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      /  SAM440: Who bought one?
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PosterThread
wegster 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 4:35:31
#21 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Nov-2004
Posts: 8554
From: RTP, NC USA

@meet.mrnrg

Feel free to quote actual examples of what you can do on a SAM PPC that I can not do on any of my systems at home or (x86 and SPARC) servers at work. Go ahead, here's your chance to 'prove' it instead of just words.

Feel free to post benchmarks, and I'll gladly do the same..

Nothing against SAM, outside of it's outrageous price for desktop Linux use, which is all it's good for at the moment.


Last edited by wegster on 27-Dec-2007 at 04:36 AM.

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meet.mrnrg 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 4:40:05
#22 ]
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Joined: 5-Feb-2007
Posts: 1919
From: UK, AUS, US

@wegster

For starter executing PPC code natively.
667Mhz of pure efficiency in code cycles and Power Usage.
Not even hearing a whisper from the CPU.
Not even feeling heat coming out of the case.
Loving Powering up the machine.
Knowing my money was well spent on guys that invent rather than bully and gobble.

PS: Cools I like SPARC Architecture and SunOS + Java. hehe.
No one can do Sym Links like you can on Solaris. X86 Linux Compiles are usually faulty.

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wegster 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 4:45:10
#23 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Nov-2004
Posts: 8554
From: RTP, NC USA

@meet.mrnrg

What good is 'executing PPC code' when it doesn't DO anything, as in, produce useful work, that you can't do elsewhere, faster, and cheaper?

Again, please give real world examples.

I'm glad you like your SAM, but let's keep the 'it's better' to actual facts or things that can be backed up.

PPC isn't the top of the food chain with respect to power management any more - various changes by both Intel and AMD have matched power management and power per watt at desktop speed CPUs.

Describe 'x86 Linux Compiles are usually faulty,' especially if you think that is somehow NOT the case for PPC Linux? I can tell you from experience I've had more issues building PPC Linux code than x86, simply because PPC code isn't nearly as well maintained.

Oh, confirmed- still no Flash for PPC Linux:
http://www.adobe.com/products/flashplayer/productinfo/systemreqs/

I don't feel heat coming out of most of my systems, either...?

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meet.mrnrg 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 4:51:48
#24 ]
Super Member
Joined: 5-Feb-2007
Posts: 1919
From: UK, AUS, US

@wegster

Haha,
and they said 9660 was the fastest baud rate one could ever achieve with copper 2.
And you think the power of the SAM 440 has been surpassed by even a more expensive PC.

You can like X86 and Linux on it better.

From my experience those applications and systems even when executing properly fail the basic consumer needs and wants. Also they fail consumer friendliness.

Show me your benchmarks first and then I will show you mine. I'm not looking to win the battles just the trophy.

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wegster 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 4:52:53
#25 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Nov-2004
Posts: 8554
From: RTP, NC USA

@meet.mrnrg
Again, examples of ANYTHING that you can do better?

But, ok, no problem, I'll also provide you with some benchmarks tomorrow, ones that you should be able to run on SAM.

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ikir 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 6:37:12
#26 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 18-Dec-2002
Posts: 5647
From: Italy

@polka.

me

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ppc_addon 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 8:24:38
#27 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 2-Nov-2007
Posts: 101
From: Roma Caput Mundi

@wegster


it's quite clear... Sam440ep is really an expensive piece of hw... but why? All we know that SoC is a kind of technology born to be cheap (AMCC440EP it's not so cheap..) and this SoC based mobo that's not.

Ok, this one is manifactured in Italy... that's a real point but it's expensive 'cause there are a lot of things AMIGA related to be OS4 ready .
Then depends on your point of view.. if you want to see it only like a linux box you can contact the producer and ask him for an amount without AMIGA related stuff and you 'be able to get a best price.

Btw, with a power architecture linux box you can do what you want as you can do with your x86 or almost sparc ones. Your choice depends only by your necessity.

Last edited by ppc_addon on 27-Dec-2007 at 08:25 AM.

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Kronos 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 8:50:36
#28 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 2553
From: Unknown

@ppc_addon

Quote:

ppc_addon wrote:

Ok, this one is manifactured in Italy... that's a real point but it's expensive 'cause there are a lot of things AMIGA related to be OS4 ready .


And what would those be ??

It can't be the OS4-licence, cos it doesn't have one.
It can't be the firmware as it is (or atleast should be) open-source.
There is nothing in the HW that is really special to "Amiga", unless you count the FPGA which isn't really needed for anything Amiga.

My guess is that they have just made the mistake of creating the egglaying woolswine-cow, and that does come at a price.

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PulsatingQuasar 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 9:47:34
#29 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 550
From: The Netherlands, Europe

@meet.mrnrg

Quote:
For starter executing PPC code natively.
667Mhz of pure efficiency in code cycles and Power Usage.
Not even hearing a whisper from the CPU.
Not even feeling heat coming out of the case.
Loving Powering up the machine.
Knowing my money was well spent on guys that invent rather than bully and gobble.


I can use that on the Intel D201GLY2 board and it will be more true.

- For starter executing x86 code natively. All major distros compile for this CPU architecture which makes sure I run the latest and greatest so I don't have to do it.
- 1200Mhz of pure efficiency in code cycles and Power Usage. This Celeron is based on the Conroe which is a very efficient core. It beats the AMD every time.
- Not even hearing a whisper from the CPU. I don't see a fan on this board.
- Not even feeling heat coming out of the case. Even though the board uses a bit more power I hardly think it's noticeable.
- Loving Powering up the machine. Hey who wouldn't, with a motherboard that costs just 70 euro.
- Knowing my money was well spent on guys that invent rather than bully and gobble. Well, this one is a bit so so but Intel invents a lot.

The Intel board can run XVID and DIVX without problems. Even the 720p ones. I'd like to see the SAM do that.

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Amigo1 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 10:18:06
#30 ]
Super Member
Joined: 24-Jun-2004
Posts: 1582
From: the Clouds

@wegster

oh wegster why don't you shut up!
I run 10.000 lines of genuine PPC code on my A1 this morning and I will run 20.000 this evening! With genuine 2 lines per instruction for every clock cycle.
And if I don't want to..I just push the button and turn it off. Can you do that on your sparc? Can you turn off the computer natively on your x86duolcure?

so don't spread any benchmarks of non existing pure-efficency-power-cycle-code...usage. I don't have to use my computer to heat up my room, even if it's expensive an not summer in winter here! And I luv turning it on!

btw. I love sparcs I had a lot of them on my xmas tree and candles too!

uh gosh, I'm goin' &

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Manu 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 10:54:36
#31 ]
Super Member
Joined: 4-Feb-2004
Posts: 1561
From: Unknown

@Amigo1

30 000 lines a day ? Amazing !

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SAY.NO.TO.LIES 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 11:02:44
#32 ]
Member
Joined: 21-Sep-2007
Posts: 59
From: Unknown

@Manu

Quote:
30 000 lines a day ? Amazing !

Perhaps that's the Reduced Instruction Set component of RISC, as in UNBELIEVABLY reduced...

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corto 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 11:15:07
#33 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 24-Apr-2004
Posts: 342
From: Grenoble (France)

Quote:

wegster wrote:
Again, examples of ANYTHING that you can do better?


@wegster : You are asking that because you know that there are no examples to find. We all know that. Even if we can do things that run better on Sam440, you will certainly use the price argument. Or something else.

So, that's true, I have no arguments to answer. PPC architecture is clean, Sam440 seems to be a very well designed board, ACube is a serious company, ... I know that these facts are not considered in the final choice of the buyer.

I am sure that Sam440 is very capable. If OS4 was available for it, I don't see what would be the problems to buy it and enjoy OS4 on it.

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acefnq 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 11:34:25
#34 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 11-Jan-2006
Posts: 617
From: Adelaide, South Australia

@corto

I agree and this is a great example of how pathetic this site can get. Look at the posters on this thread, circling like sharks, same names all the time. Why don't they post something positive? Ever?

Absolutely pathetic and childish. So the bloke likes his new MB and hopes it will run OS4 someday (don't we all), be reminded there is nothing to stop MOS or AROS running on the board also, in fact there are incentives to do so.

Do we always have to have "show me yours and I'll beat it"???????

The one positive here is that no cross-AmigaOS developer has weighed in, think about it.

I wished the these twits would live and let live.

ace

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polka. 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 12:17:26
#35 ]
Super Member
Joined: 13-Oct-2005
Posts: 1820
From: Tortuga

@acefnq

Quote:
I agree and this is a great example of how pathetic this site can get.


Yes, it is very pathetic. People who discuss pros and cons of computer hardware should be banned from this forum.

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Seer 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 12:24:19
#36 ]
Team Member
Joined: 27-Jun-2003
Posts: 3725
From: The Netherlands

@acefnq

You mean like the pointless bash Windows threads that pop up just as often ?

Doesn't matter what OS one is using but trying to "convert" somebody is not done by bashing what he is using.. Besides, most people here are well aware about the pros and cons of OS4/MOS/OSX/Linux vs Windows. However, when claiming something is better without proof be prepared to supply the proof.

Anyway, I have no interest myself for a Linux machine at the moment, be it PPC, X86, X64, or whatever CPU there is, I don't care much for the underlying hardware these days.. And last time I checked the comparison between X86/PPC for powerusage and heat even there the X86 wins nowadays, so what's the use if it's all so close anyway..

Do I have interest in an OS4 machine, sure. But I prefer a new one, not second hand A1s so.

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acefnq 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 12:35:48
#37 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 11-Jan-2006
Posts: 617
From: Adelaide, South Australia

@polka.
Yawn. If you don't like the Amiga scene buy a cheap X86 and join their scene,it's obviously the answer for you and others.

ace

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polka. 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 12:40:07
#38 ]
Super Member
Joined: 13-Oct-2005
Posts: 1820
From: Tortuga

@acefnq

Quote:
If you don't like the Amiga scene


Where did I say that?

Quote:
buy a cheap X86 and join their scene,it's obviously the answer for you and others.


How does that relate to anything I said before?

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ChrisH 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 12:46:49
#39 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2005
Posts: 6679
From: Unknown

@Amigo1 Quote:
And if I don't want to..I just push the button and turn it off. Can you do that on your sparc? Can you turn off the computer natively on your x86duolcure?

Yes, for x86 - it's called AMITHLON. Or AROS if you prefer

Quote:
oh wegster why don't you shut up!

I'm sure that wegster was tempted to say that to meet.mrnrg, but he's too polite - unlike you...

Last edited by ChrisH on 27-Dec-2007 at 12:48 PM.

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ChrisH 
Re: SAM440: Who bought one?
Posted on 27-Dec-2007 12:56:08
#40 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2005
Posts: 6679
From: Unknown

@meet.mrnrg
There's nothing wrong with you liking PPC, AmigaOS, SamEP440 or elegant design in general, but sadly none of those will win on pure cost - or anything much else these days.

Intel/etc have had too much time & money to throw at x86, so it's now "as good as" (or even better than) PPC/etc on almost any metric. Especially now that Intel no-longer (are able to) chase MHZ.

PPC started out ahead (like the Amiga), but it has gradually lost that lead (like the Amiga), and at some point defeat must be admitted. Betamax lost to VHS, even though Betamax was better. Amiga lost to Windows/Mac, even though it was better. "Best" does not win in the commercial market, but rather "cheap to make & works good enough for the majority" does

Last edited by ChrisH on 27-Dec-2007 at 12:58 PM.
Last edited by ChrisH on 27-Dec-2007 at 12:58 PM.

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