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      /  So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
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fishy_fis 
So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 1:51:44
#1 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 2156
From: Australia

A little while ago I had the idea to test old pc hardware from the 386/486/pentium1 era against 68k amigas to see at what point pcs caught up in what areas, and in what areas the amiga couldremain competitive the longest. As it turned out I wasnt as prepared hardware wise as Id initially thought, with the slowest working machines in my posession being too fast for a fair comparison.

I do however have many 10-20 year old pcs (and newer) so thought "lets see how the AmigaOne and especially Sam systems compete". When put on a similar playing field (sata drives, radeon 9200, and other like for like comparisons) where does the "new" ppc Amiga stand.
Over the next few weeks I'll be testing about half a dozen platforms on a few different OSes, using both "official" drivers and gallium/mesa.
Hopefully this will give people a rough idea of what to expect, performance wise out of OS4 hardware, as well as maybe a few ideas of what to expect once gallium3d is available to OS4.

On top of that it gives me another excuse to fool around with old computers, which is something Ive been enjoying lately :)

And before anyone bothers to point it out, yes, we all know general responsiveness on an amiga-oid system is very good even on low spec gear, but some (many) things are a matter of raw computational resources.

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Overflow 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 1:58:28
#2 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2012
Posts: 1628
From: Norway

@fishy_fis

Sounds like a intresting and fun project :)

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jtubbs 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 2:28:26
#3 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 10-Sep-2003
Posts: 396
From: Twin Falls, Idaho

@fishy_fis

Boy did your post bring back a memory. I had picked up the Amiga dealership when Commodore still owned it. I worked in a electronics/computer shop and the owner allowed me to sell the Amiga500's alongside our Tandy, Packard Bells and other stock. One day a customer was standing in front of my demo A500 looking despondent. "I have a question" he said. "How come this $600 computer is running circles around my $2500 386?" The Amiga was running NewTek's demo reel. Ahh those were days!

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sundown 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 2:59:07
#4 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Aug-2003
Posts: 5120
From: Right here...

@fishy_fis

You will find h/w benchmarks here http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=32815&forum=14

H/W benchmarks are interesting, but nothing more, in my opinion. Give me real World s/w tests that have real meaning, something you can't do between Amiga & a PC.

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fishy_fis 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 3:22:28
#5 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 2156
From: Australia

@sundown

I beg to differ. Surely running real, everyday software is representative of real world tests? :)
Given that a "modern" Amiga is pretty much the same as a pc, running the same software on both is a very fair method of comparison. The only thing different is the instruction set. To make it even more like for like Im even using the same hardware.

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BigGun 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 4:35:02
#6 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 8-Aug-2005
Posts: 438
From: Germany (Black Forest)

Part of the overall system performance is the memory speed.
Here are some results for you:

http://www.greyhound-data.com/gunnar/glibc/index.htm?page=benchmarks

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terminills 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 11:32:49
#7 ]
AROS Core Developer
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 1472
From: Unknown

@sundown

Quote:
Give me real World s/w tests that have real meaning, something you can't do between Amiga & a PC.



Yes you can. Benchmark Firefox vs Timberwolf.

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Chris_Y 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 13:29:51
#8 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2003
Posts: 3203
From: Beds, UK

@terminills

That isn't even a valid test, as Firefox on windows will have all sorts of optimisations and hardware acceleration that we don't (yet) have for Timberwolf. Even something simpler like NetSurf has vast frontend differences between platforms, and is not a fair comparison.

A better real world comparison will be to install Debian on the PC and the Amiga, and *then* run some real world software on both. Same OS, same software, direct hardware comparison (notwithstanding any PPC-specific drivers probably being a bit rubbish)

Last edited by Chris_Y on 22-Jul-2014 at 01:30 PM.

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Xmas87 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 13:32:18
#9 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 17-Sep-2013
Posts: 248
From: Unknown

@Chris_Y

In a wholly ridiculous thread, your comment is the only one with a glimmer sense!
First rule of experimentation - Minimise the variables.

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OlafS25 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 14:17:06
#10 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 6321
From: Unknown

@Xmas87

some time ago I collected some "lame" benchmarks

only indication and just one benchmark but the only one available everywhere

http://www.aros-platform.de/html/benchmarks.html

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terminills 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 14:34:40
#11 ]
AROS Core Developer
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 1472
From: Unknown

@Chris_Y


Then fix the OS.

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Chris_Y 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 15:30:53
#12 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2003
Posts: 3203
From: Beds, UK

@terminills

Huh?

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pavlor 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 15:34:05
#13 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@OlafS25

Quote:
but the only one available everywhere


dnetc suite is also available nearly on all platforms. However, it is not "benchmark" in classic sense.

Doom and Quake can be used for benchmarking and there are probably even more examples of multiplatform application benchmarks.

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pavlor 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 15:36:30
#14 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@fishy_fis

Quote:
Sam systems compete


460EX 1 GHz is comparable at best to Pentium III 1 GHz (I bet it is closer to 800 MHz). G3 and G4 CPUs deliver similar performance/clock as Pentium III (except AltiVec of course).

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Xmas87 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 15:55:13
#15 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 17-Sep-2013
Posts: 248
From: Unknown

@pavlor

We should remind ourselves, PIII, G3, G4 CPUs didn't get slow. The OSes that ran on them got bloated...

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Severin 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 16:14:42
#16 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 18-Aug-2003
Posts: 2740
From: Gloucestershire UK

@fishy_fis

If you're going to test different system's get timings for stuff people actually want... eg.

Time to install the OS.

Time to install a browser

Boot time from power on and reboot time

Time between when the desktop opens and it's actually usable.

Time to start a program, browser for example.

Years spent watching eggtimers and spinning balls.

Time how long it takes to boot, run a word precessor, type a one page letter, save it and shutdown.

Time (de)archiving lha, zip etc. eg:
> lha x -q Downloads:Dopus5_91_dev_os4_debug-13-06-14.lha ram:
> get _RunTime
1.253443

Shutdown Times

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Visit the Official OS4 Support Site for more help.

It may be that your sole purpose is to serve as a warning to others.

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jaokim 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 22-Jul-2014 17:06:18
#17 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 278
From: Sweden

I feel I must share my graph of a benchmark we did at amigaos.se. It's a bit old, but I think it still holds.

The phrase "högre är bättre", only means that a higher value is better, whereas for the other values lower is better.

Pay extra attention to the yellow bar!





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danwood 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 23-Jul-2014 5:23:57
#18 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2008
Posts: 1059
From: Unknown

@terminills

Quote:
Yes you can. Benchmark Firefox vs Timberwolf.


Seriously?! You've obviously never used Timberwolf then, it can be considered an Alpha release at best, barely useable on anything less than an X1000. It takes over 2 mins to even load up on my A1XE and then consumes 100% of the CPU while loaded, certainly not at the stage it's ready for benchmark tests, it's a proof of concept really IMHO.

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matthey 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 23-Jul-2014 6:53:54
#19 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2007
Posts: 1968
From: Kansas

Quote:

Xmas87 wrote:
We should remind ourselves, PIII, G3, G4 CPUs didn't get slow. The OSes that ran on them got bloated...


+1

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Vistaus 
Re: So, how fast/slow *is* OS4 hardware?
Posted on 23-Jul-2014 9:51:55
#20 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 29-Jul-2013
Posts: 332
From: Unknown

@Chris_Y

And aside from the Windows optimisations: Timberwolf is based on FF4. FF for Windows is on version 31 now.

If anything, the only browser test that could be done is Odyssey vs something like Safari. But instead of focussing on the browser, just focussing on the engine (WebKit) instead. But even that won't be too fair unless the test is done on an X1000.

Last edited by Vistaus on 23-Jul-2014 at 09:53 AM.

_________________
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