@Rogue

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Rogue wrote: @Oxygenet Quote: would be a shame to see OS4 never be released because of no hardware Come on, do you really think we're working five years on this thing and just stand by doing nothing? OS 4 will come out, even if I have to solder the hardware together myself.

Time to start soldering

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@umisef

How dare you to put proofs on the table? Dancing banana's squad will be sent ASAP to finish you.

When I've read your text, song from Tom Waits poped up in my brain. It won't be actuall quote.

Quote:

In the land of blind, one-eye'd is the king

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@Hondo_DK

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Hondo_DK wrote: @Seehund Why don't you continue your negative comments somewhere else.

Not your site, Hondo. It is not up to you who posts here.

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People like you don't bring anything constructive, only dark clouds and miserable attitudes. Why don't you go and start your own forum, and call it

A differing opinion is NOT discouraged here, what is discouraged is any circumvention of the ToS. Please keep that in mind as you have already trespassed the condition of "Flaming Other Users" as stated in the T&P.

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@Rogue

I'm willing to help with the soldering

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Amon's digital home

@Hondo_DK

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Hondo_DK wrote: @Seehund Why don't you continue your negative comments somewhere else. Amigaworld is a positive place you know! ...

All my respect for your enthusiasm - but I really would prefer it to be neither exclusively negative, nor exclusively positive.
"Realistic" would be the best choice, IMHO...

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Ciao

Dandy
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If someone enjoys marching to military music, then I already despise him.
He got his brain accidently - the bone marrow in his back would have been sufficient for him!
(Albert Einstein)

@Legion

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Legion wrote: @Rudei I agree, but it's not the opinion insofar as it is wrong or overly dismal. It's the placement and presentation of said opinions that irritates. If we were discussing AmigaOS on x86, then his opinion on such would be more than welcome. However, his opinion in a light-hearted hardware speculation thread (such as this one) of doom-n-gloom, insinuating that Amy2005 is a dream and we're foolish to think otherwise is really just a thorn in the side. He's clearly an intelligent guy, no one disputes that. I think he just views us all as apologists and hazed-over fanboys who can't see the situation clearly, and that isn't so. We DO see the situation clearly. 1). AmigaOS4 is PPC. 2). We await PPC hardware to run it on 3). For now, THAT'S JUST THE WAY IT IS. These things have already been set in motion, and we have no control over them. It's already been done. Whether it was a mistake or not history will surely decide, but his opinion about x86 at this stage of the game, particularly in this thread, is really just pointless irritant. Place it where appropriate, that's all I'm saying.

Er... Speaking about placing things where appropriate. What are you talking about? "He" hasn't said a single word about x86 in this thread. :)

Since you brought it up, I don't think the choice of CPU per se matters much under the current conditions. If the "Amiga hardware" licensing and bundling requirement stays in place, then AmigaOS4 would still be practically dead even with an x86 port, it would just be dead on a possibly better CPU than now.

No, I don't view "you all" as apologists or hazed-over fanboys. Granted, there's a scary amount of people from those categories on this site, but that's the deliberate and unfortunate result of how AW.net was managed in the past. Maybe some people aren't used to the new glasnost and perestroika yet, where "unconstructive" opinions no longer are punished with "the supreme measure of social defense"? ;)

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Oh, bother.

[Deleted as I haven't been following this at all, and really can't be bothered to check things enough to make an intelligent comment.]

Last edited by ChrisH on 30-Mar-2006 at 01:22 PM.
Last edited by ChrisH on 30-Mar-2006 at 01:22 PM.

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Author of the PortablE programming language.
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue...

@ChrisH

Quote:

ChrisH wrote: [Deleted as I haven't been following this at all, and really can't be bothered to check things enough to make an intelligent comment.]

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Dark Lord Design Wicked Solutions For Damned Problems

@TrebleSix
If only some people would learn to do the same

BTW, does anyone know how recent these pics are:
http://troikang.com/images/layout1.png
http://troikang.com/images/Layout2.jpg
Do they come after the "DPaint" design? Are they even of the same design?

My main concern is that the "placement" of the capacitors in those two pics is far worse (if not actually stupid) compared to the DPaint design.

Oh, and Troika now seem to be referring to the DPaint design as an "Early Provisional Troika drawing of Amy'05". Are they rewriting history, given the criticisms levelled at that design? www.archive.org is of no help.

Last edited by ChrisH on 30-Mar-2006 at 01:39 PM.
Last edited by ChrisH on 30-Mar-2006 at 01:35 PM.
Last edited by ChrisH on 30-Mar-2006 at 01:33 PM.

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Author of the PortablE programming language.
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue...

@ChrisH

Quote:

BTW, does anyone know how recent these pics are: Do they come after the "DPaint" design? Are they even of the same design?

Maybe they are even older.

Ian Stedman in 2001:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Amiga-Hacks/message/1508

"My work, as part of a team is to define a PowerPC based computer system that will be capable of running QNX RTP, Linux and MorphOS."
"There will be a working concept prototype based around an X86 processor ready around March."

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This signature is in the middle of a much needed facelift!

@umisef who said Quote:

There is also a conveniently fuzzy closeup of what is supposed to be a SIL680. Why so fuzzy? And while it *is* horribly hard due to the fuzzyness, each time I count pins on the right edge of that chip, I count 40. But a SIL680 has 36 pins on each side...

Image enhancement helps a lot here: I enhanced the contrast, then sharpened it, then applied embossing (but kept the unembossed one for reference), and then doubled it in size - and counted 36! You have to beware that you don't count an extra pin at either end, due to the embossing.

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Author of the PortablE programming language.
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue...

@Legion

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For instance, take a peak at this piece of crap. How many caps do you see?

I see 8 large caps right next to the voltage regulators, together with 3 or 4 largish inductors (the fourth one might not be part of the switchmode VRMs, but rather be there to filter high frequency noise before it escapes to the ATX supply --- who knows, without a circuit diagram).

I also notice 18 further electrolytic caps sprinkled across the motherboard, most likely providing some local buffering.

Looking at the Gigabyte Socket A board that I recently retired (and which is sitting next to me on the desk), I find a similar number of big caps (8 and 25, respectively), plus what appears to be literally hundreds of tiny SMD caps next to all the chips (they are called "BCxxx", with xxx being consecutive numbers, and are either 0805 or 0603 form factor. I have found BC262 :)

II further notice that the voltage regulators on the "piece of crap" are located right next to both the ATX connector and the CPU, and are in fact between the two --- which is the right and obvious spot to put them once you consider the copper needed.

@Amon_Re

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Amon_Re wrote: @Rogue I'm willing to help with the soldering

Yes, but will you wear the nurses outfit too?

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Are we not done with the same silly arguments and flames yet??!

@wegster

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Yes, but will you wear the nurses outfit too?

soldering and that nurses outfit? More like help Im melting.

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"The system no longer works " -- Young Anakin Skywalker

@OldFart

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OldFart wrote: @mbilla And, according to my physical perception, even spring was late this year! OldFart

The groundhog was claimed to have said "Two more weeks" due to some technical glitch with his shadow.

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"If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you." - Oscar Wilde

@umisef

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Meanwhile, you have others who look at the Troika website and say "you WHAT?". Yes, there is a photo of three chips that are at least the right case to be a Tsi107. But Tundra's own photos of the Tsi107 (one of which was used on the "Specification" page of Troika's website) clearly show a label printed on the chip, yet those in the photo are blank.

Tundra doesn't silkscreen all the Tsi-107's in gold. Your confusing web pics to sell a product and actual parts.

The Troika site has been getting weekly picture updates. Think the next set will confuse you even more, sigh

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"The system no longer works " -- Young Anakin Skywalker

@Interesting

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The Troika site has been getting weekly picture updates. Think the next set will confuse you even more, sigh

The next batch of Tsi107 shipment will have the components on the underside of the chip?
I don't have a problem with missing labels, really. I *do* have a big problem with missing components.

@AMiGR

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Yes, only it was of a different board, the Escena AmigaOne.

In my example and for the point I'm trying to make, that is completely irrelevant. A publication such as an image of a design of a motherboard is by no means a status report and tells us exactly nothing about how far the developers of the board has come in the process of making the board available to end-users.

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Sammy Nordström, A.K.A. "Samface"

MINDRELEASE.net - The Non-Commercial Network of Digital Arts.

Samworks D & C - Professional Web Development (in Swedish)

@samface

Well, the Escena AmigaOne had a much more complete PCB, with pretty much everything routed, yet it never materialised.
The point is: *IF* that screenshot shows a recent version of the latest design, goodbye.

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Hi,

The screenshot on the website was not the final design.

At that time I had placed all the major components and was starting to juggle them, to see how many would fit on the top side and group them by functional blocks. Offscreen were about 300 discretes of which half were decoupling capacitors, 0402 or 0603 size to reduce the ESL and bulk decoupling in the form of electrolytics. I have successfully designed switchmode power converters and PWM motor controllers so I am well versed in power supply considerations.

The PCB has 8 layers, 3 dedicated planes, +5V, +3V3 & GND. There are mini planes used as required on other layers for lower voltages e.g. CPU core, TSI 107 and analogue parts. The PCB is impedance controlled, nominally using 60 ohm traces and signal integrity work has been done, which is time consuming.

Must go.

Ian