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      /  Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
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RobertJDohnert 
Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 13:53:06
#1 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 18-Jun-2013
Posts: 199
From: Raleigh NC

Amiga OS 4.1

Help port device drivers
Get the QT port up to date
Port GTK
Virtualization of Linux
linux Subsystem? For running Linux apps without a native port
Chromium for Amiga OS 4? Discuss --- Is this needed
Work with Jaminga to get Amiga Java Port stable and production ready – http://code.google.com/p/jamiga2/
Code a “network manager” type utility for Amiga

OS4 OpenLinux 13.5/13.6 x86/x64

What can we do for Amiga users now.

Create the user interface in such a way to make it comfortable for Amiga users
Running legacy Amiga apps using hosted AROS. This will be included in 13.6 as the ISO's for 13.5 were built before that decision was made
Find linux equivalents of short list of Amiga applications
institute a cross compiler for porting for developers.

x86 systems that we sell

Will ship with 13.5 or Enterprise Linux 4.1.3 as the default OS
On request only virtual box will ship with AROS as the guest OS on these systems.
When tests are run and the systems support AROS natively, AROS will be shipped as a Dual boot option upon request from the customer.
Any device drivers developed for AROS will be developed for Amiga OS in conjunction. All device driver code, and all Application code will be released under the GPLv2 license or the orginal developers license.

PowerPC systems that we sell

We will work with A-EON on the PowerPC initiative
Beg or borrow a X1000 system for porting to that machine
Initial release will support the X1000 and G4 and G5 Macs, we will work with other PPC developers on other class of hardware.
Systems sold by PC OpenSystems LLC, will have OS4 OpenLinux installed by default with Amiga OS sold as an option request by customers, machines sold by A-EON will be sold with the Amiga OS by default

OS4 OpenLinux PowerPC

Start time July 1st, 2013
Platforms supported: AmigaOne X1000, legacy PPC Macs, namely G4 and G5.
Completion date: Estimated, January 2014 with first Beta being released November 2013

Goals:

Simplify PPC install. We want to make it as easy for PPC install as it is for x86 installs.
Provide emulation layer to run Amiga OS apps.
Evaluate and port if possible, the Ambient Desktop to PPC OS4 OpenLinux, project starting January 2014.
Provide the same ease of use for PowerPC as x86, customers and users have access to all multimedia codecs and advanced development tools for high end users.
Provide a PowerPC platform for users and customers to deploy high end mission critical applications and services, as well as a soothing and elegant desktop experience.

_________________
http://www.pc-opensystems.com

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Kronos 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 14:18:29
#2 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 2086
From: Unknown

@RobertJDohnert

You forgot:

- world peace
- free beer



Not sure whats more important.

_________________
- We don't need good ideas, we haven't run out on bad ones yet
- blame Canada

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terminills 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 14:19:46
#3 ]
Super Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 1234
From: Unknown

@Kronos

Quote:


@RobertJDohnert

You forgot:

- world peace
- free beer



Not sure whats more important.




free beer. :)

_________________
Support AROS sponsor a developer.

"AROS is prolly illegal ~ Evert Carton" intentionally quoted out of context for dramatic effect

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cgutjahr 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 14:20:19
#4 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 808
From: Unknown

@RobertJDohnert

NAKED CHICKS FOR EVERYONE! YESSSS!!!

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Kronos 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 14:21:48
#5 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 2086
From: Unknown

@cgutjahr

DRAT forgot that one !!!

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- blame Canada

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Hondo 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 14:42:26
#6 ]
Super Member
Joined: 10-Apr-2003
Posts: 1340
From: Denmark

@Roberto

I think it's a very good idea you have, and i want to thank you for
your commitment to AmigaOS.

Good luck with the work you and your team commit yourselves to.

Make us proud!

_________________
On Planet Boing Trevor is God

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OlafS25 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 15:05:29
#7 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 5086
From: Unknown

@RobertJDohnert

your ideas sound very promising (even if a little too "PPC" and OS 4.1. related for my taste ). Additional drivers for AROS are of course always appreciated and I hope some of the projects you mentioned will benefit AROS too.

The only thing that still miss is informations regarding the brand, hopefully there will be more informations later.

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wawa 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 15:36:43
#8 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 5717
From: Unknown

edited out.

Last edited by wawa on 30-Jun-2013 at 04:21 PM.

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Plaz 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 16:06:22
#9 ]
Super Member
Joined: 2-Oct-2003
Posts: 1562
From: Atlanta

@RobertJDohnert

Good luck and a bit of Amigan advise... get your work done, release it, then talk about it. Advertising a list up front that you may later be asked to explain changes, delays or failures is just going to get you tons of grief.

Though I kind of liked one of your earlier boing ball versions, I'm not digging your current one. Kind of has that Capt Kirk, "Evil Kirk" thing going on.

Plaz

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Yo 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 16:12:20
#10 ]
Team Member
Joined: 8-Oct-2004
Posts: 2042
From: France, on an ADSL line

@thread

Plaz speaks the truth. A want list is nice, an ACHIEVED list is far better.

Trust me on this......

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vox 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 16:19:05
#11 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2005
Posts: 3725
From: Belgrade, Serbia

@RobertJDohnert

Thank you for the whole interesting lists of what you believe is feasible.
AmigaOS 4 list is nice and even it all FLOSS and Linux components, should bring the OS forth,
as its very likely it will depend on FLOSS software in the future as OS4 depot proves now.

Quote:
Chromium for Amiga OS 4? Discuss --- Is this needed


Since MUI OWB is not likely to be improved for OS4 and Firefox is in alpha state,
it cant do no harm. And bringing Chromium to the pool, would be nice. However this
is quite complex project.

Quote:
Any device drivers developed for AROS will be developed for Amiga OS in conjunction. All device driver code, and all Application code will be released under the GPLv2 license or the orginal developers license.


This is very nice example of cooperation.

Quote:
Completion date: Estimated, January 2014 with first Beta being released November 2013


Looking forward to it, and if I receive X1000 by that time, willing to be beta tester.

Quote:
Systems sold by PC OpenSystems LLC, will have OS4 OpenLinux installed by default with Amiga OS sold as an option request by customers, machines sold by A-EON will be sold with the Amiga OS by default


Could it (OpenLinux) be virtuelized under OS4 if G5/PA Semi show some usable performance so actual dual boot, partitioning etc. are unnecessary? If that is hard to do, maybe a ETX3 driver for AmigaOS4 and FFS/JXFS read/write drivers could be developed for OpenLinux so file sharing became transparent?

Contrary to C-USA case this looks like a win-win situation, so it deserves support from all camps.
Now, major nagging was about high price of hardware offered? Is it un-updated page, could you get a bit better prices from partners, since that is a major contributing factor of your success beside nice software solutions :)

To satisfy MorphOS camp, any PPC hardware should be offered to MorphOS team to do port to, and when its done, MorphOS free test version or preinstalled full version could be offered as third boot option.

You seems to be in major competition with AresOne brand that uses same kind of logic.
You could think of their AEROS and other software solution, and include them as reseller in return. Or AROS system builder, tester and developer ...
http://www.aeros-os.org/

Also, you could think of including all major Amiga resellers
http://www.amigaos.net/content/4/where-buy

Summary:
... and if you have the nerves to get all licenses, time to do the job and the team, happy common future

And a joke ...

So it remains OpenLinux or is it OS4 Open Linux? How do you call machine with two OS4s (AOS and Linux) - OS8 or double OS4?

Last edited by vox on 30-Jun-2013 at 04:37 PM.
Last edited by vox on 30-Jun-2013 at 04:35 PM.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 16:31:54
#12 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10707
From: Norway

@RobertJDohnert

You have no idea how much work you talking about, do you have the time?
Anyway talk is cheap, come back when you have done something.

_________________
Please check out my software:
Excalibur, Basilisk 2, AmigaInputAnywhere.
LiveForIt-Music
http://lifeofliveforit.blogspot.no/

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Dirk-B 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 16:37:22
#13 ]
Super Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 1180
From: Belgium

@RobertJDohnert

All amiga related work, especially from the outside,
is very welcome, plus if it is covering all the camps.

Love and Peace.

_________________
A1G3-SE + OS4.1 u1 iso (x2)

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eliyahu 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 17:32:03
#14 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2010
Posts: 1729
From: Waterbury, Connecticut (USA)

@RobertJDohnert

Quote:
Help port device drivers

and which ones are you interested in bringing over? how will you get around licensing issues -- only port from BSD sources?

Quote:
Get the QT port up to date

have you already contacted alfkil?

Quote:
Port GTK

do you have any experience developing for AOS? do you plan on mapping to native widgets/classes? how many people will be working on this? have you talked with edgar schwan about his efforts here?

Quote:
Virtualization of Linux

that's a bit of a broad workitem. what exactly do you mean by this?

Quote:
linux Subsystem? For running Linux apps without a native port

there is no virtualization layer in AOS. nothing like WPARs in AIX or zones in solaris. at all. how would this work? at what level of compatibility would be offered? source-level? binary-level?

Quote:
Work with Jaminga to get Amiga Java Port stable and production ready – http://code.google.com/p/jamiga2

have you talked with joakim about this?

Quote:
Code a “network manager” type utility for Amiga

what functionality would it offer beyond our existing internet prefs tool? have you talked with olaf about roadshow and what would be involved?

Quote:
We will work with A-EON on the PowerPC initiative
Beg or borrow a X1000 system for porting to that machine
Initial release will support the X1000 and G4 and G5 Macs, we will work with other PPC developers on other class of hardware.
Systems sold by PC OpenSystems LLC, will have OS4 OpenLinux installed by default with Amiga OS sold as an option request by customers, machines sold by A-EON will be sold with the Amiga OS by default

other than reselling existing kit, have you come to agreement with A-EON on cooperation yet? what degree of cooperation is happening here?

Quote:
Start time July 1st, 2013
Platforms supported: AmigaOne X1000, legacy PPC Macs, namely G4 and G5.
Completion date: Estimated, January 2014 with first Beta being released November 2013

what benefits does your distro bring to the PPC platform that doesn't exist with fedora, mintppc, or any of the other mainstream distributions that already run on those platforms? what benefits would your distro bring specifically to our community?

Quote:
Provide a PowerPC platform for users and customers to deploy high end mission critical applications and services, as well as a soothing and elegant desktop experience.

what market analysis have you done that suggests there is a demand for such a platform beyond what IBM already offer in the server space? how would you add value to what A-EON already does here?

i'm not trying to be negative; i'm trying as best as possible to believe that you are sincere, that you've thought all of this through, and you didn't just come up with a list of stuff that would be neat and post it, figuring you'd work out the details later. i'm also trying very hard to ignore your 'branded' hardware offerings being significantly more expensive than even the existing retail prices of the same hardware without your distro and boing ball sticker. i'm even trying to overlook the fact that you call large firms 'partners' when you've paid for the privilege to resell their kit, have a small number of 'employees,' all of which have C-level executive titles, and that your business plan seems almost exactly like CUSA.

i very much look forward to seeing these questions answered in due time, and hope that you will become a valued member of our community and not just xxxxxxxxx -- or for that matter, xxxxxxxx, xxxxxxxx, or any of the others who believed the amiga name would bring them additional attention and sales, promising the moon, and then retreating into the night when they couldn't cash in as quickly as they'd hoped -- redux.

no doubt there will be skepticism at first, so i look forward to seeing genuine results. that's the best way to get us 'on side.'



-- eliyahu

Edited by Moderator to remove attacks on specific persons, who may or may not be able to defend themselves here in these forums.

Last edited by amigadave on 01-Jul-2013 at 12:53 AM.
Last edited by eliyahu on 30-Jun-2013 at 05:33 PM.

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terminills 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 18:29:35
#15 ]
Super Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 1234
From: Unknown

Removed by Moderator for Trolling & Personal Attack.

Last edited by amigadave on 01-Jul-2013 at 12:48 AM.

_________________
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"AROS is prolly illegal ~ Evert Carton" intentionally quoted out of context for dramatic effect

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AmigaMac 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 19:58:43
#16 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 26-Oct-2002
Posts: 969
From: 3rd Rock from the Sun!

@RobertJDohnert

I'd be curious of the whole operating system stack, from kernel to userland... what is this thing going to look like (technically speaking)? Obviously the kernel is Linux, but how will you implement Workbench and its dependencies?

Last edited by AmigaMac on 30-Jun-2013 at 08:00 PM.

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Aslak3 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 20:55:35
#17 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2012
Posts: 260
From: Southampton, UK

@NutsAboutAmiga

Though your reply is curt, I gotta agree. OS4 is far from Linux/Unix, and these porting efforts (especially GTK but all of them really) will require man years of effort.

I had a crack at a libpurple client, but just getting the library built was a task in itself. even with the kind help from Edgar. The SDK and Linux tools have massive holes (in terms of what is ported), and it's generally a frustrating experience. But hey, maybe I'm crap. :D Or at least lacking sufficient perseverance.

All the same, good luck. Come back when just one of those things is done. ;)

[EDIT: the "frustrating experience" is not AOS4 development - which is actually quite nice really. The frustration is from working in a pseudo linux environment, while at the same time working on an Amiga system. Chalk and cheese, as they say.]

Last edited by Aslak3 on 30-Jun-2013 at 09:05 PM.

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wawa 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 21:03:07
#18 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 5717
From: Unknown

@eliyahu

excellent. i was just too lazy to write down those and similar points.

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broadblues 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 21:35:28
#19 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 20-Jul-2004
Posts: 4125
From: Portsmouth England

@Aslak3

Quote:

The SDK and Linux tools have massive holes (in terms of what is ported), and it's generally a frustrating experience.


This is the problem with porting "portable code" when "portable code" realy means, builds on two kind of linux and a BSD.

When I get seriously inot a heaby port (like perl for example) I most often end up modify the windows fixes for the non posixness. Which has a certain irony I admit.

The SDK tools often work but give answers that the coder of the project you want to port simply doesn't expect.

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resle 
Re: Contributions that we plan to make to the Amiga community
Posted on 30-Jun-2013 21:56:02
#20 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 28-Nov-2005
Posts: 483
From: shanghai

Well, now -this- looks like a well conceived plan, whose direction and scope are very very clear. And if you doubt this very clear plan will become reality, well then you should trust that Cristobal guy who published a "message to the Amiga community". In that very professional statement:

"if Hyperion had the entire team of OS4 people I work with, Amiga OS 4.1 would be light years ahead of what it is. Hell, Roberto's wife has had several conversations with me about how she feels he is addicted to coding and would rather code than do anything else. He is always late for everything, he is disorganized and self filing"

oh please don't focus on the spitting over Hyperion's work, the only real recognizable continuation of the Amiga legacy to date.. and don't focus on the "always late and disorganized" thing, either.

focus, instead, on the clarity and consistency of this plan. Focus and try to picture the team, no - wait - the /company/ behind it. Done?

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