@Lou

Quote:

People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. You've shown no actual evidence. You can polish your "posulates" all you want but in the end you can stick them in your posterior. Your "evidence" is as good as mine.

Your claim is false.

Why is fairly simply let's lay out the actual evidence and see if it matches your claim of non-existence.
Humans / Aliens
Archeology uncovered evidence of beings: 1 / 0
Archeology uncovered tools: 1 / 0
Tested tools to cut stones and they worked: 1 / 0
Postulated methods using rope, stone, wood worked to move and lift equivalent weight stones: 1 / 0
Small pyramids built using the tools available at the time: 1 / 0
An actual full pyramid built: 0 / 0 (Though you've yet to put the the cash to make this happen.)

@BrianK

Quote:

BrianK wrote: @Lou Quote: People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. You've shown no actual evidence. You can polish your "posulates" all you want but in the end you can stick them in your posterior. Your "evidence" is as good as mine. Your claim is false. Why is fairly simply let's lay out the actual evidence and see if it matches your claim of non-existence. Humans / Aliens Archeology uncovered evidence of beings: 1 / 0 Archeology uncovered tools: 1 / 0 Tested tools to cut stones and they worked: 1 / 0 Postulated methods using rope, stone, wood worked to move and lift equivalent weight stones: 1 / 0 Small pyramids built using the tools available at the time: 1 / 0 An actual full pyramid built: 0 / 0 (Though you've yet to put the the cash to make this happen.)

Coral Castle. Now while Ed Leedskalin isn't an alien, it doesn't me he didn't use the same tech.

@Lou

Quote:

Did you know that a certain overweight and underpowered car is the world's fastest electric car?

No, I didnt, but it did not achieve this accolade with its original engine. All due praise to John Metric for his efforts.

Quote:

Thanks for sharing, do buy a clue!

The clue being that if you take the rubber band out and fit a proper motor, the Fiero can do well in a niche category. Congratulations.

Seriously though, we do need to improve tha availability of energy efficient transport, if only to wipe the smug grins off the faces of oil company executives, but the reason for poor take up is not some murky conspiracy. It is purely due to the total apathy of the buying public to new developments. Electric vehicles have improved from what they were, but they are not quite there yet.

_________________
When in trouble, fear or doubt, run in circles, scream and shout.

@Lou

Quote:

Coral Castle. Now while Ed Leedskalin isn't an alien, it doesn't me he didn't use the same tech.

Did you mistype 'me' and it should be 'mean'? I ask because the sentence doesn't make sense as presented.

@Lou & @Nimrod
Quote:

Did you know that a certain overweight and underpowered car is the world's fastest electric car?

It may be 'overweight' but if it's beating the other cars its hardly underpowered. The 'underpowered engine' was replaced with an engine that has adequate powers to win races.

Last edited by BrianK on 24-Mar-2012 at 05:10 PM.
Last edited by BrianK on 24-Mar-2012 at 05:07 PM.

@Lou

A good example of how the amateur astronomers work. They see something strange Clouds over Mars and they run to the press saying WTF is this?! There's be no difference if they saw an incoming alien.

@BrianK

Quote:

BrianK wrote: @Lou A good example of how the amateur astronomers work. They see something strange Clouds over Mars and they run to the press saying WTF is this?! There's be no difference if they saw an incoming alien.

What amazes me is that we have Mars orbiters but it takes amateur terrestial sources to find such things...
And another thing: For instance, have you noticed how the pictures of the face on Mars have actually gone down in quality since the '70's...hmmm....

@BrianK

Quote:

BrianK wrote: @Lou Quote: Coral Castle. Now while Ed Leedskalin isn't an alien, it doesn't me he didn't use the same tech. Did you mistype 'me' and it should be 'mean'? I ask because the sentence doesn't make sense as presented.

Yes

Quote:

@Lou & @Nimrod Quote: Did you know that a certain overweight and underpowered car is the world's fastest electric car? It may be 'overweight' but if it's beating the other cars its hardly underpowered. The 'underpowered engine' was replaced with an engine that has adequate powers to win races.

Nimrod was attempting to insult my taste in cars...but failed to recognize what makes the Fiero special. It's like an open box that you can put in anything you want to get anything you want out of it. On a side note, the GM EV-1 was actually a Fiero frame redone in aluminum. Now if they has ever made the actual Fiero like that, well, a certain other notable GM 2-seater sports car wouldn't have been as appealing...

@Lou

Quote:

Quote: [quote]Coral Castle. Now while Ed Leedskalin isn't an alien, it doesn't me he didn't use the same tech. Did you mistype 'me' and it should be 'mean'? I ask because the sentence doesn't make sense as presented.

Yes[/quote]
I fully agree that while Ed isn't an alien that doesn't mean he used the same tech as aliens.

Quote:

Nimrod was attempting to insult my taste in cars...but failed to recognize what makes the Fiero special. It's like an open box that you can put in anything you want to get anything you want out of it.

Fieros are noteably bad vehicles. They were about as worthless as the Pacer here in the winter. Most RWD cars fit your 'open box' model fairly easily. FWD are a bit more tricky but there are some clever pinnings there too. Such as the old Ford Fiesta that someone stuck an SHO V6 into. It's really a question of how much work one wants to do to make it happen.

Quote:

What amazes me is that we have Mars orbiters but it takes amateur terrestial sources to find such things...

Until recently only the earth had imaging of every surface 24x7x365. Recently we are doing that to the sun for the first time. So having an amateur make the discovery isn't all that unsuprising.

Quote:

And another thing: For instance, have you noticed how the pictures of the face on Mars have actually gone down in quality since the '70's...hmmm....

Actually the opposite is true. The resolution and quality of the 'Face on Mars' is much improved since Viking. The spots are gone, they were bit errors in Viking. And the rocks and outcrops are much more detailed. Viking's lower quality image on left VS better quality Global Surveyor on right

There's an easy way to check this - Take the Mars Express image and squint your eyes. The 'Face on Mars' returns. Why? The answer is by squinting you just reduced the resolution and quality of your vision.

Last edited by BrianK on 24-Mar-2012 at 08:10 PM.
Last edited by BrianK on 24-Mar-2012 at 06:53 PM.

@Lou

Quote:

Nimrod was attempting to insult my taste in cars...but failed to recognize what makes the Fiero special.

Please accept my apologies for any unintended insult against your taste in cars. Taste is a purely subjective matter and is not susceptible to boolean TRUE/FALSE division. What I hope is a more positive statement is that "it is what people other than GM do with them that makes Fieros stand out from the usual banal offerings of the automotive industry in general." If you think that this statement is unfair, feel free to compare the performance figures for a factory standard model with those of its European or Japanese counterparts. Then continue to modify and customise to show the manufacturers what they could, and possibly should be producing.
With recent advances in inverter design and technology coupled with better permanent magnet AC motors, and lightweight high current batteries, it is entirely possible that the corporate dominance of the oil giants will soon be history, in the same way as Woolworths and PanAm.
If this happens it will be because some engineers somewhere, have utilised valid scientific advances to make progress.
On a separate note the motors fitted to the successful all electric car will not be monopole motors, nor will they levitate.

Quote:

On a side note, the GM EV-1 was actually a Fiero frame redone in aluminum. Now if they has ever made the actual Fiero like that, well, a certain other notable GM 2-seater sports car wouldn't have been as appealing...

I agree... but possibly a few adjustments to the suspension to make cornering a little less "interesting" would also be appreciated.


@BrianK

Quote:

There's an easy way to check this - Take the Mars Express image and squint your eyes. The 'Face on Mars' returns. Why? The answer is by squinting you just reduced the resolution and quality of your vision.

Perhaps I shoul not be admitting this where Lou can read it, but I get the same effect when I remove my glasses.

_________________
When in trouble, fear or doubt, run in circles, scream and shout.

@Nimrod

The Fiero was a fairly badly implemented idea. Mid-Engine RWD car sports char was indeed a good idea. Heck that's how Ferrari makes most of their living. Putting an underpowered engine in such that it became a two seat commuter wasn't smart. It killed the Fiero and by the time GM got around to fixing it the market had dried up. GM had similar problems with their Diesel. Where instead of building a Diesel they modified a gas v8. In the end cost cutting never worked right there either.

There's nothing special about the engine in a box concept the Fiero used. Most all FWD cars use that concept.

Quote:

I get the same effect when I remove my glasses.

About 90% of people in their lifetime will need glasses to have perfect vision. So certainly when you reduce clarity by removing your glasses you are performing the same sort of 'squint' effect. Lower resolution results in the Face returning.

In related news Charles Manson heard the Beatles White Album on CD and said.. Wow what clarity I guess God wasn't talking to me. Oops my bad.

Last edited by BrianK on 25-Mar-2012 at 04:30 PM.

@Lou

Neutrinos don't travel faster than light OPERA in France was tested against CERN and found at speed of light or just slightly slower travel for Neutrinos. Accuracy should be improved because of tighter nanosecond timings and tighter distances, established to the centimeter scale, measures in the experiment.

Though the detector types are different - photographic emulsion versus liquid Argon. So, as always more experiments are welcome.

@BrianK

Quote:

BrianK wrote: @Lou Fieros are noteably bad vehicles. They were about as worthless as the Pacer here in the winter. Most RWD cars fit your 'open box' model fairly easily. FWD are a bit more tricky but there are some clever pinnings there too.

That's a myth. Fieros are actually fairly reliable and for a 24-29 year old car, it holds itself together well. All the early bad 4cylinder engines have been warranty replaced. The V6s had no notable issues. Fieros are rwd but always have traction in the snow since the weight of the engine and tranny are over the wheels that turn. I've driven mine every winter since '95... As for "open box", no, rwd cars generally have a back seat. If it has a back seat, it's not a sports car. Those cars are too long. They don't handle as well.
Here's a nice example of what can be done with the underpinnings: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3X6su0FhJ4I
And here's an example of what you can do with the exterior: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aco1lfk8WU0

Quote:

The spots are gone, they were bit errors in Viking. And the rocks and outcrops are much more detailed. Viking's lower quality image on left VS better quality Global Surveyor on right There's an easy way to check this - Take the Mars Express image and squint your eyes. The 'Face on Mars' returns. Why? The answer is by squinting you just reduced the resolution and quality of your vision.

Quite honestly, that image looks edited.

@Nimrod

Quote:

Nimrod wrote: @Lou Quote: Nimrod was attempting to insult my taste in cars...but failed to recognize what makes the Fiero special. Please accept my apologies for any unintended insult against your taste in cars. Taste is a purely subjective matter and is not susceptible to boolean TRUE/FALSE division. What I hope is a more positive statement is that "it is what people other than GM do with them that makes Fieros stand out from the usual banal offerings of the automotive industry in general." If you think that this statement is unfair, feel free to compare the performance figures for a factory standard model with those of its European or Japanese counterparts. Then continue to modify and customise to show the manufacturers what they could, and possibly should be producing. With recent advances in inverter design and technology coupled with better permanent magnet AC motors, and lightweight high current batteries, it is entirely possible that the corporate dominance of the oil giants will soon be history, in the same way as Woolworths and PanAm. If this happens it will be because some engineers somewhere, have utilised valid scientific advances to make progress. On a separate note the motors fitted to the successful all electric car will not be monopole motors, nor will they levitate. Quote: On a side note, the GM EV-1 was actually a Fiero frame redone in aluminum. Now if they has ever made the actual Fiero like that, well, a certain other notable GM 2-seater sports car wouldn't have been as appealing... I agree... but possibly a few adjustments to the suspension to make cornering a little less "interesting" would also be appreciated.

For it's time (84-88), the Fiero was well received. For the 1988 model, they actually equipped it with the suspension that the engineers designed for its launch but the bean-counters refused to authorize. That suspension was considered a 'true sports car suspension'. However, this litte upgrade fixes the issues with the off-the-shelf design of the earlier years. :)

@BrianK

Quote:

BrianK wrote: @Nimrod The Fiero was a fairly badly implemented idea. Mid-Engine RWD car sports char was indeed a good idea. Heck that's how Ferrari makes most of their living. Putting an underpowered engine in such that it became a two seat commuter wasn't smart. It killed the Fiero and by the time GM got around to fixing it the market had dried up. GM had similar problems with their Diesel. Where instead of building a Diesel they modified a gas v8. In the end cost cutting never worked right there either. There's nothing special about the engine in a box concept the Fiero used. Most all FWD cars use that concept.

Actually, GM killed the car on a marketing guess that they would lose money on it in the 90's. If you look at the 2 seater commuter market, everyone who got into the game after (MR2, 300ZX, Supra, etc..) eventually priced themselves out of their own market. The started competing for Corvette customers and their prices went up accordingly but only people in their 20's were buying them and couldn't afford $30+ cars... Back then Corvettes were in the 30's new. The Fiero sold for $11k base to $15k fully loaded. Not exactly the same market. In '86, they designed a new '89 Fiero seen here: http://www.heartlandfieros.com/proposed89fiero.htm

@Lou

Quote:

Quite honestly, that image looks edited.

Okay you're postulating again, well conjecturing actually, any evidence?

That being said one can find many cases where Viking's images are worse in quality compared to later images. I haven't viewed them all so there may be some cases of worse later images, though it's clearly not true that all later images are worse. Mars Express and Mars Orbiter's images of the mountain on Mars are noteably improved in clarity and quality. The Face turned out to be paredolia based on shading, image angle, and the natural ability for humans to make faces out of patterns. A great example of poor 'eye-witness' testamony.


As for Fiero - Good discussion. Though since I feel it's too far off topic I'll no longer respond.

Last edited by BrianK on 26-Mar-2012 at 06:17 PM.

@BrianK

Quote:

BrianK wrote: @Lou Quote: Quite honestly, that image looks edited. Okay you're postulating again, well conjecturing actually, any evidence?

One side looks "fuzzy", the other side looked like it has too much detail...
This is the kind of stuff people look at when trying to look for edited photos.
You see ALOT of this stuff on NASA photos.

N.A.S.A. Never A Straight Answer

http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2012/03/quantum-interference-with-big-molecules-approaches-the-macroscopic.ars?clicked=related_right

Quote:

According to quantum physics, the wavelength of a massive particle is inversely proportional to its momentum: the mass multiplied by the particle's speed. In other words, the heavier the object, the shorter its wavelength at a given speed. A kicked football (for example) has a very tiny wavelength compared to the size of the ball because it has a relatively large mass and a speed measured in meters per second (rather than nanometers or such). In contrast, an electron has a relatively large wavelength (though still microscopic) because it has a small mass.

I repeat, the frequency energy formula applies to objects of all sizes...all the way down to light!

@Lou

Quote:

One side looks "fuzzy", the other side looked like it has too much detail... This is the kind of stuff people look at when trying to look for edited photos. You see ALOT of this stuff on NASA photos.

Edited huh? Do you realize there are various forensic methods to determine if the photo has been manipulated? Do you know of any look into the underlying structure? Or... Again do you have any EVIDENCE for your charge?

@BrianK

Quote:

BrianK wrote: @Lou Quote: One side looks "fuzzy", the other side looked like it has too much detail... This is the kind of stuff people look at when trying to look for edited photos. You see ALOT of this stuff on NASA photos. Edited huh? Do you realize there are various forensic methods to determine if the photo has been manipulated? Do you know of any look into the underlying structure? Or... Again do you have any EVIDENCE for your charge?

Yes.
http://www.rense.com/general57/nasa.htm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2qaZFC2PtM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4PkNPCEnJM
http://www.ufovideo.net/MARS.htm
http://www.projectmaji.com/index.html/_/articles/nasa/proof-nasa-photoshops-images-r18

I could link forever...

@Lou

I only checked the last one there, but would you believe the "proof" actually has higher resolution than the original image he links to? He's zoomed and blurred before putting on his website. Probably using Photoshop.

What does that tell you?

If you take a picture with a film camera and send it to processing, they will do color correction before printing unless you explicitly tell them not to. These days it'll be done in Photoshop.

Does that make your holiday fake?

I've seen printed versions (think baseball cards with astronomy) of either that picture or this from WELL before the computer era (my uncle used to collect them).

Now I looked through link number one as well, and I question this:
Quote:

Image mosaics are made from square or rectangular areas, and do not have curved sides. This is a direct result of the image sensor active area in the camera.

Panoramic mosaics most usually have curved sides, as evidenced by mostly EVERY mosaic piece of that panoramic picture.

_________________
This weeks pet peeve:
Using "voltage" instead of "potential", which leads to inventing new words like "amperage" instead of "current" (I, measured in A) or possible "charge" (amperehours, Ah or Coulomb, C). Sometimes I don't even know what people mean.