@number6

Quote:

Short promo for this Saturday: Part 2

Short, not much content but unlike many others: "On Topic"

@OneTimer1

Yep. I was beginning to wonder (no offense) if posters still knew what the topic was.

Anyway, Part 1 mentioned Peri's relationship with Sean Donahue and MyRetroComputer.
If you want to read something while we wait:

Brief history of the MyRetroComputer kickstarter campaign

#6

_________________
This posting, in its entirety, represents solely the perspective of the author.
*Secrecy has served us so well*

#6 Quote:

Yep. I was beginning to wonder (no offense) if posters still knew what the topic was. Anyway, Part 1 mentioned Peri's relationship with Sean Donahue and MyRetroComputer. If you want to read something while we wait: Brief history of the MyRetroComputer kickstarter campaign

I really do not understand the support and confidence from Amiga fans for Peri and Sean when their plan is most likely a Commodore Amiga A500X branded case using a x86-64 CPU with Linux.

Did We Buy Commodore? Reveal: 28 June
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/2ua2rScrBbg IanM-id8or Quote:

Cool. Can you get Amiga as well? RetroRecipes Quote: I'll address that on the 28th!

We explain Why the Kickstarter has been paused
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5H8GPAbRXk4 TerribleFire Quote:

Very sorry to see a bunch of people who are trying to steal the Commodore name do this to you guys. myretrocomputerltd5179 Quote: Aww thank you, it does feel like an adventure!🙂

I understand the Amiga sympathy for fighting "people who are trying to steal" retro IP as the Amiga has a much worse problem with aggressive IP squatters. While My Retro Computers Ltd Commodore Amiga branding would be legitimate, their x86-64 Linux computers would be less faithful than PPC AmigaNOne hardware which at least uses a native AmigaOS. The Commodore Amiga branded x86-64 hardware likely would have twice the performance for half the price compared to PPC AmigaNOne hardware and much better 68k Amiga virtual machine performance so maybe they can finally finish off the noncompetitive PPC AmigaNOne. PPC AmigaNOne abandoned the 68k and Amiga chipset to try to gain an advantage so I suppose it is fair to abandon the AmigaOS too to gain a larger advantage and end up back with competitive x86-64 commodity hardware. I just feel like the small footprint 68k Amiga is missing an opportunity with much cheaper hardware than the fat x86-64 commodity hardware. This is on the Amiga IP squatters and their absurd big lies though.

Ben's big lie #1.

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.wawd.256770/gov.uscourts.wawd.256770.7.0.pdf Quote:

58. However, the copyrightable content of Kickstart 1.3 is subsumed within the Software and Software Architecture to which the Settlement Agreement grants Hyperion an exclusive license (subject to the Existing License Agreements listed in Exhibit 1 of the Settlement Agreement). Specifically, each version of AmigaOS (which consists of two components, “Kickstart� and “Workbench�) has the same “Software Architecture� as documented in the Documentation and as defined in Definition o. of the Settlement Agreement to mean “the structure or structures of the system, which comprise software components (i.e., those assumptions other elements can make of an element, such as its provided services, performance characteristics, fault handling, shared resource usage, and so on), and the relationships between them; the term also refers to documentation of a system’s software architecture�.

Hyperion may only use AmigaOS 3.1 for AmigaOS 4 according to the 2009 settlement agreement with Amiga Inc and Cloanto has a copyright on earlier Kickstart versions. Ben argues that because they are all built on each other and are similar, they are indistinguishable from each other and Hyperion can use any of them, after they change the checkmark logo to a boing ball logo for the Kickstart and change the copyrights of the AmigaOS to Hyperion.

Ben's big lie #2.

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.wawd.256770/gov.uscourts.wawd.256770.7.0.pdf Quote:

59. Furthermore, consistent with Hyperion’s license to Software expressly conferred by the Settlement Agreement, Hyperion’s license permits it “to use, develop, modify, commercialize, distribute and market the Software . . . for any current or future hardware platform.� As admitted by Cloanto, certain hardware platforms require the Kickstart 1.3 content in order to run the software.

The Software is defined specifically as AmigaOS 3.1 in the settlement agreement. Kickstart 1.3 is not needed "in order to run the" Software defined as AmigaOS 3.1. However, Ben's last use of "software" is not capitalized because Hyperion wants to run all Amiga software.

Ben's big lie #3.

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.wawd.256770/gov.uscourts.wawd.256770.7.0.pdf Quote:

61. Hyperion’s exclusive license to use the marks AmigaOS, Amiga OS, AmigaOne, and Amiga One necessarily and inherently confers an implied license to use the mark AMIGA, which is the dominant portion of all of the foregoing marks. 62. Nowhere does the Settlement Agreement prohibit Hyperion from using AMIGA alone, yet the Settlement Agreement expressly reserves the right for the Amiga Parties to “use the mark ‘AMIGA’ alone or in conjunction with other words, so long as ‘OS’ or ‘One’ does not directly follow the word “’AMIGA.’� The perceived need to carve out this right for the Amiga Parties from the exclusive license granted to Hyperion evinces that a non-exclusive right in the same also remained for Hyperion under the Settlement Agreement.

Hyperion's license for "AmigaOS, Amiga OS, AmigaOne, and Amiga One" gives it the right to use "Amiga" alone too, according to Ben. Amiga Inc was using "Amiga" itself. The "Amiga" brand was the primary, and perhaps only reason, Amiga Inc acquired the Amiga IP as AmigaDE (Amiga NOwhere) did not use the 68k, the Amiga chipset or the AmigaOS. The whole idea of "AmigaOne" is that it is not "Amiga" which was acquired specifically for Amiga Inc use. The "carve out this right for the Amiga Parties" claim is just as absurd as if the "Amiga" owner carving out the use of "Amiga" for themselves is somehow unfair to the licensee. Hyperion acts like they are the owner licensing to Amiga Inc.

I am just as frustrated with the blatant retro IP stealing as Stephen. It is insulting to intelligent people and the corruption scares away investment and legitimate projects like the RGL A1200 Maxi. But that is the intention of these IP squatters who are protecting their market "carve out". Peri says he thinks he can fix the Amiga disputes and maybe the Commodore Amiga A500X would finish off the PPC AmigaNOne before the lawsuits finish off Hyperion. The RGL A1200 Maxi may have finished off the A600GS and A1200NG too which is why they needed to block it. The writing is on the wall for the Hyperion A-EonKit syndicate of IP squatters though.

Last edited by matthey on 26-Jun-2025 at 06:46 AM.

@matthey

Quote:

I really do not understand the support and confidence from Amiga fans for Peri and Sean when their plan is most likely a Commodore Amiga A500X branded case using a x86-64 CPU with Linux.

The original Los Gatos Amiga team selected off-the-shelf 68000 as one of the best CPU families with a 32-bit roadmap in 1983. The original Los Gatos Amiga team was NOT in the CPU design business.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xICmtimRX-0
"I Am The Commodore Amiga 500" advert,
I am 512 thousand bytes of pure power expandable to one full megabyte of internal memory, I am the mighty Motorola 68000 microprocessor

For its time, Commodore advertised the A500's 68000 as a "mighty" CPU solution. 68000 with a custom MMU was used in Unix workstations before the 68020's 1984 release. Apple Lisa/Macintosh XL (1983)'s 68000 + custom MMU runs MS Xenix 68K.

In 1987, Macintosh II replaced Macintosh XL. Macintosh II A/UX comes with Apple's Unix implementation.

For the current generation of gamers' price range, X86-64 v4 has "pure power" and "mighty" microprocessor.

Intel offered Sony, Intel's PS6 alternative in the final bidding competition, and Intel lost the final bid to AMD.

https://videocardz.com/newz/intel-has-amd-strix-halo-competitor-in-the-works-but-it-wont-be-available-soon
Intel is working on AMD Strix Halo's counterpart i.e. PC's 2nd large-scale APU family.

Thanks to the fruit company, the PC is evolving to include large-scale APUs.

--------------------------------
Linux can be Valve's SteamOS 3.x or Google's Android / ChromeOS.

Nintendo Switch (ARMv8) system software contains components that are based on FreeBSD and Android.

Sony PlayStation 5 (X86-64 v3)'s Orbis 2.0 OS uses a forked FreeBSD 11.


Quote:

I just feel like the small footprint 68k Amiga is missing an opportunity with much cheaper hardware than the fat x86-64 commodity hardware. This is on the Amiga IP squatters and their absurd big lies though. .

Again, the original Los Gatos Amiga team selected off-the-shelf 68000 as one of the best CPU families with a 32-bit roadmap in 1983. The original Los Gatos Amiga team was NOT in the CPU design business.

Amiga IP doesn't include Motorola's 68K IP.

Last edited by Hammer on 26-Jun-2025 at 12:27 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 26-Jun-2025 at 12:25 PM.

_________________

@thread

The patreon that I had been exchanging information with indicated he might be able to mention a bit prior to the release of the Part 2 video on Saturday.

Indeed he did

btw-The patreon release of Part 2 was scheduled for today (Thursday)

#6

_________________
This posting, in its entirety, represents solely the perspective of the author.
*Secrecy has served us so well*

@thread

Part 2 of the video released to the patreons.

Further comment by same. See link in prior post.

#6

_________________
This posting, in its entirety, represents solely the perspective of the author.
*Secrecy has served us so well*

Hammer Quote:

The original Los Gatos Amiga team selected off-the-shelf 68000 as one of the best CPU families with a 32-bit roadmap in 1983. The original Los Gatos Amiga team was NOT in the CPU design business.

Jay Miner left Atari when they did not pay bonuses and refused to let him design a new 68000 based computer/console. Jay Miner joined Hi-Toro when they agreed to let him design the 68000 based computer/console he wanted at Atari. The two requirements for Jay were the 68000 and that the chipset could be used for a computer and not just a console. Without using the 68000, Jay likely would not have joined the team greatly reducing the chances of success. Without computer support, the console likely would have died with the 1983 video game crash.

Commodity hardware was used where possible back then. The original Atari VCS/2600 had one custom chip, the TIA chip. The Atari ANTIC, CTIA/GTIA and POKEY chips were upgrades and started to use programmable processors. The Amiga custom chips were the upgraded versions of these chips also with programmable processors, the copper and blitter. They were used for specialized purposes but this was expanded like the added line draw feature added in late. Adding carry would have turned the blitter into a DSP performing arithmetic according to Ron Nicholson. More features could have supported chunky and better 3D polygon rendering. Should the team have been designing general purpose CPUs when the 68k was a practically perfect choice for the Amiga, judging by Jay Miner's insistence on the 68k, or should they have been working on improving the custom chips?

Hammer Quote:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xICmtimRX-0 "I Am The Commodore Amiga 500" advert, I am 512 thousand bytes of pure power expandable to one full megabyte of internal memory, I am the mighty Motorola 68000 microprocessor For its time, Commodore advertised the A500's 68000 as a "mighty" CPU solution. 68000 with a custom MMU was used in Unix workstations before the 68020's 1984 release. Apple Lisa/Macintosh XL (1983)'s 68000 + custom MMU runs MS Xenix 68K.

The 6 year old 68000 was still a mighty MPU for the price when the Amiga was released in 1985. One of the most important features was the large flat 32-bit address space allowing for more memory than x86 segmented memory. Intel released the i386 with a large flat 32-bit address space after the Amiga was released.

Hammer Quote:

For the current generation of gamers' price range, X86-64 v4 has "pure power" and "mighty" microprocessor.

Sure, but would you rather have a Commodore and/or Amiga label on x86-64 hardware or more performance? Would some Commodore/Amiga fans prefer to have cheaper, more elegant and more compatible 68k Amiga hardware with a Commodore/Amiga label?

Hammer Quote:

Linux can be Valve's SteamOS 3.x or Google's Android / ChromeOS. Nintendo Switch (ARMv8) system software contains components that are based on FreeBSD and Android. Sony PlayStation 5 (X86-64 v3)'s Orbis 2.0 OS uses a forked FreeBSD 11.

Most of the 600-1000 Linux distros, ~40 BSD distros and ~40 Android distros can be used on standard x86-64 hardware. It is even possible to use a compatibility layer to gain the benefit of a standard Windows OS with standard x86-64 hardware. There is a lot of bloat, baggage and expense to finally arrive at a standard OS and hardware like the 68k Amiga had in 1985 using much simpler hardware with a much smaller memory footprint that should be much cheaper to mass produce. Amiga division started after Commodore and Amiga lost its standards, unification and economies of scale. Throwing everything originally Amiga out the door to gain compatibility with the Windows x86-64 standard is one solution to improve Amiga standardization again but it is not the cheapest solution and will not unify the divided Amiga market.

Hammer Quote:

Again, the original Los Gatos Amiga team selected off-the-shelf 68000 as one of the best CPU families with a 32-bit roadmap in 1983. The original Los Gatos Amiga team was NOT in the CPU design business.

This thread is about buying Commodore and they were "in the CPU design business".

Hammer Quote:

Amiga IP doesn't include Motorola's 68K IP.

Amiga IP could have, may have and should have included Motorola 68k IP. The Commodore plan for a 68k Amiga SoC included licensed 68k cores. The 68k SoC would have reduced the cost by $100 of now 28MHz or 57MHz Amiga 1200 and CD32+ Amigas according to internal Commodore documentation. Do you understand how much difference a 68k SoC would have made in Commodore's survival chances?

#6 Quote:

The patreon that I had been exchanging information with indicated he might be able to mention a bit prior to the release of the Part 2 video on Saturday. Indeed he did btw-The patreon release of Part 2 was scheduled for today (Thursday)

If the patreon supporter thinks the news is, "Wow! The news is good. Very good. Better than anyone expected or predicted! 🥳", then they must have achieved what they were after which is most likely the successful purchase of Commodore. What remains to be seen is how the Amiga ties into this.

@matthey

Quote:

matthey wrote: Hammer Quote: The original Los Gatos Amiga team selected off-the-shelf 68000 as one of the best CPU families with a 32-bit roadmap in 1983. The original Los Gatos Amiga team was NOT in the CPU design business. Jay Miner left Atari when they did not pay bonuses and refused to let him design a new 68000 based computer/console. Jay Miner joined Hi-Toro when they agreed to let him design the 68000 based computer/console he wanted at Atari. The two requirements for Jay were the 68000 and that the chipset could be used for a computer and not just a console. Without using the 68000, Jay likely would not have joined the team greatly reducing the chances of success. Without computer support, the console likely would have died with the 1983 video game crash.

Very likely.
Quote:

Commodity hardware was used where possible back then. The original Atari VCS/2600 had one custom chip, the TIA chip. The Atari ANTIC, CTIA/GTIA and POKEY chips were upgrades and started to use programmable processors. The Amiga custom chips were the upgraded versions of these chips also with programmable processors, the copper and blitter. They were used for specialized purposes but this was expanded like the added line draw feature added in late. Adding carry would have turned the blitter into a DSP performing arithmetic according to Ron Nicholson. More features could have supported chunky and better 3D polygon rendering.

Exactly. That's something which many people don't get, because they don't really understand the very true nature of the Amiga chipset, and aren't able to expand their (very limited) view to go further ahead and modernize / expand it according to the new needs, in a perfectly coherent manner.

For this reason, either they say to abandon the chipset because it can't be updated (SIC!) or they propose completely dumb solutions, like adding a DSP to "solve" (SIGH!!!) problems that can be have much easier and perfectly native solutions to the new problem / needs. Akiko for the packed / chunky pixels and the DSP for 3D games are typical examples of the complete ineptitude of such persons.

Yesterday I've wondered why ThoR (with whom I usually share a lot of ideas / positions on several arguments) expressed something similar. It was ok when he cited some problems when using packed/chunky pixels (sprite vs background collisions is tricky. Fill mode is definitely not possible), but the rest... isn't like that. Especially when he mentioned the Blitter's line mode, which should be possible and it's better to use some other components (new packed/chunky Blitter).

Well, the primary problem here is that when people think at the Blitter, they see it as a "planar (graphics) device", instead of what he really is: a work-based (16-bit at the time) component that fetches up to 3 16-bit at the time, use two barrel-shifters for the first two inputs, combine those inputs applying some logic (here it's binary / single bit logic, of course) and then produces a 16-bit word to be written in memory. The Blitter has certain SOME logic which works only on bits (the minterms, the fill mode), but this aside is a word-processor (!!!): it works by manipulating 16-bit values.

If people change the perspective from bitplanes to word-based, then they might be able to understand how it really works, hence how it can evolve. The line mode, for example, is almost able to work in packed/chunky mode: it only needs A FEW transistors to support it, because it has already embedded all that it needs to draw lines in this "new mode". In fact, with very minimal changes, the Blitter is able to draw one packed/chunky pixel every 8 cycles instead of just one bit/pixel (per bitplane) every 8 cycles, reaching almost 1MPixel/s. And you can add texture mapping to the lines for another bunch of transistors, which enables it to support 3D games in a way more efficient AND much faster way compared to PCs and any DSP.

And this is just an example. I've written 17 articles to explain and PROVE how an Amiga could have worked with packed/chunky pixels with minimal changes and a few transistors (the only sensible exception is the fill mode. But I've provided a solution for an hybrid mode which is quite efficient), and several other articles on how to perfecly embed packed/chunky modes on the existing "planar" display controller, as well as many other things (more audio channels, more sprites, etc. etc.).

But people still continue to talk of thing that they have no clue, because they aren't able to understand how the chipset of our beloved machines really worked in its intimacy. Bah...
Quote:

Should the team have been designing general purpose CPUs when the 68k was a practically perfect choice for the Amiga, judging by Jay Miner's insistence on the 68k, or should they have been working on improving the custom chips?

Those should be rhetoric questions...
Quote:

Hammer Quote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xICmtimRX-0 "I Am The Commodore Amiga 500" advert, I am 512 thousand bytes of pure power expandable to one full megabyte of internal memory, I am the mighty Motorola 68000 microprocessor For its time, Commodore advertised the A500's 68000 as a "mighty" CPU solution. 68000 with a custom MMU was used in Unix workstations before the 68020's 1984 release. Apple Lisa/Macintosh XL (1983)'s 68000 + custom MMU runs MS Xenix 68K. The 6 year old 68000 was still a mighty MPU for the price when the Amiga was released in 1985. One of the most important features was the large flat 32-bit address space allowing for more memory than x86 segmented memory. Intel released the i386 with a large flat 32-bit address space after the Amiga was released. Hammer Quote: For the current generation of gamers' price range, X86-64 v4 has "pure power" and "mighty" microprocessor. Sure, but would you rather have a Commodore and/or Amiga label on x86-64 hardware or more performance? Would some Commodore/Amiga fans prefer to have cheaper, more elegant and more compatible 68k Amiga hardware with a Commodore/Amiga label? Hammer Quote: Linux can be Valve's SteamOS 3.x or Google's Android / ChromeOS. Nintendo Switch (ARMv8) system software contains components that are based on FreeBSD and Android. Sony PlayStation 5 (X86-64 v3)'s Orbis 2.0 OS uses a forked FreeBSD 11. Most of the 600-1000 Linux distros, ~40 BSD distros and ~40 Android distros can be used on standard x86-64 hardware. It is even possible to use a compatibility layer to gain the benefit of a standard Windows OS with standard x86-64 hardware. There is a lot of bloat, baggage and expense to finally arrive at a standard OS and hardware like the 68k Amiga had in 1985 using much simpler hardware with a much smaller memory footprint that should be much cheaper to mass produce. Amiga division started after Commodore and Amiga lost its standards, unification and economies of scale. Throwing everything originally Amiga out the door to gain compatibility with the Windows x86-64 standard is one solution to improve Amiga standardization again but it is not the cheapest solution and will not unify the divided Amiga market. Hammer Quote: Again, the original Los Gatos Amiga team selected off-the-shelf 68000 as one of the best CPU families with a 32-bit roadmap in 1983. The original Los Gatos Amiga team was NOT in the CPU design business. This thread is about buying Commodore and they were "in the CPU design business". Hammer Quote: Amiga IP doesn't include Motorola's 68K IP. Amiga IP could have, may have and should have included Motorola 68k IP. The Commodore plan for a 68k Amiga SoC included licensed 68k cores. The 68k SoC would have reduced the cost by $100 of now 28MHz or 57MHz Amiga 1200 and CD32+ Amigas according to internal Commodore documentation. Do you understand how much difference a 68k SoC would have made in Commodore's survival chances?

Quote:

matthey wrote: #6 Quote: The patreon that I had been exchanging information with indicated he might be able to mention a bit prior to the release of the Part 2 video on Saturday. Indeed he did btw-The patreon release of Part 2 was scheduled for today (Thursday) If the patreon supporter thinks the news is, "Wow! The news is good. Very good. Better than anyone expected or predicted! 🥳", then they must have achieved what they were after which is most likely the successful purchase of Commodore. What remains to be seen is how the Amiga ties into this.

Let's put it simple (that's the reason why I haven't replied to the other parts): if I want to have a PC which is able to execute Amiga applications & games, I already have it, and I don't need one with just The Name applied on a PC...

@number6

So the "Kickstarter" is just about a new "COMMODORE® 64x" ?

Well I'm not very attracted to this product but from a 'What makes Commodore devices attractive?" perspective I would like it much more than a mobile phone. Both products are so different they could exist in this universe and not competing with each other.

All this fuzz is just about C= brand names, it would be nice if Peri could get it cheap but I wouldn't be surprised, if some is showing up and ruins it.

Last edited by OneTimer1 on 27-Jun-2025 at 07:56 AM.
Last edited by OneTimer1 on 27-Jun-2025 at 07:06 AM.

@matthey

Quote:

Jay Miner left Atari when they did not pay bonuses and refused to let him design a new 68000 based computer/console. Jay Miner joined Hi-Toro when they agreed to let him design the 68000 based computer/console he wanted at Atari.

1. Jay Miner was one of the co-founders of the Hi-Toro company, later renamed to Amiga Corporation. Jay Miner (circuit designer) and David Morse (business marketing background) co-founded the Hi-Toro company. Both recognised each other's strengths and created a partnership.

2. Jay Miner selected an off-the-shelf 68000 from Motorola.

Quote:

The 6 year old 68000 was still a mighty MPU for the price when the Amiga was released in 1985. One of the most important features was the large flat 32-bit address space allowing for more memory than x86 segmented memory. Intel released the i386 with a large flat 32-bit address space after the Amiga was released.

Amiga Lorrine (breadboards) was functional in 1984. CSG converted the original Amiga team's breadboards into ASICs, and CSG fabricated them. CSG acted like a TSMC-like role.
Sanyo (Panasonic) VCR factory has the final assembly for the A1000.

One of 3DO's factory partners is Panasonic / Sanyo.

Quote:

Sure, but would you rather have a Commodore and/or Amiga label on x86-64 hardware or more performance? Would some Commodore/Amiga fans prefer to have cheaper, more elegant and more compatible 68k Amiga hardware with a Commodore/Amiga label?

Due to Amiga's legacy software issues, Commodore-Amiga Inc.'s post-68K selection was big-endian capable RISC options. A1200 SoC is for Amiga legacy games since Amiga Hombre's PA-RISC CPU selection wasn't powerful enough to emulate A1200.

Major video game platforms can mitigate the "chicken vs egg" issue with competitive 1st party game releases, hence they can survive CPU ISA change.

Sony switched from MIPS to PPC64 to X86-64 AVX. With PPC64, the fat PS3 has a PS2 SoC.

Nintendo handheld switched from Z80 clone (Sharp SM83) to ARM. Game Boy Advance has both Sharp SM83 and ARM7. Nintendo DS has only ARM.
Nintendo desktop switched from 65K clone to PPC32 to ARM. Combined with an ARM-based handheld desktop hybrid.

Microsoft's Xbox switched from IA-32 to PPC64 to X86-64 AVX. Cutting-edge software emulation method with Xbox One (X86-64 AVX) emulating Xbox 360 (PPC64).

----------------------
Gaming PC's transition from DOS to Windows occurred when Windows' game library reached a point that it could replace DOS games.

ARMv8 can support 68K's big endian.

HPE replaced big-endian PA-RISC/Itanium servers with ARM Neoverse servers e.g. HPE ProLiant RL300 Gen11 with Ampere Altra Max (ARM Neoverse). Itanium supports big-endian and little-endian.

Quote:

This thread is about buying Commodore and they were "in the CPU design business".

Buying "Commodore" is not buying Commodore-Amiga Inc (Amiga Inc, Amiga Corporation).

In 1991, C65's limited production run was cancelled by Bill Sydnes, hence it ended CSG's independent 65xx family CPU's slow development. Key CSG LSI and C= Amiga Inc's system engineers joined SGI, AMD, and 3DO.

Before Bill Sydnes, CSG's independent 65xx family CPU road map was a nearly dead end. For the C65 project, CSG refuses to work with 65816's Bill Mensch.

Amiga-Hombre's PA-RISC is licensed with a cache structure similar to Hitachi PA/50. Amiga-Hombre's approach is similar to PlayStation 1's LSI Coreware MIPS semi-custom path.

The optional A1200 SoC plan is just a Motorola 68020 license with C= Amiga's AA chipset IP, a copy-and-paste job. This is like legacy PS2 SoC inside fat PS3, where the road map is not MIPS. Amiga Hombre considers the A1200 SoC a legacy dead-end road map.

From
https://archive.org/details/Hombre_201808/Hombre_Presentation_part_1/page/n19/mode/2up
Amiga Hombre is mostly semi-custom PA-RISC with 3D and legacy ejected AAA display/audio IP.

Without A1200 SoC, Amiga Hombre will run Amiga 68K software legacy so long as they are OS legal i.e. no different from AmigaOS 4.1 FE PPC approach, but with "cheap" RISC offerings instead of Motorola.

Not including the Amiga, post-16-bit mainstream game consoles don't include Motorola's full 32-bit 68K or PPC. IBM continued with PPC for game consoles up to the PowerPC A2 era, which is PPE's successor.

Minstream game consoles are the 1st segment that kicked Motorola out, followed by smart handhelds and by the desktop market segments.

NXP's embedded market doesn't seem to lower the asking price for the T1042 SoC e.g. 150 euros.

Last edited by Hammer on 27-Jun-2025 at 07:30 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 27-Jun-2025 at 06:55 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 27-Jun-2025 at 06:51 AM.

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@OneTimer1

Is it possible you misinterpreted my post about MyRetroComputer?

It was simply their history. Peri stated in Part 1 that this got him involved.

What I posted is not in -any- way to limit what Peri is doing to the specific activities of MyRetroComputer. The scope of Peri's project is obviously much more extensive.

#6

_________________
This posting, in its entirety, represents solely the perspective of the author.
*Secrecy has served us so well*

@matthey

Quote:

Most of the 600-1000 Linux distros, ~40 BSD distros and ~40 Android distros can be used on standard x86-64 hardware. It is even possible to use a compatibility layer to gain the benefit of a standard Windows OS with standard x86-64 hardware.

For running mainstream PC games on Linux, many distros adhere to Valve's Steam store's Windows-compatible Proton / DXVK ecosystem i.e. it's Windows DirectX compatible platform target.

Many Steam store users use SteamOS 3.x fork distros. SteamOS 3.x is the de facto standard for Linux PC gaming. Valve's certificate is recognised by many anti-cheat/anti-tamper/DRM PC games middleware. Valve did the hard work of establishing relationships with the DRM PC games middleware providers. That's Valve's Proton with Valve's certificate. Valve owns this certificate.

For an AMD CPU (or Intel equivalent) and AMD RDNA GPU combination, the Steam Deck's SteamOS 3.7 default distribution would do the job. Other SteamOS 3.x fork distros focus on improved NVIDIA CUDA and Intel ARC GPU support.

Other Linux distros that don't adhere to Valve's SteamOS 3.x standard are meaningless to most Linux PC gamers.

Valve's SteamOS 3.x standard is the other "800-pound gorilla" with several multi-billion-dollar revenues.

Last edited by Hammer on 27-Jun-2025 at 02:07 PM.

_________________

@Hammer

Quote:

Without A1200 SoC, Amiga Hombre will run Amiga 68K software legacy so long as they are OS legal i.e. no different from AmigaOS 4.1 FE PPC approach, but with "cheap" RISC offerings instead of Motorola.

Exactly. If Commodore will survive few years more, next Amiga will be like Amiga One but with PA-RISC instead of ppc.
In 1995 Amiga Tech switch to ppc simply beacuse it was avaible and cheaper.

@ppcamiga1

Quote:

ppcamiga1 wrote: @Hammer Exactly. If Commodore will survive few years more, next Amiga will be like Amiga One but with PA-RISC instead of ppc. In 1995 Amiga Tech switch to ppc simply beacuse it was avaible and cheaper.

Nope, the PPC switch is due to the Phase 5 connection with Pedro's Amiga Technologies GmBH.

IBM's low-cost PPC 602 was available for 3DO M2. This is not a Motorola PPC solution. 3DO M2 has two IBM PPC 602 CPUs. IBM PPC 602 was the precursor to IBM PPE.

Any PPC based Commodore Amiga DVD-3D would be based on IBM's low-cost PPC 602, since 3DO M2 has two PPC 602 CPUs. PPC 602 has a functional FP32-only FPU for a 3D games use case. Two FP32 units from two low-cost PPC 602 are not bad for their time.

Amiga Hombre's PA-RISC uses custom SIMD extensions for the 3D games use case. The desktop model has an extra Hitachi PA/50 CPU.

Phase 5's hardware wasn't as cheap as C= A500 / A1200 / 3DO's price range. Again, the Amiga is not a Mac.

In modern times, PS5's Zen 2 CPU is a compact version with an FPU pipeline missing. Aiming for the A500 price range needs certain cuts.

Last edited by Hammer on 27-Jun-2025 at 04:40 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 27-Jun-2025 at 04:31 PM.

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@Hammer

You don't accept reality. It happend 30 years ago.
Amiga Technologies switch from expensive to develop custom risc to off the shelf ppc.

@ppcamiga1

That's a pretty rich lecturing, given that 30 years later you still didn't manage to express your thoughts clearly in plain English, pretty much at the time was off the shelf...

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The Illusion of Choice | Am*ga

@matthey

Quote:

If the patreon supporter thinks the news is, "Wow! The news is good. Very good. Better than anyone expected or predicted! 🥳", then they must have achieved what they were after which is most likely the successful purchase of Commodore.

You are getting very good at this research thingy. heh.

#6

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This posting, in its entirety, represents solely the perspective of the author.
*Secrecy has served us so well*

#6 Quote:

You are getting very good at this research thingy. heh.

Is the cat out of the bag yet or is the new CEO Christian "Peri" Simpson expecting this to remain a secret until his video tomorrow? Is ppcamiga1 the only one on this forum celebrating? Will he finally have his dream of an "official" Commodore Amiga computer with 32-bit PPC MorphOS using MUI on top of Linux?

@matthey

Strictly out of professional courtesy I checked with the patreon. It seemed the early preview of "some" information was meant to be promotional to encourage those to watch Peri's video Part 2.
I just wanted to be sure it was ok with him before cross-posting:

Lemon64 from today

The posts from the patreon should be obvious.

Take care,

#6

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This posting, in its entirety, represents solely the perspective of the author.
*Secrecy has served us so well*