Recently I found a website with illegal Amiga content. I decided to write to the owner of this site - James Jacobs - who is the author of eg. WormWars, ReportPlus, AmiArcadia and other Amiga programs.

First I just wanted to notice him, the software he hosts on his site is not freely distributable. Later I discovered the large complex of opinions behind it. Judge for yourself.

James Jacobs thinks his behaviour is OK and unselfish. Furthermore he thinks he's helping the Amiga community! Therefore it would be nice if YOU - Amiga community - would give him a feedback. What do you think about this?

Following is the transcription of our email communication. (Repeating text is in italic and shortened)

Edited: publishing private emails without the other users permission is not allowed, see the copyright section of the aw.net TOS.

EDITED: Since the private communication was removed (and I apologize for making it public), people do not have enough information to decide whether to vote YES or NO. So, in brief, let me ask the question again and more clearly:

IS JAMES JACOBS HELPING THE AMIGA COMMUNITY BY ILLEGALY DISTRIBUTING AMIGAOS3.9, BOINGBAGS AND AMIGA ROM FILES ON HIS SITE?

I ask because he believes he IS helping! He simply consider this material as "abandoware" that gives him the "right" to distibute it.
By the way, people voting "yes" should also explain their opinion. Thanks.

Last edited by AmiKit on 01-Sep-2006 at 06:17 PM.
Last edited by tomazkid on 24-Aug-2006 at 11:09 PM.

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@AmiKit

There should have been another negative option with an added H E double hockey sticks.

I bet there are none of those Commodore 64 in a joystick things being manufactured right now. By his reasoning, it's ok to go ahead and start manufacturing them himself because obiously it's an abandoned device.

Last edited by weirdami on 24-Aug-2006 at 02:23 AM.

Just my opinion.. And I'll probablt get flamed for saying it, heh... Seems like a lot of poo-poo about nothing.

Any chimp can search the interenet and find every kickstart/workbench ever made. I'd argue that it's not the roms/os that sells Amiga Forever. It's the fact that everything you need is put together in one simple package. Its like buying that 12 CD set of 70's disco instead of looking for each song on your own

Weren't you guys breast fed or something?

It's time to jump up and down about copyright and ip infringement when it affects someone other than the robber barrons.

I sure as hell don't feel that I owe anything to Amiga Dinc - in fact it feels quite the opposite to me.

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Hello Jan,

I've read about as much of this exchange as I can take, and I think I'm
probably going to vote "Yes, he is helping," not because I think distributing
copyrighted material is a good idea, but because of the software and tutorials
that he personally has created and made available to the community.

I'm sure that you are legally correct on the point of "abandonware," and on the
IP rights of Amiga Inc., etc., but I must admit that he presents the most most
reasonable explanation and justification of the abandonware concept that I
have seen. I'm not ready to accept it yet, but if I get tired enough of
hearing nothing from Amiga Inc. then . . . (?)

A few things are worth noting. You seem, at least on the surface, to
value objects and rules more, and he, progress, activity and presence in the
community. There truly is a difference between ethical and legal. Maybe
James believes that he is in a situation where the legalities have become
pointless (essentially, no longer worth the effort of governments OR
copyright holders to enforce), and that he must make his own choices based
on the things that he values. Can laws (or even rights) always properly
guide us in our decisions?

I think, at least, that you should reread his arguments, and try to come up with
a counterargument as principled and unemotional as his.

@AmiKit

Whether he is helping or hindering is a difficult question, and I won't even try to answer it.

What he is doing, however, is breaching copyright law, which is wrong - plain and simple. I cannot condone that in any shape or form.

Quote:

Removed edited quote/tomazkid

That is libelous nonsense.

1) There is no law against selling free software. (Even the FSF used to sell tapes with GNU software on it.)
2) They are not just selling free software, they are selling it packaged with ROMs, disk images, videos, and a bunch of content. You pay for the added value and the packaging.
3) I seriously doubt that Cloanto make any profit from AmigaForever. It's a labour of love, not a money-making exercise.

Cheers,
Rich

Last edited by tomazkid on 24-Aug-2006 at 11:11 PM.
Last edited by evilrich on 24-Aug-2006 at 04:39 AM.

One more point: Cloanto have made a full version of PPaint available for download via Aminet. Does that strike you as particularly leach-like behaviour?

Cheers,
Rich

@evilrich

I don't know what to think about this subject.
But regarding OS4.. Shouldn't all OS4 owners have access to ROM files?
IMHO this should be a given.

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@Samwel

Quote:

I don't know what to think about this subject. But regarding OS4.. Shouldn't all OS4 owners have access to ROM files? IMHO this should be a given.

I believe that Hyperion do have the right to distribute previous versions of AmigaOS (maybe apart from 3.5/3.9 which probably belong to H&P), but that's a question you'll have to ask Hyperion to get a definitive answer.

I think all owners of AmigaOnes should already have a copy of the 3.1 ROM. I know I got a copy on the CD that accompanied mine (I had previously bought a version of AmigaForever, anyway).

Cheers,
Rich

Last edited by evilrich on 24-Aug-2006 at 05:23 AM.

@AmiKit
Well, that's one person you failed to convince on your moral crusade...hundreds of thousands more to pester. Cloanto and the Amiga community praise you for making no impact whatsoever.
I have to stop coming to AW.

I wonder how the poll would look if it was worded

"Is James Jacobs hurting the Amiga community?"

@ALL
James Jacob's Webpage is now down....

@benja

Quote:

Well, that's one person you failed to convince on your moral crusade...hundreds of thousands more to pester. Cloanto and the Amiga community praise you for making no impact whatsoever.

Grow up. Copyright theft is still theft, and copyright law is one of the basic bits of glue that allows the world economy to function. If you disagree with it, lobby to get the law changed.

Maybe you'd think it'd be okay if somebody came 'round your house and nicked something of yours just because you hadn't used it in a while.

Quote:

I have to stop coming to AW.

Please do.

Cheers,
Rich

When Amiga Inc give me my $50 back they can complain about illegal use of their software.

@evilrich

Quote:

Grow up. Copyright theft is still theft, and copyright law is one of the basic bits of glue that allows the world economy to function.

That statement struck me funny

Buy these! Dont Download these!

Or... the world economy will cease to function!

Sorry.. I can tell your very passionate about copyright law, but I dont believe the world is black and white. How is buying used software off of ebay any more legit than downloading it from a website?

@Olecranon

Quote:

by Olecranon on 24-Aug-2006 6:38:01 "Is James Jacobs hurting the Amiga community?"

*DOH* That is what I thougth I read when I first saw the poll so I voted yes! Can't see any way to change my vote

@AmiKit
if you actually have not left out any parts of the conversation,
i have one strong objection to what you did here:

you posted private email conversation on a public forum without the prior consent of the correspondant.

While you asked or announced 2 times that you are planning to do so, i fail to see James agreeing to you posting the whole conversation here on AW. Now, if you are so keen on obeying rules and respect laws etc. which is perfectly ok with me, you should have respected his right for privacy etc. as well.

If James actually agreed to posting it but you left out the relevant part, feel free to ignore this comment. But if not, i think you are in this case breaching the same principles that you claim to protect so high-moraled. You talk of respect, you talk of laws, but actually fail to comply yourself.

Please note that i do NOT defend breach of copyright or similar activities, iam just in strong disagreement with the way you went ahead with this matter.

@AmiKit

I think there should be a date set for pre-OS4 releases to be freely distributed if not open sourced. For me OS4 represents a watershed.

More good would come from OS3.9 being freely distributed, it's 6 years old now and availability is very limited through retail channels (most will likely be second hand copies anyway). It would make good sense to make OS3x available free alongside the OS4 final release, once there is hardware available etc, this would probably draw some welcome interest, get some users back into Amiga OS via 3.9 emulation and then from there onto OS4 systems.

@RedMelons

A fair point .

@IceDragon

Quote:

i have one strong objection to what you did here: you posted private email conversation on a public forum without the prior consent of the correspondant. While you asked or announced 2 times that you are planning to do so, i fail to see James agreeing to you posting the whole conversation here on AW.

I agree on that. Private email conversation should not be made public in a web forum without James agreement.

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