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PosterThread
A1200 
New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 8-Nov-2012 9:13:23
#1 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 5-May-2003
Posts: 3087
From: Westhall, UK

I am contributing to this for sure.... would love a modern version!

David Braben to do new Elite game

Elite on Kickstarter

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olegil 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 8-Nov-2012 9:24:58
#2 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Aug-2003
Posts: 5895
From: Work

@A1200

Since he's talking about wanting to go back to the "aristotelean" physics of Elite instead of the proper newtonian physics of Frontier, I'm not interested. That for me is why I still play Frontier instead of all those modern games. I don't want space battles to feel like I'm rowing a frikkin boat.

Last edited by olegil on 08-Nov-2012 at 09:25 AM.

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KimmoK 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 8-Nov-2012 9:31:22
#3 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2003
Posts: 5211
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland

@thread ... trying to be Amiga related ....

No one with any success of trying to port Oolite?



Bounty to get some native Elite/Oolite/frontier for NG???


UPDATE: about the physics
In 80's with C64 I learned to master the "flight" with Elite1, that's why I kind of like it even today.
With Frontier I played a lot with the real physics, using planets to catapult more speed etc. But it's a lot harder to learn to fly to outgun robbers... anyway, perhaps once I have time to set Frontier on NG HW...

(it is more pleasing if one learns to win enemy with puny weapons rather than just to rely on shields and gunpower .... actually.... similarly I loved simulators over arcade style in car driving games ... btw. I wonder how much CPU cycles one needs to run GP2 in dosbox... if it runs in dosbox.)

Last edited by KimmoK on 08-Nov-2012 at 12:44 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 08-Nov-2012 at 12:42 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 08-Nov-2012 at 12:40 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 08-Nov-2012 at 10:38 AM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 08-Nov-2012 at 10:35 AM.

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Gopal 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 8-Nov-2012 9:45:14
#4 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Apr-2003
Posts: 196
From: Norway

I kicked in!

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Bezzen 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 8-Nov-2012 11:04:43
#5 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 7-Apr-2003
Posts: 112
From: Sundsvall, Sweden

@Gopal

And I kicked it a bit further just now.

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A1200 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 8-Nov-2012 12:08:44
#6 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 5-May-2003
Posts: 3087
From: Westhall, UK

@olegil

Quote:

olegil wrote:
@A1200

Since he's talking about wanting to go back to the "aristotelean" physics of Elite instead of the proper newtonian physics of Frontier, I'm not interested. That for me is why I still play Frontier instead of all those modern games. I don't want space battles to feel like I'm rowing a frikkin boat.


HEHEHE made me chuckle!

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kamelito 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 9-Nov-2012 20:48:46
#7 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 26-Jul-2004
Posts: 813
From: Unknown

@olegil


Will you have Newtonian physics in the game?

Yes. The degree of the fly-by-wire to override the feeling of skidding is something we will carefully tune.

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RodTerl 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 9-Nov-2012 21:04:05
#8 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 6-Sep-2004
Posts: 589
From: Rossendale

Thing is, if you went for Einsteinian physics, you can get relativistic sling shots round stars, white dwarfs and black holes, and for smaller black holes, or using Red Dwarf pool, bounce one through a star system doing all sorts of side effects such as at least altering orbits and messing up warp points and communications etc.

If you really wanted to do it game wise though, use enhanved Relativistic, Loop quantum Gravity etc Have gravity tramlines such as Known Space, where worm holes propagate along, leading to fixed or creatable jump points for least energy, going all the way up to brute force warp FTL transisitions.

If you get the numbers right, you can sling shot a wormhole around a black hole and end up getting to the destination before you left.

Main thing though. Please keep the procedural gneration, but work on it. Would be nice when heading for a planet instead of having to rely on artists creating billions of them, to have the game create them, but if you can do it, have the game code procedurally genrated also. As in, animals start off as blobs, have motion. As the gneration procedes, depending on codes, the animal becomes more complex, forming tails, fins, mouths, limbs etc. The best example I saw was when it was claimed that all the different fur patterns from Antelope to Zebra, can be generated using th right function, and varying a single value.

I still dont know yet how it can be applied to vehicles, but animals are apparently procedural.

Be very intresting to see what can be produced.

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CritAnime 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 10-Nov-2012 19:56:23
#9 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 27-Jun-2011
Posts: 735
From: UK

As much as the prospect of this interests me I can't help but feel that it will be a lot like the latest in the X series. Which would be a shame.

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klx300r 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 10-Nov-2012 21:08:23
#10 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 4-Mar-2008
Posts: 3833
From: Toronto, Canada

my pledge is in!

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Caveman 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 12-Nov-2012 20:47:00
#11 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 16-Feb-2005
Posts: 655
From: Norway

We need more backers i think,in order to succeed.

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SpaceDruid 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 12-Nov-2012 21:08:27
#12 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jan-2007
Posts: 1748
From: Inside the mind of a cow on a planet that's flying through space at 242.334765 miles per second.

@A1200

I have issues with Braben...

He's claimed to have been working on this game (in various guises) for at least the last 15+ years, you'd think he'd have a better idea of what he was going to do in this game. It just seems right now he's still in the phase of coming up with ideas, which he should be well past by now. Particularly as he's trying to pitch a finished game to the Kickstarter crowd.

Also his ideas around multiplayer or MMO's seem to be based around an idealised version of online gaming and not in fact the reality learned by such teams as were behind Freelancer and Eve Online.

He made a very good game a very long time ago and some decent sequels, also a very long time ago. Since then, his companies only announced "highly ambitious" game The Outsider remains a very much figment of his imagination, sticking as he is with the notion the game isn't abandoned.

Meanwhile he wants funding for a far more ambitious game which he wants £1,250,000 for, despite his abysmal record of releasing finished games and his utter lack of apparent direction in his sales pitch, combined with his utter lack of knowledge in the online arena, or the market for such a game.


This one I'm staying well clear of. I doubt the game will ever reach completion and if it did, the only thing massively massive about it will be how few copies it sells and how far short of the ambition it will have to be to come anywhere close to that level of funding.


Instead of him slagging off every space trading game that's been released since, he might want to pay attention as to why these games fell so short of his ambitions and why there are so few of them.

Last edited by SpaceDruid on 12-Nov-2012 at 09:17 PM.
Last edited by SpaceDruid on 12-Nov-2012 at 09:15 PM.

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Caveman 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 12-Nov-2012 21:33:02
#13 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 16-Feb-2005
Posts: 655
From: Norway

@SpaceDruid

Well,you might be right,but this is a game i have been hoping for,for so long,and besides,nobody forces me to pledge max anyway. As i see it,if anyone ever want to see a game like Elite,this is the last and only chance they got. If it fails,atleast we tried.

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olegil 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 12-Nov-2012 21:51:26
#14 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Aug-2003
Posts: 5895
From: Work

@kamelit0

Basically that sentence says absolutely nothing. Elite had atmospheric drag in outer space, Frontier did not. A LOT of people complained about the space battles in Frontier for being unrealistic while in fact they are completely realistic it's just that people don't know how physics work.

He's explicitly saying he's bringing back the flying of Elite, which to me means drag. Which you just shouldn't have to struggle with in outer space.

I tried Freespace 2 and actually rage-quit because of the crappy physics. In 40 years I invite you all to my private space-battle arena where I'll kick ALL of your Aristotelean arses in my Newtonian spacecraft

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

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wawa 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 12-Nov-2012 22:12:28
#15 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 6259
From: Unknown

@olegil

+1. i hate those arcade style 3d space battles based on what was applicable for battle of england..

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CritAnime 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 13-Nov-2012 0:00:10
#16 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 27-Jun-2011
Posts: 735
From: UK

@SpaceDruid

No I agree with you.

As a single player game it would have to compete with the X series which, to me, were excelent games especially the latest X3: Albion Prelude. Not to mention that there will also be X: Rebirth released within the next year. But also rememebr that a new Wing Commander, though it is under a different title, is also somewhere on the horrizon.

As an online affaire it will have to compete with EVE Online. And lets be honest EVE is pretty darn complex and well rounded as far as sandbox style space games go. The econemy is stable, the trading works properly and combat is frantic and well structured. People can do pretty much what ever the hell they like and with Dust it gains even more depth and scope. Planetery interaction is also a game within it's own rights.

In order for the new Elite to be as good, if not better, he needs to pay attaention to whats happening with these games. I am not slagging it off or discounting it completely. But with such stiff competition I do wonder just how well it would fare.

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Toaks 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 13-Nov-2012 6:22:44
#17 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 8042
From: amigaguru.com

@A1200

i have a gut feeling that this game will flop!.
1 and 2 was great , 3 (first Encounter) and 3,5 (A new Kind?) was crap

David won't have the money or time to do such a hit these days (heard of The Outsider ?), too many developers is needed to make a AAA game and frontier has in my opinion only made rubbish games the last decade as his co workeres didnt have the same magic as he did.

Rasberry PI was a great invention but by the looks of it, that failed too as its not possible to buy anywhere (did the mainstream market kill it as it would have changed the whole industry?)

PS: if there will be a PS4 version of the game then i will buy it even if it gets a metacritic of 40 or lower.

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olegil 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 13-Nov-2012 7:04:02
#18 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Aug-2003
Posts: 5895
From: Work

@Toaks

Raspberry Pi is out of stock everywhere, but that doesn't really mean it's been killed

I see element14 don't have a consumer sales channel for Norway for it, though. RS does sell online to Norway, but has an expected 5 weeks delivery time.

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.

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Toaks 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 13-Nov-2012 9:05:24
#19 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 8042
From: amigaguru.com

@olegil

hmm, i have never seen it available in any shop both local and online.
the whole R-Pi should get units produced then and get them out to the people and not just in some underground whatever community.

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Caveman 
Re: New version of Frontier Elite
Posted on 13-Nov-2012 17:23:43
#20 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 16-Feb-2005
Posts: 655
From: Norway

@Toaks

The reason FFE 2 was rubbish,was because the publisher wanted it released as soon as possible. I agree with you that most games he released later on,was average(at best) Nowadays there are no publishers interrested in spacesims games anymore, they are more interrested in releasing fps games,heck they even raped the Syndicate game,making it a substandard fps game. How is it possible for a person like David Braben or Chris Roberts to be truly creative in such an enviroment? Gameindustry today,kills creativity. Would you be able to release anything astonishing in a industry like that? There are simply no room for any creative person in big business anymore. I can imagine that for a creative person working in such a enviroment,feels more like a inprisonment.

This is the main reason i am willing to support his project. Give him a last chance of prove himself.

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