@Hans
@QuikSanz

Is the use of AOS4, MorphOS os AROS a condition to be in this forum?

I am an Amiga-Enthusiast since 1990. And I like to see, what's happening in the Amiga-Scene. But if I don't like AOS4, MorphOS and AROS, that doesen't mean, that I don't be interested in.

It's not a paradox at all, to be in this forum and to work on other Computer-Systems.

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@Birbo

Quote:

Birbo wrote: @Hans @QuikSanz Is the use of AOS4, MorphOS os AROS a condition to be in this forum? I am an Amiga-Enthusiast since 1990. And I like to see, what's happening in the Amiga-Scene. But if I don't like AOS4, MorphOS and AROS, that doesen't mean, that I don't be interested in. It's not a paradox at all, to be in this forum and to work on other Computer-Systems.

If I "couldn't live with Amiga OS 4", then I certainly wouldn't bother visiting this site, so it's a perfectly valid question. What's the point in being part of a community when all that you do there is bitch and moan about something that you don't even like? It makes no sense to me; there are so many other things that one could be doing.

Being interested in something that you find so awful that you "can't live with" is paradoxical. Maybe you think that this is normal, but I don't.

Hans

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@Hans

...because...errm...he likes MacOS!?!

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@NutsAboutAmiga

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Anubis is just Amiga skin on top Linux, it has bin done before and its nothing new.

So where can I download this earlier effort of "Linux with considerable amount of source level Amiga compatibility"? I have totally missed this project somehow... Does it have f.ex. a version of MUI, probably AHI and whatever might be planned for AnubisOS? (unlike you, I don't know too many details about it, as not much has been shared to public)

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Linux drivers, Linux kernel, X-Windows desktop, now put some skin on top and you have AmigaOS imitation, they might hide filesystem, or do some thing whit Linux to hide what its based on, but as soon your going to install your sound drivers Alsa or OSS, you know its not an real Amiga, or need to configure the Linux kernel.

And in any case, how come you know so many weaknesses and problems of an OS, that (afaik) hasn't been yet released to a public?

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If you don't enjoy either MorphOS or Amiga OS 4, then why are you here?

Is it a problem to you to be interested in some alternative OS even though they are not ready for me ?
No, I couldn't use the OS in its current form. But I hope it's moving towards a modern OS. And if that's indeed the direction, I'm ready to help to make it reach this goal...

Now, I used the Amiga for a long time... and am still interested in what happens,... but I am not just a blind fan idolatring anything the team working on it could do and say. Can you understand that ?

That's just it.

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maybe it is just me, i thought hyperion was doing the porting and development?
everyone is fussing over roadmaps that mean nothing to us. they seem to be claiming that there is no work going on if the roadmap is not public?!? this is stupid imo.

case in point i play world of warcraft. as a community we were constantly asking for a revamp to use flying mounts in game. blizzard said no. we asked for the ability to run old dungeons in heroic mode. blizz said no. we asked for a refreshing of older content in game. blizz said no.these were asked for for over a year. this last weekend blizzard had a convention and announced that they are going to release an expansion that did everything i listed. they also said they had benn working on it the last year and will be released sometime next year.
so we had no idea that this would happen untill the actual announcement. hyperion is probably working on everything you are concerned about. however they won't tell anything until THEY are ready to tell.

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@clebin

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Take the development of OS X. The original roadmap for Rhapsody, was communicated back in 1997, years before OS X even hit the first release. That roadmap changed with Jobs becoming CEO, but when the community desperately needed guidance, the roadmap was there for them.

This is inaccurate, Gil Amelio the CEO at the time did trash the Copland system and during his time they started working on a new OS- called Gershwin (although there is no proof of it ever existed in any form other than a codename.)

Rhapsody did not happen until after Apple bought NeXT, and Steve Jobs was already on the company.
Even the very first revision of Rhapsody was announced and presented by Steve Jobs.

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The Aqua user-interface was previewed well before the OS X Public Beta. The Carbon and Cocoa frameworks for moving classic Mac apps to the new OS were outlined back in 1998, I think. The feature set for the latest release, Snow Leopard, was presented a year ago just like every OS X release.

The aqua user-interface was introduced with Mac OS X DP4- the release just before the public beta. Before that Mac OS X used platinum (and so did Rhapsody for that matter).
Platinum was originally developed for Copland, but later appeared in Classic Mac OS 8.

Carbon was added due to demand of Adobe and some other big companies at the time, Apple originally didn't intend to support anything but Yellow Box (now known as Cocoa).
Cocoa has been altered since these days, but the actual API is very old- as it was the NeXTStep / OpenStep API.

Regarding user interface frameworks MacOS X clearly stated since many years ago that Cocoa is the only API that will continue to be supported during Mac OS X lifetime.

People seem to wonder why some people want a roadmap.

It is perfectly clear for me at least, why there is demand for a roadmap.

Someone needs to step up in the land of Amiga and declare himself dictator of Amiga, to inspire, seduce and lure current, old and new Amiga users into the future of Amiga, whatever that will be.

Sure, you can all enjoy your Sam440 with or without a roadmap, a plan, a vision or any kind of thought of where this movement is going, but that also applies to your Atari 2600, your Apple 2 and your C64.

And to be honest with you I think nobody here burns with passion over how their C64 is going to show the rest of the computer world just how much better it is.

Because fact is, AmigaOS4.1 kicks all kind off ass right now. With the right kind of attitude, development and progression it could become a serious player in the future. I am 100% serious in that I believe a future AmigaOS could knock out OsX in the future, but the road leading to that point were we hardcore Amiga users burning with flaming red Amiga blood can scream out to all Mac user how much our system rules is long in to the future and ... maybe not existing?!

Please prove me wrong.

Last edited by cv643d on 26-Aug-2009 at 11:35 AM.
Last edited by cv643d on 26-Aug-2009 at 11:34 AM.

@Frek

I think you misunderstand, or perhaps I wasn't clear - I'm not talking about Copland, but what happened after.

As you know, even after Jobs had returned, the plan was for Rhapsody to be a pretty open platform, running on CHRP machine and there was the 'Yellow Box' that would allow Rhapsody apps to run on Windows.

When Jobs became interim CEO, the roadmap changed markedly, the clones were axed and the Mac was closed again. I remember this because I was in the market for a PIOS machine at the time, but ended up with a PowerMac G3. My G3 ran that Platinum-themed MacOS 8.0 actually! I think it may have been DP3, not DP4 that Aqua was lanuched, but anyway, it was at a Jobs keynote that it was first spied.

Apple have been trying to axe Carbon for years. I think they see the transition to 64bit as their big chance to kill Carbon. I'm not sure how long it'll take Adobe to move over, considering Apple have only just rewritten the Finder, but Apple won't get a better change to force their hand. I was pleased to see Microsoft Outlook coming back to the Mac as a Cocoa app.

Copland sort of fascinates me though. I know there are builds out there that can run for whole minutes at a time! I'd love to see it, just as I'd like to play with Apple's first Unix OS - A/UX. There's lots of weird twists and turns in Apple's history...

Chris

Last edited by clebin on 26-Aug-2009 at 01:38 PM.

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Apple have been trying to axe Carbon for years. I think they see the transition to 64bit as their big chance to kill Carbon.

CS5 is likely to be 64bit/based on cocoa since it's Intel only... But I'm wondering what does it have to do with the original subject..

Last edited by Leo on 26-Aug-2009 at 01:58 PM.

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@Leo

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Is it a problem to you to be interested in some alternative OS even though they are not ready for me ?

I think it's only a problem if you are perceived to be slinging mud all the time - it certainly does seem that way.

I must admit, I'm amazed to find out from Fab on here that you have spent the last goodness knows how long slinging mud at MOS too... tell me, what do you like?

Rude!

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@Leo

It was a response to being corrected in the previous post, and related to the question of whether Apple's roadmap for the OS is obvious or not. It also added some detail that interests me - that you can either choose to read or skip. Sometimes you even make me look like a ray of sunshine round here!

Chris

Last edited by clebin on 26-Aug-2009 at 02:31 PM.
Last edited by clebin on 26-Aug-2009 at 02:29 PM.

@Leo

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People get angry, but who cares ? You don't owe them anything. And they just should buy a PC/Mac and play with Windows/MacOSX if they aren't happy, right ? That's the way it works right now...

I have an intel IMac, and access to a Windows PC, and as much as you won't believe it, there are somethings I can do on my Amigaone that I can't do on either of those machines.

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@Hans

Quote:

Hans wrote: Being interested in something that you find so awful that you "can't live with" is paradoxical. Maybe you think that this is normal, but I don't. Hans

Is it paradoxical to have a site filled with users that think one of the greatest computer/OS systems of all time, should be modernized over many many years (thank you Hyperion) only to then bitch at people who don't see the brilliance in running it on ancient hardware that has no relation to what Amiga was?

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@clebin

Yellow Box for Windows was never intended as a feature of Rhapsody afaik, but it did exist yes.

Clones were killed because they brought no benefit to the platform, no new users was attracted instead Apples own customers bought the clone as they were cheaper, pretty ironic as Apple designed the motherboard used in most clones. (Daystar was probably the only clone manufacturer that actually contributed significantly to Apple/MacOS)
I find it extremely odd that one one else realized what damage the clone operation did. I guess IBM learnt a lesson however.

Yes you're right it was with DP3, I don't know why I recall it as DP4 everytime...

Apple has not been trying to axe Carbon, they made it pretty clear long time ago that Carbon was not to get any new features or evolve significantly.
So of course it won't appear in a 64 bit version, the 32 bit version remains however.

Copland was terminated for a reason, and I heard directly from the horses mouth that the project was so poorly managed that it basically was a miracle they could ship any development releases at all.

Some of the Copland technology made it to MacOS 8/9 however, and some even to OS X.

@Thread,

Anyway, back OT. I still think it will be something like "Java" or "rewriting the Graphics System" so it will see more than 128Mb and adds more features like maybe using the decoder in the Graphics Card for movies and stuff.

Chris

@thread

please check out my POLL: http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=29446&forum=32

OS4 in an "Amiga Forever" like package.

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@thread

Yes, the Hyperion project is for sure ambitious. The hyperion project is either HW and SW. The ambitious project is composed by different projects.

This is what i understood till now.

Last edited by AmigaBlitter on 26-Aug-2009 at 07:30 PM.

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retired

@AmigaBlitter

whot about c.net or c#

@QuikSanz

The Graphics system doesn't need to be rewritten to support more than 128Mb.There are people with some Radeon cards that initialize the whole 256Mb on it, that was just a driver problem that needs to be fixed in the radeon driver.

Just to clear some misinformation i've seen running around.

Picasso96 Already supports more than 128Mb and some users can enjoy this already.

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