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   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:22:05
#621 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@SHADES

Quote:
The debate is discussed so MAYBE peoples minds are opend up to discuss and debate possible long-term solutiuons thet may or may not have been benched and re-open them because they hold some real merrit to CONTINUING the AMIGA OS in development and with a future, HOBBY OS or not.


Is anyone standing up and saying "x86, bad idea, we hate x86!". The short answer is no. No one has said its not the best long term solution. The question is, is Hyperion willing or able to make it a project at this time. Currently indications are "no". God forbid anyone enjoy and applaud any PPC version advances in the meantime??

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TheDaddy 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:23:53
#622 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@SHADES

>>great you can afford it

Let's get this straight...I could afford it because I worked for it!

Because I REALLY wanted a SAM+OS4.1.

I missed the boat with the A1 and OS4 and I thought I am not going to let this happen again.

The userbase for OS4.1 has actually increased.

And as I said before this discussion makes no sense at all until someone comes along with the cash and time to do it until then it's all a big dream.

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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:26:50
#623 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@eXec

Quote:

eXec wrote:
@Hypex


I was happy too, but...it was ages ago! Based upon your theory we all should be happy
with the current status for the next 10 years , or what?
So we are happy that we got the current 600+ overpriced PPC boards, and that is it.
No need in further development? What a infinite stupidity !



So what are you going to do, are you going to force Hyperion to do your bidding?

The short answer is, no you are not. You want x86 AOS, we all have gotten that loud and clear. I'd like that too. But whats your gameplan to make it happen, besides repeating yourself ad nauseam?

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TheDaddy 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:28:36
#624 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@fairlanefastback

>>But whats your gameplan to make it happen, besides repeating yourself ad nauseam?

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Interesting 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:34:18
#625 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 1812
From: a place & time long long ago, when things mattered.

@eXec

Quote:
WHO is the owner of the Amiga OS??


duh Judge

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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:34:28
#626 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@SHADES

Quote:
- That's just it. Where are the truk loads of money going to come from for the future of this OS that people already are struggling to justify and afford. Your money debate is much more of a concern when you look at continuing to try and develop "custom" and I use the term loosly as it is just x86 desinged H/W slapped to low usage non x86 codebase, in a modern enviroment that has endless designs of working and industry tested platforms to contend with. We also have the timeframes it will incurr to get that H/W manufactured. I repeat. How long was the current official upgrade to the AMIGA OS envirmoment delayed to be sold due to no H/W base being avaiable? Is that good for sales?


It takes money to make money. You guys pool your money and loan it to Hyperion interest free (or at a very low interest) and they may have enough money to do your port. The money spent to make all these PPC variants, its already spent, its GONE. We are where we are. They may have enough money to do the lesser work to port to other PPC platforms, but they don't seem to have the resources for the x86 port. Give them a loan if you want it so bad. If you don't want it so bad just be satisfied you beat the idea of x86 so hard into them that they will never forget you.

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SHADES 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:38:16
#627 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Nov-2003
Posts: 631
From: Melbourne

@fairlanefastback

Quote:

fairlanefastback wrote:
@SHADES

Quote:
The debate is discussed so MAYBE peoples minds are opend up to discuss and debate possible long-term solutiuons thet may or may not have been benched and re-open them because they hold some real merrit to CONTINUING the AMIGA OS in development and with a future, HOBBY OS or not.


Is anyone standing up and saying "x86, bad idea, we hate x86!". The short answer is no. No one has said its not the best long term solution. The question is, is Hyperion willing or able to make it a project at this time. Currently indications are "no". God forbid anyone enjoy and applaud any PPC version advances in the meantime??


Not at all. I am not slandering progress PPC or otherwise. What I am saying is it's not feesable for it to continue this way.

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SHADES 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:39:56
#628 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Nov-2003
Posts: 631
From: Melbourne

@TheDaddy

Quote:

TheDaddy wrote:
@SHADES

>>great you can afford it

Let's get this straight...I could afford it because I worked for it!

Because I REALLY wanted a SAM+OS4.1.

I missed the boat with the A1 and OS4 and I thought I am not going to let this happen again.

The userbase for OS4.1 has actually increased.

And as I said before this discussion makes no sense at all until someone comes along with the cash and time to do it until then it's all a big dream.


According to the "Total User base" uptake, you are quite mistaken. I am one such user. Have you again not read the countless others comments also with the same issue?
That is LESS theDaddy. not MORE. lol

Last edited by SHADES on 26-Mar-2009 at 02:40 PM.

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SHADES 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:44:09
#629 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Nov-2003
Posts: 631
From: Melbourne

@fairlanefastback

Quote:

fairlanefastback wrote:
@SHADES

Quote:
- That's just it. Where are the truk loads of money going to come from for the future of this OS that people already are struggling to justify and afford. Your money debate is much more of a concern when you look at continuing to try and develop "custom" and I use the term loosly as it is just x86 desinged H/W slapped to low usage non x86 codebase, in a modern enviroment that has endless designs of working and industry tested platforms to contend with. We also have the timeframes it will incurr to get that H/W manufactured. I repeat. How long was the current official upgrade to the AMIGA OS envirmoment delayed to be sold due to no H/W base being avaiable? Is that good for sales?


It takes money to make money. You guys pool your money and loan it to Hyperion interest free (or at a very low interest) and they may have enough money to do your port. The money spent to make all these PPC variants, its already spent, its GONE. We are where we are. They may have enough money to do the lesser work to port to other PPC platforms, but they don't seem to have the resources for the x86 port. Give them a loan if you want it so bad. If you don't want it so bad just be satisfied you beat the idea of x86 so hard into them that they will never forget you.


As I have stated before, maybe hyperion can't do that (tied leagaly to A inc with a disgust to x86 for whatever reason) or something. But just maybe these discussions will rattle a few cages to those who do have the power to change the circumstance and see what people are saying isn't nonsense or against them.

Some blo**dy communication from them acknowledging this would be nice however, even if it's in siclence, at least they merrit the invitaion to look at it because things are getting worse and people are not willing to invest or just can't in the current climate.

Last edited by SHADES on 26-Mar-2009 at 02:46 PM.
Last edited by SHADES on 26-Mar-2009 at 02:45 PM.

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TheDaddy 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:46:20
#630 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@SHADES

>>According to the "Total User base" uptake, you are quite mistaken

Whatever...as I am one of the new OS4.1 users that makes +1

If you want AOS on x86 download AROS or pay and wait to have OS4 ported.

Last edited by TheDaddy on 26-Mar-2009 at 02:50 PM.
Last edited by TheDaddy on 26-Mar-2009 at 02:47 PM.

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TheDaddy 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:49:21
#631 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@SHADES

>>things are getting worse and people are not willing to invest

Are they? They seem the same to me as for the last 10 years, actually better...

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SHADES 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:50:17
#632 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Nov-2003
Posts: 631
From: Melbourne

@TheDaddy

Quote:

TheDaddy wrote:
@SHADES

>>According to the "Total User base" uptake, you are quite mistaken

Whatever...as I am one of the new OS4.1 users that makes +1

If you want AOS on x86 download AROS or pay and wait to have it ported.


As constructive a post as ever in this thread.

I can't even afford the current platform, let alone pay for a port all by myself.
See my replies to fairlane about rattleing a few cages with the people that have the ability to do something and stop being so down on someone trying to make a difference in a positive way. I don't tell you to go way being a current owner. Your 1 of the current small userbase. Not one extra.

Last edited by SHADES on 26-Mar-2009 at 02:51 PM.

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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:50:47
#633 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@SHADES

Quote:

SHADES wrote:
@fairlanefastback

[quote]
fairlanefastback wrote:
@SHADES

There is no confusion fairlane, the two are completely entwined.

There is no other way to run AOS4.x other than buy that H/w base which is too expensive etc etc etc.

The H/W stops the uptake/purchase of the OS for users to run it. See?
So that means hyperions Dev costs have to go up to cover that loss for any future revision as sales are down and then the cycle repeats. Price goes up, a few more leave.......etc etc etc....


It obviously costs much much less to take your AmigaOne version of OS 4.1 and suit it for SAM if you are Hyperion, than it does to suit it to run on a Dell desktop.

Should they suspend all operations and do bake sales instead, save their pennies, and then in 10 years spend the money they saved to *start* a x86 port?

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TheDaddy 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:51:45
#634 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@SHADES

Here is an advice:

If you really want OS4.1 and it looks like you REALLY, REALLY want it, sell your quad pc and buy a SAM+OS4.1

That is what I did...

see the difference?

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SHADES 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:54:31
#635 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Nov-2003
Posts: 631
From: Melbourne

@fairlanefastback

Quote:

fairlanefastback wrote:
@SHADES

Quote:

SHADES wrote:
@fairlanefastback

[quote]
fairlanefastback wrote:
@SHADES

There is no confusion fairlane, the two are completely entwined.

There is no other way to run AOS4.x other than buy that H/w base which is too expensive etc etc etc.

The H/W stops the uptake/purchase of the OS for users to run it. See?
So that means hyperions Dev costs have to go up to cover that loss for any future revision as sales are down and then the cycle repeats. Price goes up, a few more leave.......etc etc etc....


It obviously costs much much less to take your AmigaOne version of OS 4.1 and suit it for SAM if you are Hyperion, than it does to suit it to run on a Dell desktop.

Should they suspend all operations and do bake sales instead, save their pennies, and then in 10 years spend the money they saved to *start* a x86 port?


I agree that it will cost more intitally but look at the alternative that keeps upping the price with less guarantee of a future, relies on someone to step up and make H/W before you can even sell it and it suddenly makes marketing/financial sense to at least entertain the idea of a change now before it gets harder and more complicated, more code, more time etc...

Last edited by SHADES on 26-Mar-2009 at 02:55 PM.

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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:57:51
#636 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@SHADES

Quote:

SHADES wrote:
@fairlanefastback

Not at all. I am not slandering progress PPC or otherwise. What I am saying is it's not feesable for it to continue this way.


Hyperion will be the judge of that (at least currently). Its their product (at least currently). If they want to release OS 4.1 for PPC Mac Mini they will. You may think that destroys the long term future. So far they don't seem to agree with you. But they will never forget your very vocal protracted protests I am quite sure. You've said your peace to them correct? You've done your best to save the OS from oblivion in your view. I can respect that. Maybe even they do. Perhaps you have subtlety altered their view already, maybe you have radically altered even. Time will tell. In the meantime though there is little point to go more in circles I think.

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TheDaddy 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:58:50
#637 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@SHADES

>>See my replies to fairlane about rattleing a few cages with the people that have the ability to do something and stop being so down on someone trying to make a difference in a positive way. I don't tell you to go way being a current owner. Your 1 of the current small userbase. Not one extra.


"Someone trying to make a difference in a positive way?" Are you taking the p!ss?

The only thing you are doing with your posts is making the SAM+OS4.1 users feel depressed! Making ACube and Hyperion feel depressed (or maybe they are just laughing their t1ts off by reading your posts).

And what actually are you doing that is so great? Organise a laughable bounty for something that won't happen?

Talking about being optimistic.

And as I bought my SAM+OS4.1 a few months ago then this has made the OS4.1 userbase bigger by one.



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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:59:51
#638 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@SHADES

Quote:
See my replies to fairlane about rattleing a few cages with the people that have the ability to do something and stop being so down on someone trying to make a difference in a positive way.


You are assuming that Hyperion has the ability to go x86 at this time. What if they simply don't? Then what? Do they even have to grace you with an answer?

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SHADES 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 14:59:57
#639 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Nov-2003
Posts: 631
From: Melbourne

@TheDaddy

Quote:

TheDaddy wrote:
@SHADES

Here is an advice:

If you really want OS4.1 and it looks like you REALLY, REALLY want it, sell your quad pc and buy a SAM+OS4.1

That is what I did...

see the difference?



omg

Ok, i'll entertain you if you honestly do actually want a reply that is casue I think u are taking the #### outa me now.

I got it for $500, remember?. What do you think i would make selling it on the market 2nd hand? that may buy a custom chip on the SAM board but leave me with no computer at all.

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fairlanefastback 
Re: ...My dear Hyperion, is now the time to go to --> x86 ???
Posted on 26-Mar-2009 15:01:31
#640 ]
Team Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Posts: 4874
From: New York, USA

@SHADES

Quote:
I agree that it will cost more intitally but look at the alternative that keeps upping the price with less guarantee of a future, relies on someone to step up and make H/W before you can even sell it and it suddenly makes marketing/financial sense to at least entertain the idea of a change now before it gets harder and more complicated, more code, more time etc...


Fine, who is going to pay the more intial cost? Thats the central core question. And the secondary one is, will the community wait for the time it would take to make x86 happen, assuming you could solve the money issue.

My belief is the money is not there for the port and that the community would not wait. I hope I am wrong on both counts and that you are right. Meaning I hope you are right that simply convincing Hyperion to make x86 will make them do it, and do it quick, and not at too much expense in lost updates for current PPC users. But do you really, really believe all that is possible?

Last edited by fairlanefastback on 26-Mar-2009 at 03:05 PM.
Last edited by fairlanefastback on 26-Mar-2009 at 03:04 PM.

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