@minator

Quote:

I think this is a great idea, it brings the possibility of bring the PPC users back to a single hardware platform.

I think that’s a bit over optimistic outlook on this. First of all not everyone can plug in pistrom, you have vampire users, and there is lot older FPGA hardware without a 680x0 socket, or expiation slot. When it comes to PPC emulation, its just WinUAE I believe that has PowerPC accelerator emulation support.

The second rezone I think its over optimistic, is because PowerPC users are split between MorphOS, AmigaOS4 and WarpOS,

There at least 3 or 4 different WarpOS emulator layers for AmigaOS4.x i believe, one I believe was written by Hyperion, one by someone called Guru mediation, then there was rewarp project, and there is one in the Enchantment package.

AmigaOS4 and MorphOS is most likely the operating systems that is easiest to support by porting games to, and WarpOS being legacy OS that everything supports kind of maybe. (So what ever gets ported to WarpOS, will already be support)

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 31-Oct-2025 at 07:28 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 31-Oct-2025 at 07:27 PM.

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@OlafS25

Quote:

OlafS25 wrote: @bhabbott Michal wants that WarpUP software works on it. Does it really make sense on a commercial scale? No. It is simply because he wants to do it. His time, his decision.

I have no problem with that, as I said. I just don't think it will benefit all Amiga fans.

The argument that it will result in more Amiga games becuse they will be easier to port is wrong. It actually means that games which might been ported to real Amigas won't be. Many Amiga fans won't be able to run these PPC ports on their machines, and some of those who can 'upgrade' to a PiStorm won't want to (me for example. I'm not going to replace the Blizzard 1230-IV in my A1200 with a PiStorm just to play Baldur's gate).

@bhabbott

Nor would I. I would do it for the RTG alone, let alone wifi

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@bhabbott

Quote:

I have no problem with that, as I said. I just don't think it will benefit all Amiga fans.

True it will absolutely not benefit all Amiga fans.
But since when was that something that the community cared about?

It was not that long ago that OS4 proponents gloated about how some OS4 software would never work on MOS, and MOS proponents gloated about their software never being available to OS4.


This is what all of you wanted.
Oh, wait, no, now there is suddenly another flavor of amiga that is superior to your flavor and has greater interest, enthusiasm and uptake.
So now "let's not fracture the community"/

Lol, you wanted this. You got it. You want the next wave of software to run on your computer? you better buy a PiStorm.

@bhabbott

not all will benefit for sure

both apollo and pistorm have the problem that they offer advanced features but no software using it except some ports from PC

And that lack of unique software was rightful critisized, people asked why buying it if stock A500 and A1200 is enough, at best accellerator with 68030 and some fastram needed

so it is understandable if both platforms try to get unique hardware features and in the end spezific software. I do not see it negative, it is competition

@V8

my problem is not the competition but how it is done, expecially from the users. I think I am no fanatic but I hate unisided attacks. And sorry to say that, as far as I see it pistorm fans are partly the most fanatic users. It sounds almost religious, not about a hobby. I do not understand that attitude. You frequently see that in the classic community today, partly also between the amigaos 3.2 fans too. It is a hobby, nothing else. Amiga will not conquer the world again. And it should be positive to have development again, whereever.

@OlafS25

Quote:

OlafS25 wrote: both apollo and pistorm have the problem that they offer advanced features but no software using it except some ports from PC

Some of the later Amiga games (GLOOM / NEMAC IV) are supporting RTG, most serious Amiga Audio, GFX and Office software does also support RTG or AHI.

But when it comes to 'exotic' features like fancy Copper enhancements no one will support them, you can like it or dislike this but new features have to go mainstream enhancement supported via SDL otherwise even Amiga Programmers won't support it.

@bhabbott

Quote:

bhabbott wrote: I have no problem with that, as I said. I just don't think it will benefit all Amiga fans. The argument that it will result in more Amiga games becuse they will be easier to port is wrong. It actually means that games which might been ported to real Amigas won't be. Many Amiga fans won't be able to run these PPC ports on their machines, and some of those who can 'upgrade' to a PiStorm won't want to (me for example. I'm not going to replace the Blizzard 1230-IV in my A1200 with a PiStorm just to play Baldur's gate).

I experienced a 68030-25MHz Amiga in the early 1990s and wanted 486DX-25/DX-33 class 68040-25/68040-28 overclock which is expensive.

During the COVID-19 lockdown, I purchased TF1260 with 68060 rev1 @ 62.5Mhz and wanted more speed. TF1260 has a software-controlled clock speed setting for turtle mode use case.

PiStorm-Emu68 has turtle mode.

The Amiga had its PC "turbo button" phase.

Last edited by Hammer on 01-Nov-2025 at 11:12 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 01-Nov-2025 at 11:10 PM.

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@OlafS25

Quote:

OlafS25 wrote: @V8 my problem is not the competition but how it is done, expecially from the users. I think I am no fanatic but I hate unisided attacks. And sorry to say that, as far as I see it pistorm fans are partly the most fanatic users. It sounds almost religious, not about a hobby. I do not understand that attitude. You frequently see that in the classic community today, partly also between the amigaos 3.2 fans too. It is a hobby, nothing else. Amiga will not conquer the world again. And it should be positive to have development again, whereever.

On the CPU, Nintendo Switch and Switch 2 mark the hardware minimum for mainstream acceptance. For a big-endian/little-endian capable CPU family, only ARM64 can deliver that at an affordable price.

Based on history, Amiga's 68000 was in sync with mainstream 16-bit game consoles' 68000 selection.

When 32-bit game consoles switched to RISC-based MIPS R3050 @ 33MHz or SuperH2 @ 28MHz CPUs, Motorola couldn't match performance vs value.

MIPS R3050 @ 33MHz or SuperH2 @ 28MHz CPUs are 68LC040-25 class CPUs with 68020/68EC030 price range!

68LC040-25 / 68040-25 was available at $30 in 1996, which is too late for the Amiga game console!

68LC040-25 / 68040-25 reached $100 in 1995, which is similar to 68EC040-25's $100 price in 1992! Motorola placed a price premium with 68K MMU in sync with AT&T's commercial Unix. Both commercial Unix and 68K were pushed out of the desktop/workstation market.

The core problem is Motorola's CPU price vs performance structure. Motorola thinks it's like Intel, but Motorola doesn't have Intel's market share! Motorola is not startup-friendly. The arrogance from Motorola. Many ARM advocates on Amiga know the Motorola problem.

From 1989 to 1990, Amiga Hombre's non-Motorola CPU direction was an early sign of Commodore getting out of the Motorola albatross.

Last edited by Hammer on 01-Nov-2025 at 11:47 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 01-Nov-2025 at 11:46 PM.
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Last edited by Hammer on 01-Nov-2025 at 11:22 PM.

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@michalsc

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michalsc wrote: @NutsAboutAmiga There is, however, a difference - on one hand some badly written software requiring e.g. a 15bpp mode and failing otherwise; on the other hand creating new ABI which is completely foreign for Amiga in every form, leading to a situation where you could see in future a requester saying "this software requires Emu68 version x.y. to run".

The only solution is for the Amiga IP owner is to spec Nintendo Switch-level ARM hardware in A500/A1200 case with AmigaOS ARM edition and the price of Nintendo Switch.

Last edited by Hammer on 02-Nov-2025 at 11:59 AM.

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@Hammer

maybe the 3do?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgOlr6fQpeM

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@OlafS25

Quote:

think I am no fanatic but I hate unisided attacks. And sorry to say that, as far as I see it pistorm fans are partly the most fanatic users. It sounds almost religious, not about a hobby. I do not understand that attitude

There might be some, it's the Amiga community
On average I think most PiStorm users are just users that want a fast accelerator for an affordable price.
Love my PiStorm setups but I also have an A600 with Vampire 2,a V4, A4000 with CSPPC+CVPPC, still have my BlizzPPC+Bvision and seriously considering a Mirari board once it becomes available.

The WarpOS compatible PPC core might be a really nice addition since the PPC/ARM translation seems to be quite a bit faster than M68K/ARM translation.
Since this already exists for many years and there is already software for it. this seems like sane choice to me.

Last edited by Mr-Z on 02-Nov-2025 at 05:07 PM.

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@NutsAboutAmiga

Like 3DO's MADAM chip, Amiga Hombre's Nathaniel (Agnus/Alice replacement) chip has dual memory bus support with FPM DRAM and VRAM. 3DO's sprite engines were the texture-mapper.

Many ex-Commodore/ex-Amiga engineers went to SGI and 3DO (Cite: Commodore - The Final Years book).

Ex-original Los Gatos Amiga engineers selected the ARM60 CPU @ 12.5Mhz/20 Mhz for 3DO and the IBM PPC 602 @ 66Mhz for 3DO M2. IBM PPC 602's low-cost line continued into IBM PPE with Xbox 360 and PS3. A follow-on to IBM's PPE, the PPC A2 lost to AMD's Jaguar (out-of-order x86-64) with AMD's GCN (Graphics Core Next) GPU for Xbox One and PS4.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_A2

For the Xbox group's build-up, Microsoft purchased the engineering group that was developing 3DO MX. MS's reduce risk team won the argument and went for the external GPU vendor. The lead engineer for 3DO MX is an ex-SGI engineer, but NVIDIA assimilated the entire SGI graphics business unit.

A CSG engineer who has knowledge of double rate processing 65xx CPU family joined AMD and remained with AMD into the 28 nm era APUs (during the start of AMD's Xbox One and PS4 era). K7 Athlon has double-rate data (DDR) chipsets.

ATI assimilated the ex-SGI ArtX team (engineers responsible for N64, GameCube), and ATI was assimilated into AMD. ATI had the MIPS SoC business, and AMD sold ATI's embedded graphics business unit to Qualcomm.

Both AMD and NVIDIA have active game console businesses for Xbox, PlayStation, and Nintendo.


Your https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgOlr6fQpeM link confirms 3DO MX's ex-Amiga engineers were assimilated into the Xbox team.

Last edited by Hammer on 03-Nov-2025 at 04:29 AM.
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