I assumed the problem was missing ECS/AGA chips for that function -- but apparently the problem is elsewhere. Hopefully, that means it's a problem that can be solved.

Last edited by mbrantley on 30-Jul-2012 at 10:55 PM.

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@mbrantley

Quote:

Dave and Stephen here both have reported a problem with LightWave crashing upon rendering in Layout on their X1000s. This was before I got my X1000 and so I was worried. I do not have that problem, thank goodness, so I hope I can help them get LW working on their machines. The empty animation preview box apparently is NOT a problem for number6 under OS4.0 on his Micro, so I am really curious about that. Before learning this, I assumed the problem was missing ECS/AGA chips for that function -- but apparently the problem is elsewhere. Hopefully, that means it's a problem that can be solved.

i'm running lightwave v5.20a on my SAM and pegasos, and don't seem to have the crashing issue. i wonder if it's difference with the screen modes?

-- eliyahu

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@mbrantley

awesome vid!, thanks!

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