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Hammer
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 12:06:20
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Elite Member |
Joined: 9-Mar-2003 Posts: 5246
From: Australia | | |
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| @DAX
Quote:
DAX wrote: @WolfToTheMoon Quote:
The problem is, the word big isn't a technology. IBM is Big. Microsoft is Big. Guess why we do not worship them?
Let me take away the mystery right away: because they have nothing to do with Amiga.
Cusa not only has nothing to do with Amiga, but they have nothing to do with Commodore as well. Talk about it with Jack Tramiel and see what he thinks. He fought in a war and then went on to create Commodore out of sweat and blood. He bough a CPU engineering firm in order to bring down manufacturing costs and attain engineering freedom.
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Both classic Amiga chipset and MOS 65xx are also boat anchors.
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Buying logos won't convince people you are anything more than everyday stuff hidden behind colored images. You must be the nth small step in a long line of small steps that took place during 25 years of handwork to be AmigaOS. And you must develop your own custom computers to be Commodore.
I don't know if Cusa will ever get Big, but I'm not interested in "Big" (I already have many options to choose from in that regard), I am interested in Amiga.
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The user interface on most 8bit CBM micro computers are powered by Microsoft Basic e.g. the classic "READY."-prompt.
"Microsoft's and other variants of BASIC constituted a significant and visible part of many home computers' rudimentary operating systems".
Keeping “Designed for Microsoft Windows” logos on PCs in mind, re-label these 8bit CBM micro-computers to “Designed for Microsoft Basic”.
Microsoft Basic business model is the same as the current Microsoft Windows’s business model.
Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 12:15 PM. Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 12:10 PM.
_________________ Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68) Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68) |
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Hammer
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 12:25:26
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Elite Member |
Joined: 9-Mar-2003 Posts: 5246
From: Australia | | |
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| @vox
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Joke of the year! First, they have ABSOLUTELY nothing with Commodore as we know it. |
Re-label CBM's 8bit micro-computers to "Designed for Microsoft Basic" PCs.
_________________ Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68) Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68) |
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T-J
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 12:26:48
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Cult Member |
Joined: 31-Aug-2010 Posts: 596
From: Unknown | | |
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| @Hammer
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On Linux comment, Google's Android OS/Chrome OS and MeeGo says Hi. |
Meego and Android are operating systems for mobile telephones. And aren't CUSA trying to tell us they're going to take over the desktop market? Not phones?
See the problem? We've all seen plenty of companies that try to build a business selling rehashed Linux distributions on generic desktops and failing. Why is Barry going to succeed?
@DAX
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This is like a soccer player that wants to be great: you can decide to train yourself and grow (ie:improve and evolve the OS) or secretly open David Beckam's locker, put a sticker with your name on his shirt and then enjoy the match on tv all satisfied that some unsuspecting TV watcher will mistake those assists for your own. |
Very true.
@WolfToTheMoon
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If you read Red's report on Amiga.org |
There's no evidence. Why is it that a company that was 'so successful' leaves only one article anywhere on the internet? And even that, why is it so uncomplimentary towards Cabletech? Why can we find no publicly available evidence for Barry's involvement with any company more successful than a minor (and somewhat shady) cable television dealership?
Barry can claim to be a billionaire all he wants, but he'll need to provide some *evidence* if anyone other than the fanboys are going to believe him.
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c64x? Its a box. Not only that, it is a box that had already been designed! All CUSA had to do was decide where to cut the holes for the miniITX motherboard and shove a small formfactor keyboard in there.
Hardly rocket science; geeks build these in their sheds over the course of a few weeks, and its taken CUSA a year, and 'a six figure cost so far'. I remember the first CUSA website promising a summer launch. And then they claimed they'd do an advertisement blitz in time for the Christmas rush. Now they promise a launch at the end of Q1 2011.
I do find it highly interesting that the delays for CUSA exactly mirror those for a certain other company I could mention...
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Hammer
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 12:27:44
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Elite Member |
Joined: 9-Mar-2003 Posts: 5246
From: Australia | | |
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| @Troels
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Troels wrote: @Hammer Quote:
On Linux comment, Google's Android OS/Chrome OS and MeeGo says Hi. |
Irrelevant as these are not targeted at "linux lovers" but joe average. Again totally different platforms than what cusa is aiming at (exeption being ChromeOS, maybe..). |
You must be referring "Linux/GNU/X-Window/(insert XZY Windows Manager) lovers. "Linux lovers" (kernel) doesn't mind Android OS.
Joe average doesn't care about pure "Linux/GNU/X-Window/(insert XZY Windows Manager)". Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 12:31 PM.
_________________ Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68) Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68) |
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T-J
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 12:28:24
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Cult Member |
Joined: 31-Aug-2010 Posts: 596
From: Unknown | | |
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| @Hammer
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Re-label CBM's 8bit micro-computers to "Designed for Microsoft Basic" PCs. |
Great idea. Unfortunately, it still doesn't provide a link, because CUSA aren't going to be shipping windows with their computers, are they? |
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Hammer
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 12:38:03
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Elite Member |
Joined: 9-Mar-2003 Posts: 5246
From: Australia | | |
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| @T-J
Quote:
T-J wrote: @Hammer
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Re-label CBM's 8bit micro-computers to "Designed for Microsoft Basic" PCs. |
Great idea. Unfortunately, it still doesn't provide a link, because CUSA aren't going to be shipping windows with their computers, are they?
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Unfortunately, C=USA's 8bit CBM emulator includes Microsoft Basic.
From http://www.commodoreusa.net/CUSA_OS.aspx
"All our machines will also provide optimum software flexibility with the optional extra to run Windows software either from a dual boot menu at start up, or seamlessly integrated within Workbench 5 itself. "
Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 12:49 PM. Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 12:49 PM. Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 12:45 PM. Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 12:41 PM. Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 12:38 PM.
_________________ Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68) Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68) |
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T-J
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 12:46:23
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Cult Member |
Joined: 31-Aug-2010 Posts: 596
From: Unknown | | |
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| @Hammer
Optional extra means you have to buy it separately. It doesn't ship as standard. Its not part of the default OS. Its just a third-party add-on. CUSA_OS isn't any kind of successor to Microsoft Basic. I think Microsoft Windows is a better candidate for that, frankly.
And anyway, if your argument is that people should buy a CUSAbox so they can run Microsoft software and 8bit C= emulators... well. Last edited by T-J on 06-Feb-2011 at 12:47 PM.
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Hammer
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 12:51:07
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Elite Member |
Joined: 9-Mar-2003 Posts: 5246
From: Australia | | |
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| @T-J
My comment specifically addresses "First, they have ABSOLUTELY nothing with Commodore as we know it" POV. Running Microsoft compatible applications is another matter.
--- The working ACPI profile in X86 PC’s firmware would be the Window version and modern Lintel distros calls this ACPI profile.
My point, most X86 PC motherboards targets Microsoft Windows compatibility first. Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 12:54 PM.
_________________ Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68) Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68) |
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DAX
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 12:53:30
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Elite Member |
Joined: 30-Sep-2009 Posts: 2790
From: Italy | | |
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| @Hammer Speaking about Commodore (and leaving Amiga alone, two different things) I mentioned them as far as computers go not OS, so we might agree. It would be as if today a giant like Matsushita, creates a CPU and computer, and then asks Microsoft (with a big contract) to port Windows on it. Nothing even remotely similar is happening today. Even HammerComputers(tm) could build an x86 box and asks for oem licences, using super market gear. Commodore's and (the hypothetical) Matsushita cases are a different story.
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DAX
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 12:58:08
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Elite Member |
Joined: 30-Sep-2009 Posts: 2790
From: Italy | | |
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| @Hammer Quote:
Both classic Amiga chipset and MOS 65xx are also boat anchors. |
I have nothing against a company so big it can purchase CPU developers and custom chipsets.
It would be as if today Cusa bought PASemi instead of Apple (preceding them I mean), and bought ATI instead of AMD (again preceding them). Again anything like it, is happening.Last edited by DAX on 06-Feb-2011 at 12:58 PM.
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WolfToTheMoon
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 12:58:27
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Super Member |
Joined: 2-Sep-2010 Posts: 1351
From: CRO | | |
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| @T-J
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Meego and Android are operating systems for mobile telephones. |
And tablets... and netbooks...
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See the problem? We've all seen plenty of companies that try to build a business selling rehashed Linux distributions on generic desktops and failing. |
We have also seen plenty of companies trying to build a business selling AmigaOIDs and failing...
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Evidence? How bout securing licenses for both Commodore and Amiga brands... which hasn't been accomplished in the last 15 years by anyone. Besides that, I don't think Barry has to provide any other evidence other then working products - and that will be coming soon.
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c64x? Its a box. Not only that, it is a box that had already been designed |
So is AmigaOS... yet, today we have 3 different OSes trying to mimic the original in one way or another.
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Hardly rocket science; geeks build these in their sheds over the course of a few weeks, and its taken CUSA a year, and 'a six figure cost so far'. |
Geeks cannot sell or manufacture those in large quantities, can they?
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I remember the first CUSA website promising a summer launch. And then they claimed they'd do an advertisement blitz in time for the Christmas rush. Now they promise a launch at the end of Q1 2011. |
I can name numerous cases similar to that. One including A-eon and Hyperion.
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DAX
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 13:01:31
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Elite Member |
Joined: 30-Sep-2009 Posts: 2790
From: Italy | | |
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| @WolfToTheMoon Quote:
c64x? Its a box. Not only that, it is a box that had already been designed So is AmigaOS... yet, today we have 3 different OSes trying to mimic the original in one way or another. |
AmigaOS it's no box no matter how many try to imitate it. It was written down and painstakingly evolved over time. It is still here alive and kicking (check THIS for further clarification)._________________ SamFlex Complete 800Mhz System + AmigaOS 4.1 Update 4 Amiga 2000 DKB 2MB ChipRam GVP G-Force040 Picasso 2 OS3.9 BB2 AmigaCD 32 |
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WolfToTheMoon
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 13:06:48
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Super Member |
Joined: 2-Sep-2010 Posts: 1351
From: CRO | | |
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| @DAX
AmigaOS4 is mostly a rewrite of the original OS 3.1 code with a new kernel. It's a new OS that goes about mimicking some past features and adding some new. Pretty much fits the description/philosophy of C64x... _________________
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eXec
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 13:19:59
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Cult Member |
Joined: 21-Jun-2004 Posts: 956
From: Burkina Faso | | |
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| @DAX
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It is still here alive and kicking (check THIS for further clarification). |
By this time, that video should be a trilogy. Extended version trilogy...
_________________ ____ ...administration is for serious people only.... |
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linnar
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 13:20:09
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Cult Member |
Joined: 26-Dec-2005 Posts: 923
From: Unknown | | |
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linnar wrote: Respect each other's opinions!
My opinion is that the new Commodore is the true inheritor of the old Commodore Amiga and their is a straight continuation of the classic Amiga. Workbench5 is a natural continuation of OS3.9. Everything else is the clones! Therefore, I think the Commodore shall have their natural place here on the forum. If any year, the majority of Amiga users use the Commodore Amiga anyway.
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- It's the winning team who write history! - It is the buyer of a brand that determines what (it should be), when (it should be) and how (it should be)! - It does not necessarily linked to old Amiga - There are actually links - Hardware or software can be quite different from the old days - Everything else is opinion! - Commodore's reality, in the present, in past and future!
- I expect to get beaten when I stir a bit
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Hammer
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 13:21:28
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Elite Member |
Joined: 9-Mar-2003 Posts: 5246
From: Australia | | |
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| @DAX
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DAX wrote: @Hammer Speaking about Commodore (and leaving Amiga alone, two different things) I mentioned them as far as computers go not OS, so we might agree. It would be as if today a giant like Matsushita, creates a CPU and computer, and then asks Microsoft (with a big contract) to port Windows on it.
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Intel Itanium and Microsoft Windows Itanium edition says Hi. Matsushita is not large enough in the CPU + PC platform space.
AMD asked Microsoft to support AMD64 instruction set i.e. cooperated via ex-DEC employees connections. http://www.amd.com/us/press-releases/Pages/Press_Release_19906.aspx
As for Matsushita, MSX(Microsoft eXtended BASIC) standard says Hi i.e. Microsoft Japan and it's MSX hardware clones.
MSX: Spectravideo, Philips, Al Alamia, Sony, Sanyo, Mitsubishi, Toshiba, Hitachi, National, Panasonic, Canon, Casio, Pioneer, Fujitsu General, Yamaha, JVC, Yashica-Kyocera, GoldStar, Samsung/Fenner, Daewoo/Yeno, Gradiente, Sharp/Epcom, Talent. MSX2: Philips, Sony, Sanyo, Samsung, Mitsubishi, Victor (a.k.a. JVC), National, Panasonic, Canon, Yamaha, ACVS, DDX, Daewoo/Yeno, NTT,Talent. MSX2+: Sony, Sanyo, Panasonic, ACVS, DDX. MSX TurboR: Panasonic.
PS; Panasonic = Matsushita.
MSX was road killed by Microsoft DOS dominated X86 PC clone standard.
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On the side note, To kill the VGA standard, you have the combine might of Intel** + AMD** + Dell + Lenovo, Samsung and LG.
** http://itgrunts.com/2010/12/09/intel-amd-to-kill-the-vga-port/ Both Intel and AMD team up to kill IBM's VGA standard. Notice NVIDIA is not part of X86 PC hardware leadership team. Both Intel and AMD oversees X86 PC hardware standards.
Against these players, Intel is a super-power status e.g. 1. Intel VL-Bus and PCI’s standards crushed IBM's MCA. 2. Intel’s USB (designed by Ajay Bhatt of Intel) standard crushed IBM's PS/2 and Apple’s Firewire.
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Nothing even remotely similar is happening today. Even HammerComputers(tm) could build an x86 box and asks for oem licences, using super market gear. Commodore's and (the hypothetical) Matsushita cases are a different story.
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Getting personal wouldn't support your position.Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 01:35 PM. Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 01:33 PM. Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 01:25 PM. Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 01:23 PM.
_________________ Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68) Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68) |
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DAX
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 13:28:14
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Elite Member |
Joined: 30-Sep-2009 Posts: 2790
From: Italy | | |
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| @WolfToTheMoon What'srewritted is what needs to be rewritten, what's not needs not. It is the evokution of the same product though. What's the x64? The evolution of MsWindGnome? Please...
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DAX
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 13:30:33
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Elite Member |
Joined: 30-Sep-2009 Posts: 2790
From: Italy | | |
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| @Hammer It was an example, could be "Dax" computers(tm), don't get me wrong.
On the subject I spoke my mind further on post 190 (and again we do not disagree much if at all).
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Hammer
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 13:48:30
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Elite Member |
Joined: 9-Mar-2003 Posts: 5246
From: Australia | | |
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| @DAX
Quote:
DAX wrote: @Hammer Quote:
Both classic Amiga chipset and MOS 65xx are also boat anchors. |
I have nothing against a company so big it can purchase CPU developers and custom chipsets.
It would be as if today Cusa bought PASemi instead of Apple (preceding them I mean), and bought ATI instead of AMD (again preceding them). Again anything like it, is happening.
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Instead of “custom chipset”, how about specialised corporations? The entire corporation’s resources geared toward one or two things?
On the GFLOP (array math processors) race, Sony tried with it CELL(with IBM+Toshiba’s help) and they were smashed by AMD (ATI) and NVIDIA (i.e. the G80 was released a few days ahead of PS3’s launch).Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 01:55 PM. Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 01:49 PM.
_________________ Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68) Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68) |
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Hammer
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Re: [Poll] Should CUSA posts and promotions be allowed at AW.net now and in the future? Posted on 6-Feb-2011 13:52:37
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Elite Member |
Joined: 9-Mar-2003 Posts: 5246
From: Australia | | |
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| @DAX
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DAX wrote: @WolfToTheMoon What'srewritted is what needs to be rewritten, what's not needs not. It is the evokution of the same product though. What's the x64? The evolution of MsWindGnome? Please...
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X64 is a Microsoft's vendor neutral term for AMD64 or Intel64 instruction set. Last edited by Hammer on 06-Feb-2011 at 02:00 PM.
_________________ Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68) Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68) |
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