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      /  Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
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Fl@sh 
Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 7:32:32
#1 ]
Member
Joined: 6-Oct-2004
Posts: 11
From: Napoli - Italy

I'd like to know a short answer why Hyperion guys didn't followed the way of porting Amiga Os4 development to cheap and very popular hardware platforms like xbox/ps3 consoles, imac/power mac computers or any other diffused and cheap ppc device.
It's a software house who lives selling software so: why don't sell million of copies instead of few thousand?

I'd like to use a power mac to run OS4 and/or also a ps3 console, I can imagine it'll rest a dream
Why?

Last edited by Fl@sh on 02-Feb-2018 at 07:37 AM.

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cha05e90 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 8:00:38
#2 ]
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Joined: 18-Apr-2009
Posts: 1260
From: Germany

@Fl@sh

Quote:
Why?

Really? You're asking this question in 2018? Wow...

Last edited by cha05e90 on 02-Feb-2018 at 08:01 AM.

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Fl@sh 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 8:51:42
#3 ]
Member
Joined: 6-Oct-2004
Posts: 11
From: Napoli - Italy

@cha05e90

I apologie if it's a FAQ question, but please consider me as just landed from mars after many many years

So really, is there someone who can explain it, in a short way, avoiding me to investigate at least latest 10 years of amiga story?

Last edited by Fl@sh on 02-Feb-2018 at 08:52 AM.

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Chain-Q 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 9:22:13
#4 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 31-Jan-2005
Posts: 790
From: Budapest, Hungary

@Fl@sh
As others pointed out, this was an alternative 10 years ago, but by now, it's not what a hardware roadmap for the future should look like. And there's an alternative AmigaOS-like system which went that path with quite a success (although quite far from millions of copies), and supports most G4 and G5 Macs by now, including portables.

It runs 68k Amiga software (at about the same level of compatibility like OS4) and if you want, you can make it look and feel like OS4.

Now, why Hyperion didn't follow that path... Lack of common sense, I guess? Overconfidence? Who knows... But this boat has sailed by now for sure.

Edit: also worth noting, that along the same time MorphOS went Mac, so about a decade ago, there was an effort to port OS4 to Mac mini G4 (a project nicknamed "Moana"), on which they eventually pulled the plug for unknown reasons. A very early port even leaked, but was nowhere near useable in practice, due to lack of drivers (no IDE, network, audio, etc), general buggyness (it was a very early alpha) and AFAIR lack of support for specialities of the Mac hardware and software environment (partition table, Mac filesystems, etc). So yeah...

Last edited by Chain-Q on 02-Feb-2018 at 09:59 AM.

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resle 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 10:34:49
#5 ]
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Joined: 28-Nov-2005
Posts: 496
From: shanghai

@Chain-Q

Hah, I never noticed someone quoted me in a signature. Cute Thanks (I don't even remember when I said that!)

Anyway..

@Fl@sh

Because they pursued an apple-like strategy, control over software *and* hardware. Hyperion probably (most probably) had and has "under the table" agreements with the makers of all those exotic ppc crap, with revenue sharing.

This is how you build a niche to exploit: Cage after cage after cage.

Last edited by resle on 02-Feb-2018 at 10:40 AM.
Last edited by resle on 02-Feb-2018 at 10:40 AM.

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Chain-Q 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 10:50:31
#6 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 31-Jan-2005
Posts: 790
From: Budapest, Hungary

@resle
Well, just I wish you'd said 880K floppy... But it was still a good quote nevertheless. And it was looooong time ago indeed.

Last edited by Chain-Q on 02-Feb-2018 at 10:51 AM.

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Fl@sh 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 13:51:34
#7 ]
Member
Joined: 6-Oct-2004
Posts: 11
From: Napoli - Italy

@resle

Ok ok apple strategy and hw revenue shares seems to be a valid explanation.
But what avoided them to pursuit both strategies?

Most sw developers try to support old and new hardware, simply because they can sell to old and new customers.
In this case all 'old hardware' was far much better than recent hardware (with some very expensive exceptions).

Does exists some link to read, for an official position about the topic?

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number6 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 14:38:08
#8 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9994
From: In the village

@Chain-Q

Quote:
(a project nicknamed "Moana"), on which they eventually pulled the plug for unknown reasons


I respectfully disagree. The document is still available on freeamiga. You might recall that this took place during the lawsuit Amiga Inc. vs Hyperion VOF. This was a risk.

one on-topic link

#6

Last edited by number6 on 02-Feb-2018 at 03:03 PM.

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pavlor 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 16:04:06
#9 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 8572
From: Unknown

@Fl@sh

Why not use your cheap PC? WinUAE works quite good on decent hardware.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 16:55:32
#10 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10767
From: Norway

@Fl@sh

PS3 is locked down by Sony, it was only by hacking the PS3, was it possible to get Linux installed. I guess that answers that one. AmigaONE's where picked over outdated Mac with any warranty or continued development. MorphOS developer choose differently and went for old PowerPC Mac's.

I'm not sure most people removed Sony PS3 OS to get AmigaOS4.x installed, people buy Sony PS3 to play games not to mess around with an obscure OS.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 02-Feb-2018 at 04:59 PM.

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Chain-Q 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 19:13:25
#11 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 31-Jan-2005
Posts: 790
From: Budapest, Hungary

@number6
That still doesn't explain why they never finished it since. After all, the Sam440ep project, mentioned in the same mail got finished and saw the light of day. In fact it was released during the lawsuit, or was the direct cause of it, if I'm not mistaken.

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number6 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 19:24:47
#12 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9994
From: In the village

@Chain-Q

Quote:
That still doesn't explain why they never finished it since.


The developer left the scene.
http://amigaworld.net/userinfo.php?uid=1362

#6

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Chain-Q 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 20:35:08
#13 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 31-Jan-2005
Posts: 790
From: Budapest, Hungary

@number6
So, such strategic decisions regarding the future of the platform depend on if one developer is around or not?

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number6 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 20:51:38
#14 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 9994
From: In the village

@Chain-Q

I can not read anyone's mind, but AW has a rich history that indicates to me:
(1)When HJF used the term "showstopper" a period of h/w desperation began. I'm referring to when the knowledge came to them that Eyetech's days were at an end here.
(2)When the lawsuit came along, they considered any options they felt might lead to solving that problem. Ergo, many varied alternatives considered.
(3)That changes when Hyperion joins with A-eon.

We don't know the content of contracts, but I seriously doubt Mac h/w was being discussed after this partnership was formed.

Agree?

#6

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Lou 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 21:03:57
#15 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 2-Nov-2004
Posts: 3842
From: Rhode Island

The Wii U is well-hacked and understood.
3-core 1.24Ghz, 2GB ram...and cheap!

http://hexkyz.blogspot.de/2018/01/anatomy-of-wii-u-end.html

Last edited by Lou on 02-Feb-2018 at 09:13 PM.

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g01df1sh 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 21:09:26
#16 ]
Super Member
Joined: 16-Apr-2009
Posts: 1271
From: UK

@Lou

I was thinking Nintendo as well. Does the wiiU have hard drive?

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Lou 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 2-Feb-2018 21:14:42
#17 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 2-Nov-2004
Posts: 3842
From: Rhode Island

@g01df1sh

It has 8 or 32 GB of flash (plain vs deluxe model) but has USB ports.
Supposedly, the GPU is about a Radeon 4X80HD series...which is more powerful than 360 or PS3 gpus... Also 4 times the system ram (2GB vs 512MB and 256+256MB) of those two...

Last edited by Lou on 02-Feb-2018 at 09:17 PM.

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logicalheart 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 3-Feb-2018 5:32:10
#18 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 2-Dec-2003
Posts: 682
From: Sandy, Utah. USA

There are many reasons why the O.S. is not ported.
Here are a few major ones which I recognize.
- Hyperion would need to stop work on everything else for an unknown period of time
- there is no cooperation from the CPU or GPU Vendor
- there is nobody to write the hardware drivers, and no cooperation from those vendors
- there is nobody to work on the bios

Think of it this way. If someone would create the drivers and bios, that would provide a foundation for Hyperion to port the operating system. Nobody is offering to do a portion of that work and vendor cooperation, except for ACube and A-Eon. Hyperion has stated many times they are willing to support hardware vendors, who in turn, will also support Hyperions efforts.

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tlosm 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 3-Feb-2018 8:38:25
#19 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Jul-2012
Posts: 2448
From: Amiga land

@pavlor

im sure when sam460 qemu emulation will finally release something will change...
osx leopard run like a 2ghz g4 on my threadripper

Last edited by tlosm on 03-Feb-2018 at 08:39 AM.

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Overflow 
Re: Hyperion OS4 on popular ppc hardware - ps3, imac, power mac, xbox360, etc..
Posted on 3-Feb-2018 9:24:03
#20 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2012
Posts: 1449
From: Norway

Using consoles to operate AOS seems far to hacky. Yes, we can all follow guides on the internet, but thats not the foundation of success for sure.
I got a PS3 and Xbox Gen 1, and cant be bothered to add new harddrives or hacky software addons to make it more useful, even tho there are very good youtube step by step guides on how to do it.

I know AOS3.x is offtopic of sorts, but the ONE thing I think Vampire got going for itself, is its very standardized hardware setup. There arent xx possible hardware addons that needs driver support.
Yes, there are some issues, with for example network cards etc, but compared to the driverneed for AOS4 hardware, its barely worth mentioning.

Its a pity for AOS4 platform, but its the direction they decided upon, so...

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