Surely this will cause the end of the dedicated hardware and a waste piracy of the os then no advantages

@cdimauro
All we need is a Updated janusuae based on newer winuae and you can Run os 4 stuff site by Site on aros and it is customchip compatible. So you can Run all 68k Apps and not just rtg based stuff.

Aros wins the Race ; )

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@ilbarbax
I don't think so . I am working on several enhancements for amigaos3.x called AmigaNX.
Also we add drm and online validation. A emulated amiga is just another Target. I welcome emulation.

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Quote:

ilbarbax wrote: Surely this will cause the end of the dedicated hardware

I don't think so, but at least now someone which wants to play with AmigaOS4.1 have a chance to do so without spending a lot of money.

Currently PowerPCs are:
- too much expensive (for what you get)
- lacking good performance
- dedicated systems (you can only run some stuff there: OS4, Linux, and MorphOS for some)
- desktop-only systems: no netbook, notebook, ultrabook, and of course not even tablets or... smartphones! Only MorphOS runs on some (old) laptops.

Last but not least, developers can find WinUAE with PowerPC support useful for developing (easily sharing resources with the host system, multiple configurations usable/testable).
Quote:

and a waste piracy of the os then no advantages

Nobody stopped you to copy the AmigaOS4.1 CD, even before WinUAE supported PowerPC.

Also post-amigans spend a lot of money and support their favorite platform. Why they cannot continue to do the same?

The post-Amiga o.ses can only expand their user-base thanks to WinUAE.

Quote:

phoenixkonsole wrote: @cdimauro All we need is a Updated janusuae based on newer winuae and you can Run os 4 stuff site by Site on aros and it is customchip compatible. So you can Run all 68k Apps and not just rtg based stuff.

As I said, I better like the sandbox approach used by AROS, but it puts a sever limit on the 68K applications performance, since you need to emulate an entire Amiga system.

It's an unfair comparison with things like Petunia and Trance, since they don't need to do the same, and concentrate all the resources on 68K emulation/JITing.

It's more unfair if you consider that this way you need to emulate/JIT ONLY for the application code, whereas with JanusUAE you have to emulate/JIT the entire platform (all o.s. & libraries).

Anyway, I don't know how much important is emulating/JITing old 68K code. IIF it's really important, AROS can be changed to get similar performance improvements as OS4 and MorphOS give, but resources should be invested for this.
Quote:

Aros wins the Race ; )

Why would you need to run Amiga OS4.1 programs on AROS when people are going around for years preaching the incredible superiority of AROS? And that with Amiga OS4.1 you have nothing to do but move icons aoround because it's no programs at all while AROS is the most useful and a real OS?

Last edited by Nibunnoichi on 16-Aug-2014 at 09:22 AM.
Last edited by Nibunnoichi on 16-Aug-2014 at 09:21 AM.
Last edited by Nibunnoichi on 16-Aug-2014 at 09:20 AM.

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@Nibunnoichi

Who talked about running Amiga OS4.1 programs on AROS?

Maybe you need some good glasses...

@cdimauro

Quote:

Who talked about running Amiga OS4.1 programs on AROS?

phoenixkonsole in post 122?

Yeah it was me : )

Last edited by phoenixkonsole on 16-Aug-2014 at 09:52 AM.

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AROS Broadway - AEROS - Aminux - AmiCloud - indieGO! Appstore - AmiWallet - VAN lossless video codec - AMC Amiga media Center -KrypUnite - LibertyNet - MinX - amigaNX

@ilbarbax

I do not think so that it really harms AmigaOS and Hyperion and is the end of dedicated hardware. On 68k there are lots of emulators like WinUAE or FS-UAE and still people prefer the "real" hardware, the same will be happen with new FPGA based hardware in future, some people will use only emulation other only hardware and others a mixture of both. I see there no problem.

And emulation would solve the problem that starting with AmigaOS is extremely expensive and (what is worse) you cannot test it before you buy. And who wanted it at every price already has bought something from Acube or Aeon. So I think it is not destroying the market but extending it. Of course if emulation becomes much faster in future some of the slower hardware options become under pressure. On my own PC 68k emulation is faster than Sam 440 (with JIT) and newer PCs beat Sam 460 and it is certainly only a matter of time if most PPC hardware (except perhaps G5 or X1000/X5000) is beaten by emulation, the same could happen with PPC emulation too. So in a sense the competition with X86 that Hyperion wanted to avoid is finally here. But that is the world and we have 2014 now. And to go PPC instead of X86 always was a mistake in my view.

Last edited by OlafS25 on 16-Aug-2014 at 10:18 AM.

@Nibunnoichi

it is more important to have the last laugh

BTW to have a fair comparison take away all 68k stuff you use including all libraries and software then we can discuss again. Or compare it with my 68k environment (running faster than your 440)

Last edited by OlafS25 on 16-Aug-2014 at 10:30 AM.

@OlafS25

Quote:

(running faster than your 440)

Try Quake II benchmark.

@pavlor

I used LAME for it because there were lots of numbers around. Of course you can do a lot of other benchmarks.

@OlafS25

Quote:

BTW to have a fair comparison take away all 68k stuff you use including all libraries and software then we can discuss again.

Not 100% sure what you discussing in the context of the comment, but bear in mind that 68k written for AmigaOS is thus part of the AmigaOS repertoire, AmigaOS4 and AmigaOS3 are both AmigaOS. Backwards compatibility is not 100% but nor was for any other stage in the history of AmigaOS versions.

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@Olaf
My A1200 converts videos faster than my Core2Duo Macbook Pro : )
No joke.

Last edited by phoenixkonsole on 16-Aug-2014 at 10:56 AM.

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AROS Broadway - AEROS - Aminux - AmiCloud - indieGO! Appstore - AmiWallet - VAN lossless video codec - AMC Amiga media Center -KrypUnite - LibertyNet - MinX - amigaNX

@OlafS25

Quote:

I used LAME for it because there were lots of numbers around. Of course you can do a lot of other benchmarks.

That was silly joke from my side. SAM440 can use 3D accelleration on Radeon 9250/M9, it wouldn´t be fair comparison.

sorry double post.

Last edited by phoenixkonsole on 16-Aug-2014 at 11:06 AM.

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AROS Broadway - AEROS - Aminux - AmiCloud - indieGO! Appstore - AmiWallet - VAN lossless video codec - AMC Amiga media Center -KrypUnite - LibertyNet - MinX - amigaNX

@broadblues

I wrote this because on a different ISA you need everything native and cannot mix old libraries and new ones.

I expecially thought about f.e. Arexx where people use the original library or other third-party libraries. I do not know what parts of AmigaOS are native PPC and which still 68k.

@pavlor

I just made the cinema4D test on my PC

http://via.i-networx.de/bench.html

46s, of course not fair either

Last edited by OlafS25 on 16-Aug-2014 at 04:26 PM.

@pavlor

why do you not own any PPC hardware if it is all that good?

@OlafS25

Quote:

why do you not own any PPC hardware if it is all that good?

No portable solution.


I never wrote PowerPC is "all that good", I think port to x86 would be good idea. I pointed in my benchmark remark to some limitations of emulated enviroment (lack of proper support for GFX card features is one of them).