@ne_one

Quote:

ne_one wrote: @rigo Quote: The fact that you have been proven publicly wrong is quite pleasing. That, and the fact it is as far from a "port" as you can get, most of it has been rewritten in part or in whole since then, and even some of the source code was never supplied at all. No, he has a valid point -- you're nitpicking over the degree of the issue.

There is no "degree" of porting. Either it took 7 years to port the OS, or it didn't. The truth is that it didn't. Development over the last seven years has been mostly enhancements not porting, so the point is not valid; not even close.

Hans

_________________
Join the Kea Campus - upgrade your skills; support my work; enjoy the Amiga corner.
https://keasigmadelta.com/ - see more of my work

@amitv

Quote:

amitv wrote: @Rogue Os4.1 yes

No, AmigaOS4.1 for AmigaOne was never beta,
AmigaOS4.1 for Sam440 was beta.
and maybe for PegII.

The last quick fixes should have removed the beta label.

_________________
http://lifeofliveforit.blogspot.no/
Facebook::LiveForIt Software for AmigaOS

@Rogue

Quote:

Quote: Isn't OS4 still in Beta?

Thanks Rogue. When did it leave Beta?

_________________
Dammy

>So Hyperion took 5 (not 7) years to *rewrite* AmigaOS, which equals X years to port it + Y years to improve the functionality. Probably about half of those 5 years was the porting time, and the rest was bringing ancient OS3 up to more modern standards.

Bringing OS3 to modern standard means adding memory protection. It means losing compatibility. You may add APIs ready for that, like Apple did with carbon. OS4 team didn't. So any current application will have to be rewritten. That's not what I call modern standards.

I bought OS4, guess I have the right to tell what I think... even though it's not positive. I don't think dancing bananas will drive the OS forward... Critics may but you have to accept it...

Last edited by Leo on 24-Aug-2009 at 01:34 AM.

_________________
http://www.warpdesign.fr/

@Leo

Quote:

Leo wrote: >So Hyperion took 5 (not 7) years to *rewrite* AmigaOS, which equals X years to port it + Y years to improve the functionality. Probably about half of those 5 years was the porting time, and the rest was bringing ancient OS3 up to more modern standards. Bringing OS3 to modern standard means adding memory protection. It means losing compatibility. You may add APIs ready for that, like Apple did with carbon. OS4 team didn't. So any current application will have to be rewritten. That's not what I call modern standards. I bought OS4, guess I have the right to tell what I think... even though it's not positive. I don't think dancing bananas will drive the OS forward... Critics may but you have to accept it...

The problem is that your opinions are so pessimistic that it's hard to take them seriously. In this case you're just searching for a reason to be negative. Rigo stated that the OS4 devs have spent years bringing Amiga OS up to more "modern standards," not that they were done with that task. Can you honestly deny that Amiga OS 4 is more modern than Amiga OS 3?

Hans

_________________
Join the Kea Campus - upgrade your skills; support my work; enjoy the Amiga corner.
https://keasigmadelta.com/ - see more of my work

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

NutsAboutAmiga wrote: No, AmigaOS4.1 for AmigaOne was never beta, AmigaOS4.1 for Sam440 was beta. and maybe for PegII.

The version for the PegII is not labled as beta.

_________________
My programs: via.bckrs.de
MorphOS user since V0.4 (2001)

@Hans: it's not pessimistic, it's reality...

Of course it is more modern than OS3.x was. But the problem is that all main limitations are still there... Everyone seem to be happy with that, I am not. That's just it. Of course it will take time... but I don't see OS4 going towards it... I mean: what's the use of spending time and ressources "improving" something you know you'll have to break/rewrite completely to remove these limitations ?

Can you honestly deny OS4 is outdated, and will remain so until a new modern base is written ?

_________________
http://www.warpdesign.fr/

@Leo

Quote:

what's the use of spending time and ressources "improving" something you know you'll have to break/rewrite completely to remove these limitations ?

Go ahead and do exactly that instead of constantly complaining about how bad things are.

_________________
Why stop it now, just when I am hating it?

Thore Böckelmann

@tboeckel: I offered my help, and I'd be ready to do anything I can, without asking for anything in return, if I knew the goal was a modern OS, and getting rid of all these legacies...

But who knows what the goal is ? Have you seen any roadmap... I did not...

_________________
http://www.warpdesign.fr/

@Leo

Whether this hobby OS has memory protection or not doesn't make a blind bit of difference to the vast majority of hobbiest Amiga Fanboys. They'll buy the product and a £700 machine anyway! As Hyperion have made no attempt to develope the OS for the mainstream thus far, I see no real need to give the OS memory protection. It's a strange curio OS for gadget geeks and ex-Amigans nothing more!

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@Leo
While complaining this way is not constructive at all, but...
As you mentioned, a roadmap for both: HW and OS is VITAL for a decaying community.

@Hyperion: Why do not we have any road map?

Waj

@Leo

Quote:

Leo wrote: @Hans: it's not pessimistic, it's reality...

Spoken like a true pessimist. You're wrong, but there's no way of convincing you.

Quote:

Of course it is more modern than OS3.x was. But the problem is that all main limitations are still there... Everyone seem to be happy with that, I am not. That's just it. Of course it will take time... but I don't see OS4 going towards it... I mean: what's the use of spending time and ressources "improving" something you know you'll have to break/rewrite completely to remove these limitations ? Can you honestly deny OS4 is outdated, and will remain so until a new modern base is written ?

Rigo responded to your claim that they spent seven years porting Amiga OS to PowerPC; in that context, modernizing the OS in any way debunks your claims quite soundly. Exactly how far that modernization has come so far is irrelevant. It's an incremental process, and no, everything done up till now won't have to be discarded and rewritten from scratch when a compatibility break occurs.

Hans

_________________
Join the Kea Campus - upgrade your skills; support my work; enjoy the Amiga corner.
https://keasigmadelta.com/ - see more of my work

@cha05e90

Quote:

Company that took 7 years to port a 25 years old OS from 68k to PPC

can be seen quite often. It would be nice to know what the netto time was (not the brutto of 7 years...).[/quote]
Considering that OS4 development had cost around 2 million euros, I guess at least some people must have worked on it full time.

@wajdy

Quote:

While complaining this way is not constructive at all, but... As you mentioned, a roadmap for both: HW and OS is VITAL for a decaying community. @Hyperion: Why do not we have any road map? Waj

I don't wish to appear rude and I might be being thick, as I am not a programmer, but what is the fascination with a road map?

I have never seen Microsoft's or Apples's Roadmap, I just know one is working on windows 7 and the other is working on Snow leopard. Both have been in beta for a while, and are close to being released. Further forward than that, where are their roadmaps?

What is said, hinted, or announced by either ACube or Hyperion, is dissected, analysed, critisiced, and ripped to peices on amiga forums, so why should the general public be shown a roadmap?

If you want to write programs, and you feel there are certain areas where future OS changes may, according to your own wishes, be made. Write it in a modular way so that you could implement those changes easier. Write programs for the hardware and OS that is available now, not for what you want it to become.

_________________
Peter Swallow.
A1XEG3-800 [IBM 750FX PowerPC], running OS4.1FE, using ac97 onboard sound.

"There are 10 types of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't."

@all

Here the new Hardware:

http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2009/08/nokias-booklet-3g-is-not-a-netbook/


Guess which OS???????

_________________
Sometimes we give people a lot of credit just because they're writing nice sentences even if it isn't adding up to much.

@Birbo

Quote:

Announced today is a brand-new, 3G equipped min-laptop, the Booklet 3G. The 10.1-inch screen and Atom processor put it clearly in the netbook market, but it comes with some extras you won’t find elsewhere; the kind of extras you’d expect from a cellphone manufacturer.

It's x86, and Hyperion have already ruled out an x86 port.

_________________

@Birbo

Quote:

Guess which OS???????

Windows 7?

-EDIT-
this page has a (flash) demo video of the device.

And at least in my opinion, Windows 7 is quite top on the "guess what OS" list for forthcoming X86 hardware, so why are you even "guessing"?

Last edited by Jupp3 on 24-Aug-2009 at 01:27 PM.
Last edited by Jupp3 on 24-Aug-2009 at 01:26 PM.
Last edited by Jupp3 on 24-Aug-2009 at 01:25 PM.

@Jupp3

I didn't write anything about Amiga OS, did I?

But I doubt that Windows 7 will be on the new nokia device. Perhaps Linux...

Is the flash-video from Nokia? In the nokia-statement no OS was mentioned.

_________________
Sometimes we give people a lot of credit just because they're writing nice sentences even if it isn't adding up to much.

@Birbo

Quote:

I didn't write anything about Amiga OS, did I?

And neither did I. You just told us to guess, and I based my guess on the announcements I have read, and the demo video.

Quote:

But I doubt that Windows 7 will be on the new nokia device. Perhaps Linux... Is the flash-video from Nokia?

Most newsitems covering the device specifically mention Windows (although no version number, so I assume it's 7), and I'd assume the video is from Nokia, looks definitely "professional enough", and what if it wasn't? What would be the point of doing a marketing video for someone elses hardware product, and lie about the supplied operating system?

The video clearly has "windows" written all over it.

Quote:

In the nokia-statement no OS was mentioned.

That is often clear sign of "newest available version of Microsoft Windows"

Last edited by Jupp3 on 24-Aug-2009 at 01:45 PM.

We are in the happy position to announced that OS4.x will soon ship for a well known gaming console. Press release will follow shortly.

_________________