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   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  Hyperion Entertainment is not bankrupt
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PosterThread
Severin 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 16:49:02
#241 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 19-Aug-2003
Posts: 2715
From: Gloucestershire UK

@djrikki

I'm a 40+ and I'll talk how I want to so na na na-na NA

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Overflow 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 16:52:01
#242 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jun-2012
Posts: 1536
From: Norway

@djrikki

I dont wish bankruptcy on anyone, including Hyperion.

But the issue of unpaid 3rd parties was something I heard about several months ago, so this "newsflash" didnt come as a major suprise to me.

Its not about "naysaying" or anything. Financial problems cant be wished away, so its grounds for worry or joy, depending on your point of view.

Personally I hope debts are paid, developers continue to develop and people keep AOS as one of the "Amiga" OS options.

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eliyahu 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 17:00:30
#243 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2010
Posts: 1759
From: Waterbury, Connecticut (USA)

@Severin

gotta respectfully disagree there. i think that any bankruptcy proceeding, whatever the cause and whatever the outcome, is hugely important. yes, there are people trying to dance on a grave that hasn't even been dug, but given their loyalties, i'm not surprised. but it is important (IMO) to discuss this. the idea that a third-party is able to get the court to declare hyperion insolvent is concerning. and it's not something that should be ignored (again, IMO).

much of what the "trolls" are saying is not only correct, but it is important that it be said (IMO )

-- eliyahu

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jorit2 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 17:02:58
#244 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 22-Apr-2011
Posts: 234
From: Unknown

@djrikki

Quote:

djrikki wrote:
Thread is full of no-lifers and 40+ year olds that talk like 13yr olds.

How can anyone wish bankruptcy on anyone?


You may not wish bankruptcy on anyone.

But you may want a breakthrough in the current relationships between all the involved parties, or you might want some of the investors, past and current, to get a chance to recoup, or protect, in whatever shape, some of their investment. In this context, I see developers, investing time, as investors too. It's a little bigger than merely financial input

The ecosystem is bigger than Hyperion alone and all the interests are very much intertwined.

It does not take a rocket-scientist to see that everything is now deadlocked, with some unhealthy relationships as a result.

What appears to be a potential disaster now, does not need to be destructive, could very well be an opportunity, that everybody could benefit from.

Evert

Last edited by jorit2 on 15-Feb-2015 at 06:12 PM.
Last edited by jorit2 on 15-Feb-2015 at 05:09 PM.

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eliyahu 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 17:05:56
#245 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2010
Posts: 1759
From: Waterbury, Connecticut (USA)

@jorit2

Quote:
What appears to be a potential disaster now, does not need to be destructive, could very well be an opportunity, that everybody could benefit from.

could you walk us through that scenario? how could 'everyone benefit' from a bankruptcy proceeding? are you referring only to investors, or also to the future development of the amiga operating system?

-- eliyahu

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DocBrown 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 17:09:23
#246 ]
New Member
Joined: 24-Jan-2006
Posts: 6
From: Unknown

@cgutjahr
Quote:
According to section 25 of the 2009 agreement, the agreement "may not be assigned to any third party without the prior written consent of all Parties hereto" - which probably equals nontransferable in this case.

On p.5:

"Any transfer of the above licenses by Hyperion will be subject to the prior written
consent of the Amiga Parties, which consent will not be unreasonably withheld.
Consent by one Amiga Party shall be deemed consent by all Amiga Parties."

Emphasis added by me.

Sounds ok to me.

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OlafS25 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 17:13:04
#247 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 5300
From: Unknown

@eliyahu

I have found this:
http://www.lawyersbelgium.com/bankruptcy-procedure-in-belgium

from the page:
"The bankruptcy order must specify the date when the company ceased to make payments and include other information, such as: the supervising judge appointed for the case, the timeframe within which creditors must make their claims against the company and the dates at which the list of claims will be closed."

translation with google from the official site
Dutch Commercial Court of Brussels Opening of bankruptcy summons from: HYPERION ENTERTAINMENT (SCRL), Gentsesteenweg 1150, 1082 Sint-Agatha-Berchem. Reference: 20150049. bankruptcy Date: January 27, 2015. Commercial activity: computer programs. Company number: 0466.380.552 Curator: Mr. DEHANDSCHUTTER BERT Ninoofsesteenweg 643, 1070 BRUSSELS 7. Date of filing claims: to within the period of thirty days from the date of delivery of the judgment at the Registry of the English Commercial Court of Brussels , Boulevard de Waterloo 70, 1000 Brussels. Date for the filing of the first official report of verification of claims: March 4, 2015. The persons who personally certainly have made for the bankrupt (like for the people who have made a deposit) this can deposit a statement at the Registry (Art . 72bis and 72ter Fail.W.). Certified excerpt: The afg. Registrar, D. Snoek

so if understand it is right now the period where creditors can make their claims (till 30 days after 27.1.) and beginning with 4.3. court will continue when claims are verified.

of course I am no attorney just how it looks now

One thing I am not sure: "Date of filing claims: to within the period of thirty days from the date of delivery of the judgment at the Registry of the English Commercial Court of Brussels , Boulevard de Waterloo 70, 1000 Brussels."

Is that the 27.1. or another date?

Last edited by OlafS25 on 15-Feb-2015 at 05:25 PM.

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jorit2 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 17:16:09
#248 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 22-Apr-2011
Posts: 234
From: Unknown

@eliyahu

Quote:

eliyahu wrote:
@jorit2

Quote:
What appears to be a potential disaster now, does not need to be destructive, could very well be an opportunity, that everybody could benefit from.

could you walk us through that scenario? how could 'everyone benefit' from a bankruptcy proceeding? are you referring only to investors, or also to the future development of the amiga operating system?

-- eliyahu


"bankruptcy proceedings" does not equal "liquidation", at least not at this point. One of the duties of the curator (or Court appointed administrator whatever you may call him), well probably his main duty is to see if and how this business could proceed.
With liquidation, you will only have losers, nobody stands to gain from a liquidation, trying to have the company proceed is the preferred option.

With all the concerned parties around the table, it might lead to a shift in balance, power ... maybe ... and guess what, as a consequence thereof, maybe even a renewed incentive to invest.

Even you, as a customer, might benefit from such a scenario.

But: disclaimer: I am not involved in these proceedings, or talks, if they occur at all, nor do I want to influence them ... just wanted to introduce another point of view.

Evert

Last edited by jorit2 on 15-Feb-2015 at 05:36 PM.
Last edited by jorit2 on 15-Feb-2015 at 05:19 PM.
Last edited by jorit2 on 15-Feb-2015 at 05:18 PM.

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eliyahu 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 17:18:48
#249 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2010
Posts: 1759
From: Waterbury, Connecticut (USA)

@OlafS25

thanks for the background, olaf! it's very helpful.

-- eliyahu

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Severin 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 17:36:25
#250 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 19-Aug-2003
Posts: 2715
From: Gloucestershire UK

@eliyahu

Here's a quote from Ben:

Quote:
In Belgium anybody can file a bankruptcy claim even for 150 EUR or so. It
is a common pressure tactic used by parties who do not wish go to the usual
court process because most companies will pay rather than go through the
motions of fighting off a bankruptcy claim.

It is an abuse of procedure but in our case, matters came this far because
the company which handles our administrative seat did not hand over the
writ of summons in time for us to know about the claim.

We could easily have fended it off but now we need to overturn the judgment.

This was ofcourse not the intention of the claimant (quite the contrary)
but there you have it.


Hope that clears things up a little.

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OlafS25 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 17:40:35
#251 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 5300
From: Unknown

@Severin

Yes that was the start... but now the wave is rolling and (if I understand it right) more people can make claims if they can proof it

We will see it after 4.3.

Last edited by OlafS25 on 15-Feb-2015 at 05:53 PM.

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Signal 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 17:40:38
#252 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 1-Jun-2013
Posts: 619
From: USA

C'mon guys!

I've got 3 beers, 4 slices of garbage can pizza and a half jumbo bag of popcorn here.

Please post a little faster.....HUH?

And whats worng with those courts over there? Closed on Sunday......IDIOTS!

You don't want to make me login again.

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RobertJDohnert 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 17:50:05
#253 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 18-Jun-2013
Posts: 199
From: Raleigh NC

@eliyahu

A bankruptcy can be used to actually help a company. look at SGI, look at Blackberry. Both were in bankruptcy and both came out of it and while SGI is doing good in the super computing space (lets hold off a little more on Blackberry) These initial proceedings are a sign that whatever you are doing is not working and you need to steer the ship a little differently. But I give Ben Hermans this, the fact that he is fighting it and no just going silently in the night is a great display of fortitude.

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jorit2 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 18:39:53
#254 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 22-Apr-2011
Posts: 234
From: Unknown

@Severin

Quote:

Severin wrote:
@eliyahu

Here's a quote from Ben:

Quote:
In Belgium anybody can file a bankruptcy claim even for 150 EUR or so. It
is a common pressure tactic used by parties who do not wish go to the usual
court process because most companies will pay rather than go through the
motions of fighting off a bankruptcy claim.

It is an abuse of procedure but in our case, matters came this far because
the company which handles our administrative seat did not hand over the
writ of summons in time for us to know about the claim.

We could easily have fended it off but now we need to overturn the judgment.

This was ofcourse not the intention of the claimant (quite the contrary)
but there you have it.


Hope that clears things up a little.




It doesn't.
A lot of us have learned the hard way not to take anything that comes from Ben for granted ... well on the contrary.

The first sentence alone ...

"In Belgium anybody can file a bankruptcy claim even for 150 EUR or so"

Does "smoke and mirrors" ring a bell ?
You don't honestly believe it is as simple as this do you ?

Evert

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Deniil715 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 19:05:58
#255 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-May-2003
Posts: 4158
From: Sweden

@Signal

+1

I believe what hyperionmp says. It has always turned out to be true in the end. All you other sad dudes just want any reason to complain. You are probably sour from too much PC use.

/99.9% Amiga-user since 1992

Last edited by Deniil715 on 15-Feb-2015 at 08:35 PM.

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OlafS25 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 19:08:42
#256 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 5300
From: Unknown

@Deniil715

your wording speaks for yourself

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megol 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 19:21:04
#257 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 17-Mar-2008
Posts: 245
From: Unknown

@Deniil715

It's sad that the Amiga attracts so many weirdos that have a strong emotional attachment to a _name_ to the degree that it overrides all logical boundaries.

On the other hand it may well help those cope with their lives. Still irritating.

Believing a known liar ( even evident in material provided for a legal court by the same) is simply stupid even if backed by some pseduo-religious ideal.

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pavlor 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 19:23:19
#258 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 8782
From: Unknown

@megol

Quote:
Believing a known liar


Expert opinion?

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eliyahu 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 19:24:59
#259 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2010
Posts: 1759
From: Waterbury, Connecticut (USA)

@megol

you know, i am so sick of people telling me i like the amiga and AOS4 because of 'the name.' that's a load of ****. i couldn't care less what the name was -- i enjoy using it, and that's why i like it. end of story. the people who obsess about 'the name' are people who prefer other amiga-like systems and are angry because they don't have it. enough already.

"obviously, the reason they like AOS4 is because of the name, right? it couldn't be that they genuinely prefer it? oh, no, it couldn't be that...."



-- eliyahu

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TiredofLife 
Re: Hyperion Entertainment bankrupt?
Posted on 15-Feb-2015 20:52:42
#260 ]
Super Member
Joined: 6-Jul-2005
Posts: 1601
From: Here

@AOS4 Fans

The gigs up the show is over, so stop living in denial.
Stop wasting time posting in this forum and start getting your hardware in the classified ads section.
Obviously you will have to sell at rock bottom prices.

Quickly please, I've got work tomorrow and want to go through the ads before then.

Cheers

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