Hello,

i was asking myself about some Amiga licensing scheme that i don't understand yet.
Maybe someone can explain me better.

Some questions:

* Is the hardware production tied to powerpc processors only?
If yes, why cusa build pc with x86 processors?
* Is the hardware production tied to use the AmigaOne name only?
* There are the other restrictions and why?

* There is something ongoing to manage this (complex) licensing scheme in a better way?


Thank you

Last edited by AmigaBlitter on 20-Aug-2012 at 10:30 AM.

@AmigaBlitter

there are countless forum threads about this topic...

Amiga Inc. basically has the rights to the brand "Amiga". They had a long lawsuit with Hyperion regarding Amiga, source code of 3.1. and then a agreement some time ago. Hyperion can use "AmigaOS" for its own product and has the right to use all it developed based on 3.1., that means their PPC OS. Amiga Inc kept its rights and licensed "Amiga" to CommodoreUSA but only for X86. Part of the agreement was that whoever uses "Amiga" is not allowed to install a competing OS (that means expecially Aros). So you can either produce "Amigas" without a amiga-based OS or vice versa. Strange new amiga world...

What do you want to license?

Last edited by OlafS25 on 20-Aug-2012 at 10:49 AM.

@AmigaBlitter

Some questions:

* Is the hardware production tied to powerpc processors only?

No !

* Is the hardware production tied to use the AmigaOne name only?

AmigaOne is owned (or licensed) to Hyperion, they could grant sub licences.
Amiga is owned by Amiga Inc.

* There are the other restrictions and why?

Some restrictions for Amiga licensing are a result of Hyperion's lawsuit against Amiga Inc. and before it was restricted by a contract beween Hyperion and Amiga Inc.

* There is something ongoing to manage this (complex) licensing scheme in a better way?


Well if Hyperion goes bancrupt the restriction for computers licensed as Amiga might vanish. The name Amiga will be totally free again for Amiga Inc.

Last edited by Arko on 20-Aug-2012 at 12:57 PM.

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@mods

Please delete this worthless thread, its been answered a million times already. In 7 years since joining the forum, the OP should/does already know the answer to these questions - the question didn't need to be asked.

Last edited by djrikki on 20-Aug-2012 at 12:59 PM.

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@djrikki

If you don't need any answer, good for you, but please, don't speak for others.

@AmigaBlitter

I think this thread should stay, its doing no harm, and it clears up my understanding of it too.

I thought Hyperion was restricted to PPC by AmigaOS license Agreement, or is that just to AmigaONE product names?

Example could (very unlikely) Hyperion make PC's called AmigaONE?

Could Hyperion license or sell out the AmigaOS/AmigaONE name to another company? (guess they can by the fact acube sams are called amigaone500.)

Also Cloanto have rights to the Workbench name, does that mean if they wanted to could make a OS or product called Workbench? Can AmigaOS still use Workbench name or do they have to seek permission from Cloanto?

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@Arko

Amigablitter:

Quote:

* Is the hardware production tied to powerpc processors only?

You:

Quote:

No !

Ben Hermans:

Quote:

Then there are some legal issues like some licences being tied to PPC only.

Can you explain how "yes" means "no" here?

#6

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@amigang

I think it is better to avoid all this mess altogether. I think Cloanto has (or at least had) the "Workbench" brand but I do not know if this is still the case. In this case nobody can call something "Workbench" without permission.

What Hyperion and/or Amiga Inc. are allowed to do depends on the agreement. At least we know that it restricts the use of amiga-related OSs in connection with "Amiga". If they could use "AmigaOne" for f.e. a PC is difficult to say. I assume that Hyperion is allowed to call a X86 with a port of AmigaOS "AmigaOne" but that is only a guess.

@number6

Quote:

Then there are some legal issues like some licences being tied to PPC only.

PowerPC is a good processor.

And cusa licence is tied to x86 only?

@number6

Quote:

number6 wrote: @Arko Amigablitter: Quote: * Is the hardware production tied to powerpc processors only? You: Quote: No ! Ben Hermans: Quote: Then there are some legal issues like some licences being tied to PPC only. Can you explain how "yes" means "no" here? #6

The text is not about Amiga license at all, your false quoting made HyperionMP look like a liar.

The text you posted is frome here:
http://www.amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=33800&forum=25&start=40&viewmode=flat&order=0#618192

and the full text says:

Or is recompiling impossible meaning that a PPC will always be the only option to run OS4?"

The AmigaOS 4.x kernel was rewritten from scratch in C but does contain some PPC assembly for some very low level parts.

In addition, the emulation layer is also in PPC assembly albeit that would in theory not be a showstopper since a "real" 68K CPU is available. On the Classic version of AmigaOS 4.x however not even an 060 is used since the overhead of the context switching between the CPU's (like WarpOS, PowerUP did) reduced the PPC to an expensive co-processor (i.e. the Cyberstorm/BlizzardPPC architecture was from ideal which is why AmigaOS 4.x turns off the 68K CPU as part of its boot process).

Then there are some legal issues like some licences being tied to PPC only.

All of this could be worked around however given sufficient funding. E.g. an ARM/X-Scale version of AmigaOS 4.x is perfectly possible.

The least expensive way however to be able to run AmigaOS 4.x on the Natami would seem to be to avoid the design flaws of the CyberstormPPC/BlizzardPPC and design a PPC expansion it in such a way that no context switching with massive overhead would be required when operating with a PPC CPU expansion.

There are some very cheap Freescale CPU's coming our way in the near future which are highly integrated and will blow everything out of the water in their PPC price range EXCLUDING the AmigaOne X1000. THe PA SEMI chip remains a gem to these days.

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TheDaddy: (Finally) I removed the A1200 motherboard from its (ugly) shell and put it inside the Power Tower.

---

Greetings to Heuchelburg

@AmigaBlitter

Quote:

AmigaBlitter wrote: @number6 And cusa licence is tied to x86 only?

I have never seen the CUSA license, but Amiga Inc. could licence Amiga to a lot of plattforms as long as there is no AmigaOS like OS on it.

Read what CUSA is writing about the Amiga license:

... Amiga® trademark used under exclusive worldwide license by Commodore USA, LLC for its line of AIO (All-In-One) keyboard computers, and worldwide non-exclusive license for desktop, tower and HTPC computers, and is the trademark of Amiga Inc., registered in the United States and other countries.
http://www.commodoreusa.net/cusa_news.aspx

Last edited by Arko on 20-Aug-2012 at 02:32 PM.

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TheDaddy: (Finally) I removed the A1200 motherboard from its (ugly) shell and put it inside the Power Tower.

---

Greetings to Heuchelburg

@Arko

Which was followed in December, 2011 by:

Quote:

On Dec 22, 2011 Commodore USA, LLC and Amiga Inc. signed a new contract granting us EXCLUSIVE WORLDWIDE rights to ALL format computers branded with the Amiga trademark IP. These registered trademarked logos include the BOING Ball, TIC/Check mark, letter A and the word AMIGA logos. Form factors include, but are not limited to Desktop, HTPC, Tower, AIO/ Keyboard etc

#6

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I agree with Arko.

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@number6/Arko:

Could you guys please stop quoting CUSA personnel as if they had a clue about Trademarks? That's just ridiculous.

Seriously, I'm all for a good flamewar - but if you want to quote CUSA, shouldn't you rather discusss crappy websites, 'business plans' that involve enduser hardware that melts after a few hours of use, not paying your licensors and PR campaigns that consist of spouting randomly generated bullshit in web forums for retro enthusiasts?

These would be CUSA's fields of expertise, but what the heck would these clowns know about Trademark laws?

Last edited by cgutjahr on 20-Aug-2012 at 04:00 PM.

@djrikki

Yes, let's delete all threads about topics that have been discussed already, so that around 20 to 30 posts will be left on the message board.

@cgutjahr

Quote:

cgutjahr wrote: @number6/Arko: Could you guys please stop quoting CUSA personnel as if they had a clue about copyrights?

This was not about copyrights, it was about Amiga licenses, don't make this thread become off topic.

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TheDaddy: (Finally) I removed the A1200 motherboard from its (ugly) shell and put it inside the Power Tower.

---

Greetings to Heuchelburg

@Arko

Quote:

This was not about copyrights, it was about Amiga licenses, don't make this thread become off topic.

Ouch, sorry. Stupid mistake - I fixed my posting.

@cgutjahr Quote:

enduser hardware that melts after a few hours of use

While I don't bother keeping track of C=USA, surely they aren't THAT incompetant?

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@AmigaBlitter

At some point AmigaOS was licenced only for PPC (Hyperion had licence to produce AOS for PPC "AmigaOne").

It seems that AOS could be ported to another architecture for some extra licencing costs. (but it would not solve anything, IMHO)

>* Is the hardware production tied to powerpc processors only?
>* Is the hardware production tied to use the AmigaOne name only?

HW is/was not licenced. The OS was/is.
Nowdays Hyperion owns "AmigaOne" -name.
Companies can pay Hyperion to get AOS to their HW. (PPC version being cheapest)
Companies can pay Hyperion to get AmigaOne name for their HW. (not sure what is the point in that... to get reduction on AOS4 licence cost???)

>If yes, why cusa build pc with x86 processors?

PCs usually have x86 processor. And C= mainly re-uses available components.
They have licence to use Amiga name how they please.
I think they can do whatever they like with it.
They could have done a "Amiga 4000" PPC based HW for us, if we had asked them to.
(But they have no rights to AmigaOS. )
They could also buy licenced AOS4 versions for that "Amiga 4000" or arrange AmigaOS4 being ported to support Amiga 4000 and to be sold separately. Acube kind of did that for their HW and A-Eon too.

>* There are the other restrictions and why?

Amiga Inc milks with the name "Amiga".

Last edited by KimmoK on 20-Aug-2012 at 04:44 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 20-Aug-2012 at 04:42 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 20-Aug-2012 at 04:40 PM.

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@KimmoK

Quote:

Companies can pay Hyperion to get AOS to their HW. (PPC version being cheapest)

recall to mind the msx time.