@Helge

Quote:

Helge wrote: It would always have been better if Amiga Inc only gave all the Amiga rights to Hyperion Entertainment, and i'm pretty much sure that Hyperion has the source codes to port AmigaOS4 to x86, which should happen ways ago.

No way Hyperion would do that.

_________________
AmigaOS or MorphOS on x86 would sell orders of magnitude more than the current,
hardware-intensive solutions. And they'd go faster.-- D.Haynie

@Helge

Sorry, but I disagree. I say throw Hyperion out. I think they signed a totaly stupid contract, had a vendetta against MOS from the start, delayed OS4 in an attempt to gain the os through the insolvency clause, put eyetech out with all the delaying, got paid for the buyback and refused to turn anything over, changed the dates of release of OS4 but have as yet paid the developers, worked with KMOS as the successors but now say they were duped, ect.... Are they any worse than AInc? No but no better and it looks to me that AOS4 belongs to AInc. What AInc wants to do with their ip is upto them. I may not like the direction they are going to take but it is still their ip.

OK now back to the one sided AInc bashing and singing the praises of Hyperion.

@stew

Quote:

stew wrote: @Helge Sorry, but I disagree. I say throw Hyperion out. I think they signed a totaly stupid contract, had a vendetta against MOS from the start, delayed OS4 in an attempt to gain the os through the insolvency clause, put eyetech out with all the delaying, got paid for the buyback and refused to turn anything over, changed the dates of release of OS4 but have as yet paid the developers, worked with KMOS as the successors but now say they were duped, ect.... Are they any worse than AInc? No but no better and it looks to me that AOS4 belongs to AInc. What AInc wants to do with their ip is upto them. I may not like the direction they are going to take but it is still their ip. OK now back to the one sided AInc bashing and singing the praises of Hyperion.

Is it Amiga Delaware's ip rightfully? Or is it the property truly of the defunct Amiga Washington and hence owed to people like Bolton Peck as compensation for unpaid debts?

Last edited by fairlanefastback on 26-Jul-2007 at 08:58 PM.
Last edited by fairlanefastback on 26-Jul-2007 at 08:58 PM.

_________________
Pegasos2 G3 running AOS 4.1 and MorphOS 2.0
Amikit user, tinkering with Icaros VM (AROS)
EFIKA owner
Amiga 1200

@Manu

You don't know that. I'm pretty much sure they will if given the rights to do that..

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Helge K. Leaving the Amiga in favour of a PC..

@Helge

Quote:

Hyperion Entertainment Group. They even have resources to port AmigaOS4 to x86, only if they are given the rights to do that...

Seems to me Hyperion had marketing reasons to avoid x86 platform. Fears that this would lead to users dual-booting Windows to run software not yet available for AmigaOS, and in time booting in to AmigaOS less and less often until they are completely Windows users. Also that since you can dual-boot Windows and run software current there, you'd buy games and apps for Windows, and when some potential AmigaOS-native port becomes available you've already got it in Windows, don't want to pay for it again, and may already have become bored with it long ago on Windows and just don't want it anymore. Stuff like that which Amithlon was mentioned as the official path to x86 long ago by McEwen which would have been in parallel to Hyperion on PowerPC. Pity how everything ends up in ruins... But I though Hyperion were resistant to the x86 porting idea... You may need to convince them to do that as much as you need to convince Amiga Inc. to allow it.

Quote:

t no longer matters what CPU AmigaOS4 is running at, because it's the AmigaOS that makes the Amiga special, not the hardware itself..

Indeed. I've not supported "special hardware" for a very long time. Even when we still had some people going on about the need for "custom chips" in order to differentiate ourselves from store-shelf PCs, I was against that. For so long as those who can continue to decide on Power-PC only, that's what we're stuck with, but we should endeavor to use standard PCI, PCI-Express, USB, IDE or SATA, etc. If x86 is allowed by those who can choose such things, we should welcome it. I grew tired of the "Amiga tax" long ago when I paid $500 for my PicassoIV, the equivalent of which for PCI motherboards with the same gfx chip cost $50 or less. Now at least everything not soldered to the motherboard is of popular standards and thus relatively cheap, which is a great imrpovement. I'm willin gto deal with expensive motherboards, but only if one can actually buy them, which we of course cannot.

Last edited by billt on 26-Jul-2007 at 09:43 PM.

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All glory to the Hypnotoad!

@All

I found this interesting information Hyperion Entertainment put on their homepage when the trial case started...Check it out here...

"Whilst it is not Hyperion Entertainment’s policy to comment on ongoing litigation, we would like to reassure our customers (whom we wish to thank for their very numerous notes of support following the news) that development of AmigaOS 4.0 related components is still ongoing and will continue apace during the duration of the litigation with Amiga Inc.

Following over 18 months of unproductive negotiations with Amiga Inc. through our management and attorneys, we welcome the opportunity to finally present our case in a court of law which was regrettably the only remaining avenue after Amiga Inc. repeatedly and consistently stonewalled any attempt to resolve the outstanding issues (including the “Party Pack” and “I am Amiga Club” voucher schemes and the failure to acknowledge the intellectual property rights of third party developers) through mediation and binding arbitration.

Despite the failure of Amiga Inc. to secure access to the Amiga OS 3.5 and 3.9 source-code and indeed the reworked Amiga 3.1 source-code, Hyperion Entertainment has, in the form of Amiga OS 4.0, delivered a product which meets and surpasses all contractual design and development goals (e.g. full Amiga chipset independence), a fact which was previously acknowledged contractually and publicly by Amiga Inc. Under the 2001 agreement with Amiga Inc. Hyperion is entitled to all revenues stemming from distribution of Amiga OS 4.0 irrespective of the execution of the “buy in” clause which relates solely to subsequent versions (Amiga OS 4.1 and beyond).

We will therefore vigorously defend the claim which we consider entirely devoid of substance and we are extremely confident of a favorable outcome.

In closing, we would like to remind dealers and other third parties that distribution of Amiga OS 4.0 without the prior permission of Hyperion VOF and certain third party developers is illegal under EU, US and international copyright legislation and therefore entirely at their own risk."

_________________
Helge K. Leaving the Amiga in favour of a PC..

@Moxee

Quote:

Moxee wrote: @BigBentheAussie Quote: it would be great if we could somehow rally the community to buy the company FOR the community. Investing in a new Amiga Inc company could allow you to use the name for certain purposes agreed to or voted by the community who have invested, provided they forward the Amiga platform. There would be an explosion of products and exposure. Investment should be limited to individuals and not companies, to ensure the Amiga never falls into such a quagmire again. Wouldn't that be great? The stuff of dreams.

you only need to read this thread for a sampling of the 'amiga community', and realise that putting the community in charge is even worse than now.

worst. idea. ever! as comic book guy would say.

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@fairlanefastback

Quote:

fairlanefastback wrote: @stew Is it Amiga Delaware's ip rightfully? Or is it the property truly of the defunct Amiga Washington and hence owed to people like Bolton Peck as compensation for unpaid debts?

Now I agree with that totally. AInc treated Tronman very badly and needs to pay a heavy price. I lump the business ethics of Ainc and Hyperion together. There is a saying that seems atp: "There is no honor amoung thieves". As it was put, "Don't turn your back", could go for either one.

"Besides, if you paid 5 million dollars for something, would you accept other people running off with your IP without putting up a fight?" Ben Hermans

@Manu

I distinctly remember in one thread one of the Freiden-fighters specifically mentioning they would like to port OS 4 to x86 at some point, but it wouldn't happen with the current licensing they had from A-Inc.

It is my impression that Hyperion would like to port OS 4 as far and wide as feasible/reasonable (i.e. to Pegasos, Efika, Sam440, X86, etc...) if it makes sense for the business, i.e. there is a payback.

Why not leverage all their hard work? It only makes sense for the business and we would all benefit in the long run.

Last edited by gregthecanuck on 26-Jul-2007 at 11:08 PM.

@Helge

I am relatively new to the Amiga community, but I have to say that the latest state of things can really only be blamed on poor management at Amiga Inc. It's been a sad story that has unfolded over the last several years. I get the feeling that the legal log-jam going on right now is stunting Genesi and its Morh OS release. I want to run either OS4 or Morph OS on an Efika or Samantha (Acube's product), and there are just a bunch of barriers in the way right now. I can understand ACK's (ie. Adam's) frustrations concerning the licensing of OS4.

I say who cares about A Inc.......let Hyperion and Acube and maybe ACK carry the AOS banner. A Inc. does not deserve a penny of the potential revenue from OS4.....they will be hard-pressed to get my hard-earned cash - that's for sure.

Heck, if Hyperion can start licensing OS 4, my mobile computing company might even consider running it on our platform........ We work with image engines, Wifi, Bluetooth, GSM, GPS, and CDMA. We have the capability to write radio drivers for OS4.

.....And this 'Amiga Center' at the city of Kent??? What were the Kent officials thinking? LOL...

Last edited by VT2005EE on 27-Jul-2007 at 02:18 AM.

A company takes money, delivers nothing and claims a valid contract doesn't exist. Not likely to succeed in court.

Companies change owners all the time. Relying on a poor transfer of ownership to obtain IP is unlikely to get the support of a court.

It's unlikely the courts will see things Hyperions way.


"they signed a totaly stupid contract, had a vendetta against MOS from the start, delayed OS4 in an attempt to gain the os through the insolvency clause, put eyetech out with all the delaying, got paid for the buyback and refused to turn anything over, changed the dates of release of OS4 but have as yet paid the developers, worked with KMOS as the successors but now say they were duped, etc...".
@stew

Absolutely!!![

@Slick

Quote:

Slick wrote: A company takes money, delivers nothing and claims a valid contract doesn't exist. Not likely to succeed in court. Companies change owners all the time. Relying on a poor transfer of ownership to obtain IP is unlikely to get the support of a court. It's unlikely the courts will see things Hyperions way. "they signed a totaly stupid contract, had a vendetta against MOS from the start, delayed OS4 in an attempt to gain the os through the insolvency clause, put eyetech out with all the delaying, got paid for the buyback and refused to turn anything over, changed the dates of release of OS4 but have as yet paid the developers, worked with KMOS as the successors but now say they were duped, etc...". @stew Absolutely!!![

What does this have to do with a community movement to shun Amiga, Inc because they shun us?

_________________
Pegasos2 G3 running AOS 4.1 and MorphOS 2.0
Amikit user, tinkering with Icaros VM (AROS)
EFIKA owner
Amiga 1200

@Slick

Quote:

A company takes money, delivers nothing

That is a very good description of Amiga Inc. Exactly the reason they need throwing out.


Bill.

@BillE

Right, this is unfortunately the truth, and the reason why they have to be thrown out..

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Helge K. Leaving the Amiga in favour of a PC..

@Helge

Quote:

Helge wrote: @Tomas I guess that would be a good place to start...

Did you contact Pentti and Prokom yet?

_________________
Pegasos2 G3 running AOS 4.1 and MorphOS 2.0
Amikit user, tinkering with Icaros VM (AROS)
EFIKA owner
Amiga 1200

@Helge
Quote:

"We will therefore vigorously defend the claim which we consider entirely devoid of substance"

This part still cracks me up every time I read it! I can't believe they haven't fixed it on their site yet.

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Here for the whimpering end

@BillE

Quote:

I find the "Num of complaints: 0" rather difficult to believe

Well that is in relation to reports against posts, so a zero post count means you cant have an AR lodged against you

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Test sig (new)

@gregthecanuck

But OS4 is made by several people and I don't think even 50 % of them
consider x86 a good alternative. Maybe some are into x86 I think
most of them could not care less about x86.

PS.
OS4 on x86 is merely a dream. Not that I care I have -BEEP- Advertisment Removed -
installed on my laptop already and it's getting better and better each day.

_________________
AmigaOS or MorphOS on x86 would sell orders of magnitude more than the current,
hardware-intensive solutions. And they'd go faster.-- D.Haynie

@billt
Quote:

Seems to me Hyperion had marketing reasons to avoid x86 platform. Fears that this would lead to users dual-booting Windows to run software not yet available for AmigaOS, and in time booting in to AmigaOS less and less often until they are completely Windows users.

Given that OS4 users have the option of using Windows (or Linux, or OS X, or etc.) anyway, this concept doesn't hold water. If they wanted to run Windows, they would just be doing that now. Or is the idea that OS4 is so bad that users have to be forced into using it alone?

Quote:

Also that since you can dual-boot Windows and run software current there, you'd buy games and apps for Windows, and when some potential AmigaOS-native port becomes available you've already got it in Windows, don't want to pay for it again, and may already have become bored with it long ago on Windows and just don't want it anymore.

Funny you should mention games, as Hyperion hasn't released any games for OS4.

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Here for the whimpering end

If you want to "throw the scammers out" you have exactly 2 options:

- AROS
- UAE + "googled" Kick&WB

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- We don't need good ideas, we haven't run out on bad ones yet
- blame Canada