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/  Forum Index
   /  MorphOS Hardware
      /  Powermac G5 port
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PosterThread
Spectre660 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 25-Dec-2012 18:30:02
#21 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 4-Jun-2005
Posts: 3918
From: Unknown

@SKOLMAN_MWS

Indeed impressive.

Quote:

SKOLMAN_MWS wrote:
@Spectre660

Test new Lame 3.99.5 on Mac mini G4 1.42 GHz

For MorphOS there is only old version LAME 3.98.4 (slower)

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Chain-Q 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 25-Dec-2012 19:04:17
#22 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 31-Jan-2005
Posts: 824
From: Budapest, Hungary

@Spectre660
I think the point of these benchmarks is not to show how fast a particular task is possible on the given computer, but to show how the computers perform compared to eachother, and for this, it's important to benchmark them with the same version of a given app.

I doubt that using a different LAME would change the order of computers in the LAME benchmark, or change the shown performance gaps between them drastically. (If all of them is re-benchmarked with the new faster LAME executable.)

But it's nice to know such a performance improvement is still possible when using LAME of course.

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itix 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 25-Dec-2012 19:07:37
#23 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Dec-2004
Posts: 3398
From: Freedom world

@pavlor

Indeed G4 performance is great and costs almost nothing.

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pavlor 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 25-Dec-2012 19:31:16
#24 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@itix

Quote:
Indeed G4 performance is great and costs almost nothing.


If I remember correctly, only last Power Mac G5 generation supports PCIe. I bet even SAM460 with its "weak" CPU could easily out-perform G4/G5 and R200/300 class GFX in Quake and other 3D games - assuming Warp3D drivers for R5000/6000 cards ever arrive (when it is done ).

Relatively fast and powerful CPU (like G4) is nice, but memory throughput (for video playback) and modern GFX (3D games) are also important.

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itix 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 25-Dec-2012 19:54:02
#25 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Dec-2004
Posts: 3398
From: Freedom world

@pavlor

It could but 3D drivers for those cards dont exist and if ever will they are discontinued already. Better wait when newer generation is available ;)

'Modern' 3D games (Quake) are already running faster than your monitor framerate is.

But yes MorphOS is being ported to Sam460 too. We have got plenty of hw to choose from.

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pavlor 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 25-Dec-2012 19:57:41
#26 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@itix

Quote:
Better wait when newer generation is available ;)


Or persistently use even older R200/R300.

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itix 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 25-Dec-2012 20:03:45
#27 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Dec-2004
Posts: 3398
From: Freedom world

@pavlor

R200 was good generation ;)

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olegil 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 25-Dec-2012 20:47:09
#28 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Aug-2003
Posts: 5895
From: Work

@pavlor

Not sure why you would have expected more than 40% gain from a 40% frequency increase, but it's obvious that in these tests, lame is CPU bound (probably fits whole chunk of data in a cache) and mplayer is bound by both CPU and memory bandwidth.

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pavlor 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 26-Dec-2012 8:53:10
#29 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@olegil

Quote:
Not sure why you would have expected more than 40% gain from a 40% frequency increase


???????

I don´t think my 68030 50 MHz is even nearly as fast as 68060 50 MHz.

As I wrote in my post 6, G5 2.3 GHz is as fast as both cores of PA6T 1.8 GHz (and also two G4 1.42 GHz) in Blender benchmark.

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KimmoK 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 26-Dec-2012 9:36:31
#30 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2003
Posts: 5211
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland

"Blender benchmark"

I seem to fail to search up the blender benchmark threads on AW.

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pavlor 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 26-Dec-2012 9:47:23
#31 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@KimmoK

Quote:
I seem to fail to search up the blender benchmark threads on AW.


eg.:

Blender Benchmark Time

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KimmoK 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 26-Dec-2012 11:47:09
#32 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2003
Posts: 5211
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland

@pavlor

ok, now also I found one of my summaries:
(my summarypost)

We need more testing with latest Blender versions, 2.62 (IIRC) gives signifficant boost on PPCs.

Last edited by KimmoK on 26-Dec-2012 at 12:05 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 26-Dec-2012 at 11:59 AM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 26-Dec-2012 at 11:48 AM.

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AP 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 26-Dec-2012 14:13:27
#33 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 31-Jul-2003
Posts: 617
From: Vienna/Austria

@KimmoK: Its always good to use a newer and faster version but (as Chain-Q said before) it doesn´t matter, if you compare AOS4/MOS-capable machines as long you use the same version on all machines.

I think we should also consider the early stage of the G5-port of MorphOS. I am sure that there is some room for optimizations.

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KimmoK 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 26-Dec-2012 19:33:26
#34 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2003
Posts: 5211
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland

@AP

But sometimes you need special version of application to take full use of new chip.

IIRC, G5 rendering performance rose about 100% with optimizations (multicore, using only supported instructions, etc.), when compare to unoptimized code (multiple single core CPUs, unsupported instructions in use etc.).

I believe PA6T can gain some speed from similar things that were done for G5 CPU, and from optimizations that use PA6T'own specialities. I doubt there is any PA6T optimized version of Blender anywhere yet, but there might be for G5 and surely is for G4.

So, we could use some test SW that does not use Altivec at all, or the same SW with altivec optimization, or the same with latest VMX optimizations, etc...

To compare CPUs, we should try to use all possible optimizations for all CPUs that are being compared.


But there are many ways to look at the issue. We could also use only singlecore using Blender that exist on Amigalikes, but it would not be true CPU comparisson, IMHO.

Last edited by KimmoK on 26-Dec-2012 at 07:37 PM.

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itix 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 26-Dec-2012 19:49:02
#35 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Dec-2004
Posts: 3398
From: Freedom world

@KimmoK

Quote:

I believe PA6T can gain some speed from similar things that were done for G5 CPU, and from optimizations that use PA6T'own specialities. I doubt there is any PA6T optimized version of Blender anywhere yet, but there might be for G5 and surely is for G4.


Are there online resources describing PA6T optimizations, quirks and issues? Can GCC even generate PA6T optimized code? Does PA6T need specific optimizations at all?

This is where PA6T is the biggest loser... its online documentation is scarce, in fact it doesnt exist. For G5 on the other hand you can find many online resources how to avoid illegal instructions, emulated instructions, microcoded instructions and so on.

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pavlor 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 26-Dec-2012 19:57:09
#36 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@itix

Quote:
For G5 on the other hand you can find many online resources how to avoid illegal instructions, emulated instructions, microcoded instructions and so on.


How much time need MorphOS Team to successfuly implement them is also question. Remember, they needed 2 years for PowerBook port (even without 3D and WiFi).

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itix 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 26-Dec-2012 20:41:23
#37 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Dec-2004
Posts: 3398
From: Freedom world

@pavlor

Tracking down components using missing (illegal) instructions in G5 is quite trivial (they are all logged). Finding components using slow microcoded instructions is not so easy but then it is just performance optimization. For example lame benchmark result is not extraordinary but G5 is already the fastest PowerPC Amiga out there. Perhaps AROS comparisons could motivate us...

Drivers are completely different thing. They have nothing to do with the processor architecture per se.

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Kronos 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 26-Dec-2012 21:15:17
#38 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 2553
From: Unknown

@itix

And whatever optimisations are needed for G5 support have probraly allready been in GCC for the past 7 years (or so).

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pavlor 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 26-Dec-2012 22:31:31
#39 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9578
From: Unknown

@itix

Quote:
G5 is already the fastest PowerPC Amiga out there.


PowerPC Mac. To be more precise.


Hopefuly, last Power Mac G5 generation (970MP, PCIe) and multiple CPU cores will be supported in future by MorphOS. That would be much more important step forward.

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itix 
Re: Powermac G5 port
Posted on 26-Dec-2012 22:54:02
#40 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Dec-2004
Posts: 3398
From: Freedom world

@pavlor

If it runs MorphOS then it will be amiga too.

I dont see point in multicore support currently. AROS doesnt have it either and amiga programs dont scale well... But essentially amiga api is not at that level.

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