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Nimrod 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 23-Apr-2017 22:12:00
#101 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2010
Posts: 1184
From: Untied Kingdom

@BigD

Was Charlie Gard also created in the image of your god? Charlie Gard is the little boy who was sentenced to death by a judge because his parents wanted to try a new and different therapy for his mitochondrial disease, but the judge decided that it was in his best interests to be allowed to slowly die. Scientists are trying everything they can to make life better for humanity, while theists seem to rejoice every time a child dies of a preventable disease. It is not all that long ago that the idea of eradicating Smallpox and Polio were also deemed by people like you to be engaging in some kind of "sick eugenics program" as you put it.

Quote:
My final warning to you is keep pretending you understand and care about what the Bible has to say at your own peril.

Why. What are you going to do to me? Are you planning to burn me at the stake as a Heretic? Or do you intend to follow the examples set by your Islamic counterparts and behead some scientists, or call for a fatwa against apostates, which is what I am. I was once a committed Christian, educated in a CofE Cathedral school. I only stopped being a Christian when I learned the skill of critical thinking, a skill that you would find useful if you ever decided to become a scientist.
Or maybe you think that threatening me with your imaginary friend is going to frighten me into submission. Sorry old chap, I stopped listening to the "my skydaddy is bigger than your skydaddy" line of debate a long, long time ago.

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BigD 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 24-Apr-2017 1:21:08
#102 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4114
From: UK

@Nimrod

Quote:
I only stopped being a Christian when I learned the skill of critical thinking


Absolute baloney! Once 'saved' always saved or maybe you were never saved in the first place. Anyone can go through the motions take part in the rituals wear a dress and sing as a choir boy in a cathedral it doesn't mean that much and on par with other sects and cults you mention. Actually BEING a Christian is different and involves being BORN AGAIN. I'm sorry the impersonal CofE denomination didn't teach you that but there's plenty more churches to choose from and some even take the Bible seriously and some of them are still part of the Church of England!

Critical thinking would be to go to chuch that actual explained what to be a Christian was rather than one that just lights candles and encourages men to wear dresses! My experience of Cathedral staff is unfriendly preoccupied dress wearing blokes who seem obsessed about Evensong rather than saying hello to strangers. These days they are just as zealous about multi-faith services and 'giving the Quran equal air time' rather than preaching from the Bible. I'm not surprised you found them a bunch of hypocrites to be honest.

What I'm more concerned with is why you think murdering the unborn is progress but I now realise it's easy for you to visualise the small bundles of cells as underlings. Much the same as the Nazis viewed the Russians and Jews as sub human. Talk about history repeating

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Nimrod 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 24-Apr-2017 14:51:51
#103 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2010
Posts: 1184
From: Untied Kingdom

@BigD

Quote:
Actually BEING a Christian is different and involves being BORN AGAIN.

You mean like Jesus supposedly got born again in AD6 according to Luke's legend, having previously been born more than ten years before and then presumably shoved back where he came from.
Matthew claims that Jesus was a young child during the reign of Herod, yet Luke sets his nativity story more than ten years after Herod had died and has Jesus as a pre-born. This is as big a flaw in the "Jesus of Nazareth" fantasy as hypersonic flying reindeer is in the Santa Claus story.
It has nothing to do with what colour dress the preacher wears at what time of the year, this is all about the book on which the entire castle-in-the-air of the Christian religion is built on. The failure of Christianity to be relevant any more has nothing to do with whether you adhere to the KJV or prefer the NWT or even the Douay-Rheims, it is about reading whichever book you prefer with your eyes open and seeing the errors, misrepresentations, plagiarisms of Greek mythology, internal inconsistencies, contradictions and even deliberate lies.
Your experience of Anglicans in a Cathedral does not mirror my own. They were actually very helpful in their attempts to keep me in the flock, and they certainly weren't hypocritical or "holier-than-thou. Unfortunately for them (and you) I can smell bovine excrement regardless of how it is disguised. The stories do not add up in modern English, nor do they add up in the Latin Vulgate that preceded the translations into the vernacular, and the New Testament as it was written in koine Greek still doesn't add up. (Latin was compulsory at my school and classical Greek was optional.)

If you want to convince me that there is something wrong with mitochondrial transfer you will need to prove that it doesn't work effectively or that it involves the destruction of a sentient, self-aware entity, not just a single unfertilised ovum. The fertilised nucleus is the one that is allowed to develop, a point you tried to lie about earlier claiming that the fertilised ovum was the one destroyed in the process. You are right about one thing though. I have as little concern for the "welfare" of an unfertilised gamete that has only half the necessary DNA to go on to become a fully formed human as I have for a tissue scrape that could theoretically be used to produce a human clone.

Why do you think that carrying out an experiment on a couple of cells, or even a single cell is "murder" yet are quite happy with the bibles use of abortion as a test of fidelity, or its decision that the killing of a late stage foetus as a consequence of miscarriage only warrants financial restitution to the father of the dead unborn child.

Quote:
Much the same as the Nazis viewed the Russians and Jews as sub human.
That would be the Catholic and Lutheran Nazis, viewing the Russian Orthodox Russians and the Jews as ntermenschlich. Christians have been committing acts of genocide in the name of their dead god for over a millennium, and are directly responsible for more slaughter than the Muslims.

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BigD 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 24-Apr-2017 20:31:28
#104 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4114
From: UK

@Nimrod

Quote:
That would be the Catholic and Lutheran Nazis


Did you even bother to read the link I gave you or are you still claiming that Adolf Hitler was a Christian himself because he had Catholic parents

You really are an ignorant of a lot of history. I've given you a link already but here's another one:

https://lfb.org/dietrich-bonhoeffer-and-the-confessing-church/

Quote:
And, then, there were the truly radical voices, such as Bonhoeffer, who came to condemn Nazi violations of civil liberties whether or not they involved the church...

...In February 1945, Bonhoeffer was sent to the Buchenwald concentration camp where, at the age of 39, he was hanged on April 9. Four members of the Bonhoeffer family similarly died that day: Dietrich, his brother and two brothers-in-law.


In addition Margaret (Marga) Meusel coordinated a Christian respose to the civil liberties being taken from the Jews:

Quote:
When the Nuremberg Laws of September 1935 stripped the last civil liberties from Jews, some Church radicals began to actively but covertly assist them. One such radical was a Berlin social worker and deaconess named Margaret (Marga) Meusel. In May 1935, Meusel had addressed a formal “memorandum on the duties of the Confessing Church to the Protestant non-Aryans” to Church leaders in an attempt to mobilize support for converted Jews.


The trials the Confessing Church are evident. Bonhoeffer was hanged for standing up for Biblical morality and being prepared to die for the cause in an act of commendable self sacrifice as Jesus set us as an example. True Bible believing Christians faced persecution during the rise of the Nazis. Yes, the churches that kept quiet got off far easier but they were cowards and were probably not saved themselves if they were prepared to stop preaching the Bible as things got worse (if they ever started) to keep their cushy lifestyle. Actually being a Christian demands a far greater sacrifice and life change than just lighting candles in a culturally irrelavant cathedral building or arranging the flower rota while the Nazis destroyed their beloved Germany around them

Anyway, your faith position and irrational belief in chaos creating order has biased your view of the world to such an extent and you are so set in your ways that you can't even fact check simple points of history, religion and science. There is no reason to continue this charade. I just hope you get down off your high horse one day and review the issue of 3-parent babies. It's an issue worthy of further thought from you that you don't seem to have been able to give it during this opportunity.

Quote:
not just a single unfertilised ovum


Case in point. For the third time: PRONUCLEAR TRANSFER INVOLVES THE DESTRUCTION OF A HUMAN EMBRYO TAKEN FROM THE THIRD PARENT AND HARVESTED FOR IT'S MITOCHONDRIA. BOTH MITOCHODRIAL TRANSFER PROCESSES OPEN THE DOOR FOR GENETIC EXPERIMENTATION ON HUMANS AND HAVE THE SAME LIFE DESTROYING 'SPARE EMBRYOS ARE INCINERATED' WORK PROCESSES AS IVF. MITOCHODRIAL TRANSFER IS LICENSED UNDER UK LAW AND ISN'T LEGALLY LEGISLATED FOR IN ANY OTHER COUNTRY ON EARTH. WE ARE A ROGUE STATE ON THIS ISSUE AND NOT THE BEACON OF PROGRESS YOU THINK WE ARE ... and WAKE UP!!!

If you don't engage with simple arguments then there's no point reasoning with you.

Last edited by BigD on 24-Apr-2017 at 09:15 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 24-Apr-2017 at 09:01 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 24-Apr-2017 at 08:58 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 24-Apr-2017 at 08:51 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 24-Apr-2017 at 08:45 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 24-Apr-2017 at 08:37 PM.

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Nimrod 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 25-Apr-2017 20:34:49
#105 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2010
Posts: 1184
From: Untied Kingdom

@BigD

Quote:
Did you even bother to read the link I gave you or are you still claiming that Adolf Hitler was a Christian himself because he had Catholic parents

I did read the link you posted, but I wasn't impressed impressed with the lies and logical fallacies in that link any more than the lies in the book "Who moved the stone" that you suggested I should read, that I had already read and refuted. I notice how quiet you went when I pointed this out earlier, just as I notice how you can't answer my questions about the bible.

Congratulations for finding one or two Christians who stood up and were counted among the opponents of the Nazis. Just don't forget the two thirds of the entire population of Germany who were Lutheran Christians who failed to stand up to Hitler, or the one third of the population of Germany who were Catholics who also failed to stand up to Adolf Hitler. Do you really expect anybody to accept that the entire population of Germany were more scared of Adolf Hitler than they were of the advancing army of communist Russians? And claiming that there were only the two named "real Christians in the whole of wartime Germany has to be the ultimate in "No True Scotsman" dishonesty, or are you as ignorant of logical fallacies as you are everything else. I can name more Nazis who stood up for humanity than you can name activist Christians who did the same, mainly because you are ignorant of the White Rose movement which was made up of students who attended Munich University, or the SPD (Social Democrats), the KPD (Communists), or the Red Orchestra in Berlin. You mention the confessing church but you seem unaware that Martin Niemoller was one of the founders of the confessing church in 1934 but was still making perjorative comments about Jews who kept their faith while he was protecting Christians who had Jewish ancestry. Throughout history Christians have committed atrocity after atrocity. Do you really need me to list some of them for you?

Don't forget that John Rabe was a high ranking Nazi who stood up against the Japanese in Nanking and as a result saved the lives of around 200,000 people. Does that mean that every Nazi was a heroic humanitarian? The few Christians you cite are the exception, not the rule, and *ALL* are "true Christians"



Quote:
Case in point. For the third time:
I doesn't matter how often you reiterate your lie, nor does it improve your case if you lie in uppercase. A lie remains nothing more than a lie There are three forms of Mitochondrial transfer, MST, PBT and PNT and only PNT fertilises both the donor and the recipient ova. The fact remains that these single cells are not deemed to be living breathing Human beings by the bibles own standards, but you seem to be demanding the application of double standards, which is pretty typical for a theofascist.
You consider it important that no attempt to make any form of progress unless it is specifically permitted. Do you know that when the Wright brothers defied your god by flying a heavier than air flying machine, there was no law permitting it. Had they waited until they had permission from the state, we would still be waiting. Normally a country's legislature only allows something after it has been proved to be viable and valuable. Until then it is legal simply because it has not been made illegal. Governments only make decisions after the event, and then only so that they can regulate and limit its use. So far the governments of Mexico and Ukraine have seen fit not to limit the techniques, which is why the first successful transfer didn't use the UK government approved PNT but took the nucleus from the genetic mothers unfertilised ovum and put it into a pre-emptied donor unfertilised ovum. The modified ovum was then fertilised meaning that no zygote was harmed in the process of making this baby. Or do you not even understand the difference between a gamete and a zygote?
The UK is no more a rogue state than America was when the first aeroplane took to the skies, or than Germany was when the first true automobile using a petrol engine trundled through the streets of Mannheim. Science works best when it is done by scientists, not politicians or purveyors of plagiarised fantasy, which is all religion is. And until you can defend your made up deity by answering my set of eight simple bible questions, it is not me that is the one avoiding the issue
1) Who was Joseph's father, was it Jacob (Matthew1:16), or Heli (Luke3:23)
2) Why is there a thriving city at 33.2708° N, 35.1961° E
3) What is the text of the last of "The Ten Commandments" and what does it prohibit.
4) How long did Sargon1 of the Akkadian Empire spend treading water during Noahs flood?
5) What was created for Adam to be "a help meet unto him"?
6) Do rabbits chew the cud? (Lev11:6)and are bats a type of bird (Lev11:19)
7) Was little baby jesus born before Archelaus became Tetrarch of Judaea, or after Augustus had deposed Archelaus from that position?
8) How many Koalas and Kangaroos were on the Ark, as well as Wallabies and Wombats? Are marsupials classed as "clean" or "unclean" creatures, and who knew since the definitions are not given until Leviticus.

Last edited by Nimrod on 25-Apr-2017 at 08:47 PM.

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BigD 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 25-Apr-2017 22:56:06
#106 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4114
From: UK

@Nimrod

Quote:
And until you can defend your made up deity by answering my set of eight simple bible questions, it is not me that is the one avoiding the issue


Me thinks you're the one that needs to defend your own god complex

Matthew 7:6

Quote:
"Don't waste what is holy on people who are unholy. Don't throw your pearls to pigs! They will trample the pearls, then turn and attack you.


... that exactly sums you up. You trample wisdom and bite the hand that gave it to you.

Get a clue or get off this thread (preferably both). I have no intention of going against the advice of the Matthew 7:6 verse to discuss the wisdom of the Bible with you. You don't value human life, the Bible or the scientific method. I have nothing further to say other than I'll be praying for you.

And as for your spurious attempt at scientific discussion and ridiculous high and mighty opinion of yourself regarding your knowledge (or lack of it) of religion, science and history.........

Last edited by BigD on 26-Apr-2017 at 08:07 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 25-Apr-2017 at 10:57 PM.

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BigD 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 25-Apr-2017 23:37:02
#107 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4114
From: UK

@Thread

All this thread proves (thanks primarily to Nimrod's demonstration of the general apathy on this issue), is that it is important for Christians in society to stand up for those without a voice whether it be the Jews during the time of the Nazi rule of Germany or the unborn children in our modern society. Without Christians making the arguments and taking a stand for the voiceless minorities they would continue to be persecuted, abused and murdered.

The naive may argue that by experimenting on human beings the scientific progress achieved is on par with the development of the aeroplane but our consciences know that to be false. No human being was purposely sacrificed to develop the aeroplane, but today we are prepared to sacrifice the country's children first via mass abortions and now by legislating for unethical genetic research! No other country thinks Mitochondrial Transfer should be persued and no other country views this as progress. Future generations will look back and call the UK's abandonment of morality on this issue EUGENICS and it will be viewed as a black stain on our history.

... and back to the regular news coverage. Ms Trump defends her father at W20 Summit (shock horror ), Arsene Wenger may stay at Arsenal after all and Britain's Got Talent is back on TV! It's debatable whether Britain has got talent but it certainly hasn't got any medical ethics or common sense any more

Last edited by BigD on 26-Apr-2017 at 08:04 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 25-Apr-2017 at 11:42 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 25-Apr-2017 at 11:40 PM.

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Nimrod 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 27-Apr-2017 20:51:14
#108 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2010
Posts: 1184
From: Untied Kingdom

@BigD
I liked your quote from Matthew 7:6 but I think you should also read Matthew 7:4-5 and apply its message to your own activities. Yo accuse me of having my fingers in my ears, yet I am the one that has addressed every single one of your claims and shown why they have less than zero merit. Meanwhile despite not having my fingers in my ears I have heard no response from you to my questions about why I should believe the claims made in your book of myths and legends (aka the "Wholly Babble") and not the holy books of all the other religions that are on offer.

I DO value human life, and I value it even more than the bible instructs me to value it, which is why I do not consider it moral to sell my daughter as a sex-slave, nor do I consider it "justice" to stone a checkout assistant in my local supermarket to death for working on Sunday. I also disagree with the judge who sentenced Charlie Gard to death for the crime of being born with a genetic defect, and I refuse to put the needs of a single cell above that of a living human being who was carried by its mother for the full gestation and got born either the old fashioned way or the current trend for elective caesarean section.

The only one displaying a "high and mighty" opinion of himself is the fascist who opened a thread on a COMPUTER website to demand support to block medical progress, not because the science behind it is in any way flawed,but because his imaginary friend doesn't want people to be permitted to either think for themselves or make decisions without the permission of a bunch of men in dresses who have no idea of either the scientific principle, or indeed ANY form of principles.

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Nimrod 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 27-Apr-2017 21:14:27
#109 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2010
Posts: 1184
From: Untied Kingdom

@BigD
Your attempt to appeal to "Thread" is not going to help you. Nobody here is going to spring to your defence, not because they are apathetic but because they are not opposed to medical science improving the lot of humanity in the face of opposition from superstitious fools who want to return this country to "The Dark Ages" when gullible people kowtowed to men in dresses "because god"

Once again you cite Nazi Germany, totally ignoring the fact that every Jew, Jehovah's Witness, homosexual, or disabled person who died in the gas chambers did so at the hands of committed Christians, both Lutheran and Catholic.

You claim that no other country supports mitochondrial transfer and yet two countries have successfully and legally carried out mitochondrial transfers, neither of which caused any harm to a human being. The two reasons that no human being was harmed in either the Mexican or Ukrainian births are that a single cell is not a human being, and that the single cells used as donor cells for mitochondria would never have developed into a human due to the fact that they were unfertilised ova and therefore had only half the genetic material needed to make a Human. The fact that other countries have not passed specific laws permitting scientific progress doesn't mean progress is illegal. There is no law anywhere in the British judicial system that permits me to scratch my butt, but that doesn't mean that it is illegal for me to relieve itchy piles.

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Nimrod 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 27-Apr-2017 21:19:08
#110 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2010
Posts: 1184
From: Untied Kingdom

@BigD
You keep rambling on about "Christian values" so I thought I would pot a translation of some historic "Christian values"

Accordingly, it must and dare not be considered a trifling matter but a most serious one to seek counsel against this and to save our souls from the Jews, that is, from the devil and from eternal death. My advice, as I said earlier, is:

First, that their synagogues be burned down, and that all who are able toss in sulphur and pitch; it would be good if someone could also throw in some hellfire. That would demonstrate to God our serious resolve and be evidence to all the world that it was in ignorance that we tolerated such houses, in which the Jews have reviled God, our dear Creator and Father, and his Son most shamefully up till now, but that we have now given them their due reward.

Second, that all their books their prayer books, their Talmudic writings, also the entire Bible, be taken from them, not leaving them one leaf, and that these be preserved for those who may be converted. For they use all of these books to blaspheme the Son of God, that is, God the Father himself, Creator of heaven and earth, as was said above; and they will never use them differently.

Third, that they be forbidden on pain of death to praise God, to give thanks, to pray, and to teach publicly among us and in our country. They may do this in their own country or wherever they can without our being obliged to hear it or know it. The reason for this prohibition is that their praise, thanks, prayer, and doctrine are sheer blasphemy, cursing, and idolatry, because their heart and mouth call God the Father *Hebel Vorik* as they call his Son, our Lord Jesus, this. For as they name and honour the Son, thus they also name and honour the Father. It does not help them to use many fine words and to make much ado about the name of God. For we read, "You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain" [Exodus.20:7]. Just as little did it avail their ancestors at the time of the kings of Israel that they bore God's name, yet called him Baal.

Fourth, that they be forbidden to utter the name of God within our hearing.For we cannot with a good conscience listen to this or tolerate it, because their blasphemous and accursed mouth and heart call God's Son *Hebel Vorik,* and thus also call his Father that. He cannot and will not interpret this otherwise, just as we Christians too cannot interpret it otherwise, we who believe that however the Son is named and honoured thus also the Father is named and honoured. Therefore we must not consider the mouth of the Jews as worthy of uttering the name of God within our hearing. He who hears this name-from a Jew must inform the authorities, or else throw sow dung at him when he sees him and chase him away. And may no one be merciful and kind in this regard, for God's honour and the salvation of us all, including that of the Jews, are at stake!


Martin Luther "Von den Jüden und iren Lügen" Chapter 17

Little wonder that Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi, himself a Hindu said "I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ"

And don't try to pretend that you are any better than all the ones you class as "Not true Christians" I refer you once again to Matthew 7:4-5.

Last edited by Nimrod on 27-Apr-2017 at 09:26 PM.
Last edited by Nimrod on 27-Apr-2017 at 09:25 PM.
Last edited by Nimrod on 27-Apr-2017 at 09:24 PM.

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BigD 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 27-Apr-2017 21:29:10
#111 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4114
From: UK

@Nimrod

Quote:
The two reasons that no human being was harmed in either the Mexican or Ukrainian births are that a single cell is not a human being, and that the single cells used as donor cells for mitochondria would never have developed into a human due to the fact that they were unfertilised ova and therefore had only half the genetic material needed to make a Human.


I'm the one with the fingers in my ears regarding your comments. You continue to post absolute bile and it's not worth my time reading the same lies repeated like you're beyond reproach . Everything you say is twisting and distorting the truth. For example while the procedure in Mexico may or may not have been via Maternal Spindle Transfer that still doesn't alter the fact that Pronuclear Transfer is ALSO allowed in the UK which DOES sacrifice a fertilised embryo i.e. a human being. Also, Mexico hasn't as yet legislated on this issue so it's not so much that it's legal but that their laws are lax.

HERE'S the full procedure of Pronuclear transfer as carried out by Newcastle University researchers at The Centre for Life (aka Death )
Quote:
The Procedure

In vitro fertilization techniques are used to create an embryo with the intended parents’ sperm and egg. The resulting embryo has the mother’s unhealthy mitochondria, found in the cytoplasm of her egg.
At day one of embryonic development, while the embryo is still a single undivided cell, the two pronuclei, or unfused nuclei of the egg and sperm, are removed from the cell for transfer. Removal of the two pronuclei leaves behind almost all of the mother’s unhealthy nuclei. The cell without nuclei is then discarded.

Separately, a second EMBRYO is created from the egg of an unrelated female donor, which has healthy mitochondria, and the intended father’s sperm. While the intended father’s sperm is usually preferred, donor sperm could be used if the intended father’s sperm is not of sufficient quality and to avoid intracytoplasmic sperm injection, ICSI. The second embryo is also enucleated at day one of development.

The intending parents’ pronuclei are then inserted into the second enucleated embryo.

The new embryo now contains the pronuclear DNA of the intended parents and the healthy mitochondria from the female donor’s egg.

The embryo can now be transferred back into the intended mother and can continue to develop unaffected by inherited mitochondrial disease.

... who cares about the second pronucleus pair discarded out of the SECOND embryo? Is it just another sacrifice for the sake of progress? Please make note of the flippant term 'ENUCLEATED' as this is the language of the new form of genocide. It's not considered immoral if you tell yourself it's a ENUCLEATED embryo rather than what it is: A HUMAN BEING sacrificed to allow another embryo to develop 'normally' by stealing it's mitochondria! It's sick and unsettling without question.

In fact it has been revealed that Newcastle has better results from sacrificing embryos than using unfertilised eggs so had no quarms about continuing to favour Pronuclear Transfer:

Quote:
The first point of interest was that this was a largely successful process, whereas a paper from the Newcastle Centre earlier in the year (Hyslop et al. 2016) had less success with maternal spindle transfer and had suggested that transfer of pronuclei shortly after completion of meiosis might be preferred. The choice of method has implications for ethical acceptance of the procedure, since maternal spindle transfer is performed on unfertilised oocytes while pronuclear transfer requires both donor and recipient eggs to be fertilised.
Source

I don't need to speak to the thread for defence against your arguments, I just have nothing further to say to you! Reconsider your position or don't but since I see you as someone that hates the unborn I see that as a major impasse against further debate. You'll be in my prayers but don't expect a Christmas card

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Rob 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 28-Apr-2017 18:04:58
#112 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 20-Mar-2003
Posts: 5575
From: S.Wales

@BigD

Are you a fan of Naughty Boy?

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Nimrod 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 29-Apr-2017 20:56:11
#113 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2010
Posts: 1184
From: Untied Kingdom

@BigD
Quote:
Everything you say is twisting and distorting the truth.
How is asking a set of questions "distorting the truth"?
1) Who was Joseph's father, was it Jacob (Matthew1:16), or Heli (Luke3:23)
2) Why is there a thriving city at 33.2708° N, 35.1961° E
3) What is the text of the last of "The Ten Commandments" and what does it prohibit.
4) How long did Sargon1 of the Akkadian Empire spend treading water during Noahs flood?
5) What was created for Adam to be "a help meet unto him"?
6) Do rabbits chew the cud? (Lev11:6)and are bats a type of bird (Lev11:19)
7) Was little baby jesus born before Archelaus became Tetrarch of Judaea, or after Augustus had deposed Archelaus from that position?
8) How many my set of eight simple bible questions, it is not me that is the one avoiding the issue
Koalas and Kangaroos were on the Ark, as well as Wallabies and Wombats? Are marsupials classed as "clean" or "unclean" creatures, and who knew since the definitions are not given until Leviticus.
Until you have provided satisfactory full and honest answers to these questions I have no reason to treat your imaginary friend in any different manner than you treat Odin or Zeus.

I will once again reiterate that a single cell is not a Human being, even if it is a zygote rather than a gamete. Mexico has not legislated to permit the playing of football either. Since the ban on playing football in England was first introduced in 1315 I would say that the Mexicans have a lot of catching up to do. Either that or Catholic Mexico has a far greater grasp of reality, allowing the people who are experts at their job decide what it entails far better than any lawyer can manage.

Quote:
... who cares about the second pronucleus pair discarded out of the SECOND embryo?
Who cares about Charlie Gard, a human child with far more than just the one single cell. A child who has been condemned to death because a judge felt that it was in Charlie's best interest that he die. You pretend to be concerned about the loss of single cells while remaining militantly opposed to allowing medical research that could do something about eradicating some of the major flaws in the human genome. Perhaps because those flaws show that what you refer to as "god's image" is malformed, and that the argument about "Intelligent Design" collapses in the face of so many design flaws. Just as the more than three billion years worth of fossils demonstrates that death has been around for more than six thousand years. In fact the fact that things were dying long before the first human evolved proves that it wasn't all Eve's fault.

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Thorham 
Re: Three Parent Babies given the all clear in the UK
Posted on 2-May-2017 1:36:28
#114 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 5-Mar-2014
Posts: 183
From: Unknown

Can a moderator PLEASE delete this thread, or at least shut it down? Please? It's gone on long enough.

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