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Hammer
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 29-Jun-2010 3:55:44
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Joined: 9-Mar-2003 Posts: 4848
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| @DAX
Quote:
DAX wrote: @bernd_afa When I told people that a 2Ghz Titan could generate 8000 mips they all fired back at me saying "mips" aren't that Hot these days, and that vector units are way more important. On a link posted abobe I read:
The PA6T's back end can execute the following instruction types in parallel:
2 integer operations 1 floating-point operation 4 vector operations 1 load/store operation
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Still limited by front-end's instruction issue._________________ Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68) Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68) |
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pavlor
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 29-Jun-2010 7:45:26
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Joined: 10-Jul-2005 Posts: 9494
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| @lsorense
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KimmoK
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 29-Jun-2010 10:50:27
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Birbo
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 29-Jun-2010 14:30:45
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Joined: 5-Apr-2007 Posts: 592
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bernd_afa
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 29-Jun-2010 18:49:45
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Joined: 14-Apr-2006 Posts: 829
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| @lsorense >The Power6+ is available at 5GHz from IBM, and is I believe dual core with dual >thread per core. The Power7 is 8 core, 4+Ghz, 4 threads per core.
>The one in the xbox is a slow chip compared to the last few generations of IBM >power chips.
yes but the power chips are too expensive.do you know what a power 6 or seven cost ?.I guess more than 2000$.
A ppc970 have 2 cores and so the 3 core 3,5 GHZ Xenon can maybe faster as 2,5 GHZ 2 Core.also Xenon can do Hyperthreading, this is good speedup for in order CPU.
@dax >2 integer operations >1 floating-point operation >4 vector operations >1 load/store operation
thats all in all 8 Units.
where you have read that pa6t have 4 vector units Each Core ?
in wikipedia stand
""" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PWRficient
6 execution units including a double precision FPU and Altivec unit. """
so can only have 2 Vector Units
the units are split, g4 have 2 vector units 1 load/save convert and 1 calc.
Last edited by bernd_afa on 29-Jun-2010 at 07:00 PM. Last edited by bernd_afa on 29-Jun-2010 at 06:54 PM. Last edited by bernd_afa on 29-Jun-2010 at 06:53 PM. Last edited by bernd_afa on 29-Jun-2010 at 06:50 PM.
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DAX
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 29-Jun-2010 18:59:34
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Joined: 30-Sep-2009 Posts: 2790
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| @bernd_afa I didn't say it has 4 vector units, I was quoting this article:
http://arstechnica.com/old/content/2007/02/8828.ars
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bernd_afa
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 29-Jun-2010 19:07:41
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Joined: 14-Apr-2006 Posts: 829
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| @DAX >I didn't say it has 4 vector units, I was quoting this article:
the pa6t is really a mystic CPU, when you look in wikipedia here stand 10 Million transistors
and on your link stand
(The PA6T has 200 million transistors total).
A G4 have too 10- 11 Million Transistors, but need less transistors because have smaller cache.
that pa5t have 200 million transistors and is 65 nm design and need only 5-13 Watt average, i also cant believe.
there are no wonders possible lower power usage you can only get with less transistors, or smaller structuresBut less transistors result in simpler design and slower speed Last edited by bernd_afa on 29-Jun-2010 at 07:08 PM. Last edited by bernd_afa on 29-Jun-2010 at 07:08 PM.
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bernd_afa
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 29-Jun-2010 19:14:56
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DAX
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 29-Jun-2010 19:28:23
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Joined: 30-Sep-2009 Posts: 2790
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| @bernd_afa it would seem, that they use very complex techniques for saving power, so complex in fact that the guy from arstechnica lamented the ultra complex talk: "The presenters get deep, deep into the weeds of clock tree design, clock synchronization, SRAM cell design, interconnect pitches, thermal profiling, and a whole bunch of other stuff that very few people understands"
They also mention that: " the chip sports over 25,000 clock gates so that clock pulses to different regions of the processor can be shut off dynamically to save power. "
P.S. So each core has a VMX unit that is internally divided into 2 parts?
Last edited by DAX on 29-Jun-2010 at 07:29 PM.
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madmalkav
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 29-Jun-2010 22:37:01
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Joined: 19-May-2006 Posts: 88
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| Don't forget in all that numbers dancing game that Xenon is an in-order execution CPU. |
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KimmoK
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 30-Jun-2010 6:04:18
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Arko
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 30-Jun-2010 7:53:02
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Joined: 17-Jan-2007 Posts: 1989
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Quote:
mips" aren't that Hot these days, and that vector units are way more important.
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The G4 on the AmigaONe has a vector unit IMR AOS4 doesn't make any use of it. Maybe they will change this suddenly._________________ AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.
I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28): http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0 |
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pavlor
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 30-Jun-2010 8:00:27
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Joined: 10-Jul-2005 Posts: 9494
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| @Arko
Quote:
The G4 on the AmigaONe has a vector unit IMR AOS4 doesn't make any use of it. Maybe they will change this suddenly. |
Any proof of that statement? |
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KimmoK
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 30-Jun-2010 8:31:52
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Joined: 14-Mar-2003 Posts: 5211
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland | | |
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| @Arko
The problem is that VMX unit is too rare in the AOS community. (situation seems far better in MOS side, most boards have G4&Altivec) _________________ - KimmoK // For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA // // Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer? |
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DAX
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 30-Jun-2010 9:48:58
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Joined: 30-Sep-2009 Posts: 2790
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| @KimmoK Anyway, your linked article cinfirms that the PA6T has 2 VMX units per core, one for simple SIMD and one for complex SIMD operations.
The entire text shows that it is more advanced than G5 in many areas (it's not just more L1 cache as it treats data in a more advanced way in many instances). Last edited by DAX on 30-Jun-2010 at 09:49 AM.
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KimmoK
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 30-Jun-2010 10:09:18
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Joined: 14-Mar-2003 Posts: 5211
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland | | |
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| @DAX
PA6T seems almost too good to be true. It has very high bandwidth all around the SOC + RAM (the best in RISC world?). It will be very interesting to see how it performs in desktop tasks. I believe that there are many (non Amiga) "geeks" that wan't to buy it just to play with the most modern PPC CPU. (IIRC, PA6T evaluation boards cost several thousands more)
(IIRC, G5 was (about) the first POWER core based chip that had VMX, so it's not too surpricing if PA Semi managed to improve from that. I think latest G4 models had far more "polished" Altivec implementation. G4's "only" handicap seems to be the bandwidth to/from the CPU.) _________________ - KimmoK // For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA // // Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer? |
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DAX
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 30-Jun-2010 10:13:24
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Elite Member  |
Joined: 30-Sep-2009 Posts: 2790
From: Italy | | |
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| @KimmoK The article also says it has better handling of Cisc instructions compared to G4/G5 (it can execute many of them natively instead of breaking them down first) I wonder if that feature will be of any help in Desktop applications.
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Arko
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 30-Jun-2010 12:00:46
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Super Member  |
Joined: 17-Jan-2007 Posts: 1989
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| @pavlor
Quote:
pavlor wrote: @Arko
Any proof of that statement? |
No I have never seen any aouncement about a future Altivec support in AOS4_________________ AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.
I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28): http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0 |
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Arko
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 30-Jun-2010 12:02:07
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Super Member  |
Joined: 17-Jan-2007 Posts: 1989
From: Unknown | | |
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| @KimmoK
Quote:
KimmoK wrote: @Arko
The problem is that VMX unit is too rare in the AOS community. (situation seems far better in MOS side, most boards have G4&Altivec) |
It was my impressions as if there where mor G4 A1 or PegII around than Sam440_________________ AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.
I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28): http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0 |
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pavlor
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Re: X1000 CPU clue :) Posted on 30-Jun-2010 12:07:24
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Elite Member  |
Joined: 10-Jul-2005 Posts: 9494
From: Unknown | | |
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| @Arko
Quote:
No I have never seen any aouncement about a future Altivec support in AOS4 |
Announced and introduced there |
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