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opi
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 18-Apr-2011 22:14:54
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Joined: 2-Mar-2005 Posts: 2752
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| @eXec
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this is the ghost city then... |
Video related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1WhhSBgd3KI
EDIT: there's no [query] tag, programming and posting does not mix  Last edited by opi on 18-Apr-2011 at 10:18 PM.
_________________ OpenWindows Initiative. Port PS3 hardware to bananas. For free. Join today and receive expired $50 cupon from AI! |
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eXec
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 18-Apr-2011 22:16:51
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Joined: 21-Jun-2004 Posts: 956
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| @Caveman
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Caveman wrote: @eXec
The land of the living dead?
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The death of the living land ;)_________________ ____ ...administration is for serious people only.... |
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eXec
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 18-Apr-2011 22:17:41
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Joined: 21-Jun-2004 Posts: 956
From: Burkina Faso | | |
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| @opi
same thing here...
only instead of buildings are discontinued processors _________________ ____ ...administration is for serious people only.... |
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pavlor
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 18-Apr-2011 22:22:06
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Joined: 10-Jul-2005 Posts: 9660
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| @eXec
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Dave wrote everything... seems no one listens.... |
But I fully agree with Dave! Yes, x86 would be the best solution for our platform. However, no-one has enough time, skills and money to do such port. Now. Maybe time will change that.
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what for? another agony? another decade of nothing? |
Past decade was full of interesting products and disputes: Amithlon Pegasos and Pegasos II AmigaOne SE/XE/Micro Blue-Red war AmigaOS 4pre (and Final) MorphOS 1.x Efika Hyperion vs A.Inc dispute MorphOS 2.x AmigaOS 4.1 SAM440ep SAM440ep-flex ports of MorphOS to Mac Mini, eMac and PowerMac G4 SAM460ex
not even counting interesting progress of AROS or improving of many emulator packages/solutions (Amiga Forever, AmiKit) and of course Minimig.
Another decade with such achievements would be really nice.  |
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number6
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 18-Apr-2011 22:24:36
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Joined: 25-Mar-2005 Posts: 11663
From: In the village | | |
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| @pavlor
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Hyperion vs A.Inc dispute |
Congratulations! You are winner of this week's:
"Master of the Understatement" award.
#6
_________________ This posting, in its entirety, represents solely the perspective of the author. *Secrecy has served us so well* |
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pavlor
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 18-Apr-2011 22:28:31
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Joined: 10-Jul-2005 Posts: 9660
From: Unknown | | |
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| @Caveman
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The land of the living dead? |

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eXec
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 18-Apr-2011 22:28:57
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Joined: 21-Jun-2004 Posts: 956
From: Burkina Faso | | |
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| @pavlor
We are standing on the place for a quite long time. This X1000 is just a facelift and fresh makeup on a dead corpse. Custom hardware is not the problem, OS it is. Instead of inventing new and overpriced hardware, why not investing each cent into OS development. More reasonable path. There is a whole bunch of cheap and powerfull hardware out there.
_________________ ____ ...administration is for serious people only.... |
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opi
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 18-Apr-2011 22:29:42
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Joined: 2-Mar-2005 Posts: 2752
From: Poland | | |
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| @pavlor
This was one of my favorites EWS graphics.  _________________ OpenWindows Initiative. Port PS3 hardware to bananas. For free. Join today and receive expired $50 cupon from AI! |
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Caveman
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 18-Apr-2011 22:29:48
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Joined: 16-Feb-2005 Posts: 655
From: Norway | | |
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| @pavlor
hahaha. Great picture
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eXec
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 18-Apr-2011 22:30:21
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Joined: 21-Jun-2004 Posts: 956
From: Burkina Faso | | |
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| @pavlor
ironic is that the picture is true ;)
_________________ ____ ...administration is for serious people only.... |
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Kremlar
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 18-Apr-2011 23:36:15
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Joined: 12-Aug-2010 Posts: 108
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3.4E GHz Pentium 4 (single core) 1484 SpecInt2000 1492 SpecFp2000 TDP: above 100W (not counting needed chipset on motherboard of course)
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Hmm, I'll take the extra performance and 7 years and unscrew a lightbulb.
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COBRA
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 19-Apr-2011 0:32:49
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Joined: 26-Apr-2004 Posts: 1809
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| @ferrels
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You continue to speak of markets, targets and business like the X1000 will somehow bring back Amiga's glory days by providing a viable alternative to systems already out there. |
Okay, there seems to be some kind of language barrier here, for I never said anything like the X1000 was going to bring back the glory days of Amiga or any of the other things you suggest I said... In fact if you read some of my other comments in this thread I did say specifically, that the X1000 with OS4 in its current state cannot appeal to people outside the keen Amiga enthusiast community. I also did not say that you can't have AROS ported to NatAmi or that you can't write patches and drivers for OS3.9 as extensions. So what are you talking about? If you're just trying to pick a fight, I suggest you go somewhere else. |
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COBRA
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 19-Apr-2011 0:40:35
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Joined: 26-Apr-2004 Posts: 1809
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| @mausle
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I meant how many developers are working on developing or porting software for AROS, rather than how many are developing the OS itself, as it was suggested that if OS4 moved to x86 it would bring more developers. Since OS4 is commercial, the number of people working on it depends on how many developers Hyperion can afford, rather than what type of CPU architectures the OS supports. So the main question is whether AROS has more developers who are working on developing software and applications. If that is the case, then it would suggest that indeed moving to x86 might bring more people who would be keen on developing software for the OS, which is important since software availability is a key to the success of any system.Last edited by COBRA on 19-Apr-2011 at 12:42 AM.
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_ThEcRoW
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 19-Apr-2011 1:02:45
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Joined: 12-Jan-2005 Posts: 836
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| @number6
This was the final version?. Ok, didn't know, but i was mainly asking for the original deadline. English isn't my main language and maybe i wrote it the wrong way. What was the date when the os would be finished in the contract by a.inc? _________________ Amiga 1200 desktop. Apollo 030/50 Mhz 8mb ram + ClassicWB + Wb 3.1 Amiga 500 + ACA500plus 8mb + 30gb CF Raspberry Pi 3b+ and Amibian 1.4 Mac Mini G4 1GB Ram with the butterfly!! |
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Hammer
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 19-Apr-2011 2:02:47
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Joined: 9-Mar-2003 Posts: 6182
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| @KingKong
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KingKong wrote: @hazydave
Europe has to develop its own hardware (CPU, GPU, ...) and own OS because anything from USA is out of option (for security reasons). AmigaOS and hardware can be developed with money from the EU (think of some 1.000.000.000 ¤) and it will pay because of all the money saved from MS & Intel.
Important are infrastructure, military use, communication, industrial control ... and not the 3D-latest-game-highend-PC. So key-elements are safety, reliability and efficiency (low power consumption) and not 150 fps on a 500 watts PC. PPC and ARM can do fine here. (SNIP)
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High-end ATI/NV GPUs are being used in HPC._________________ Amiga 1200 (rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32/RPi CM4/Emu68) Amiga 500 (rev 6A, ECS, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 4B/Emu68) Ryzen 9 7950X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB |
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KingKong
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 19-Apr-2011 4:29:38
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Joined: 21-Oct-2006 Posts: 95
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Interesting presentations, thanks. These show that the PA6T is very usable for military, industry, office and of cource home-PC.
PA6T may be a few years back in performance but that doesn't count because the performance is high enough. For most people the PA6T has more than enough performance.
How much faster are current CPU? AmigaOS can easily regain factor 2-3 and even more in comparison to MSwindows (just guessing, ask the AmigaOS-profis).
Usability, clear design, endurance (works still in 10 years), security/stability, ... such things are much more important than some percent extra performance. One single bug (in hardware or software) can null the best performance.
BTW: be careful of too small structures (65 nm is fine, below 45 nm it may become too risky) - only guessing ... what does hazydave think?
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pavlor
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 19-Apr-2011 6:28:15
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Joined: 10-Jul-2005 Posts: 9660
From: Unknown | | |
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| @Kremlar
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Hmm, I'll take the extra performance and 7 years and unscrew a lightbulb. |
PA6T is even more technologicaly advanced chip: x86 CPUs with similar performance per watt were realeased in 2007/2008 (considering PA6T has TDP 14W for both cores excluding rest of the SoC with full desktop features). That is why I insist on 4 years, not 7 as some suggested. |
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mausle
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 19-Apr-2011 6:55:42
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Joined: 12-Sep-2003 Posts: 139
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| @COBRA
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COBRA wrote: @mausle
So the main question is whether AROS has more developers who are working on developing software and applications. If that is the case, then it would suggest that indeed moving to x86 might bring more people who would be keen on developing software for the OS, which is important since software availability is a key to the success of any system. |
Sorry, I can not give any numbers with reasonable backup. My impression is that uploads to and traffic on aros-exec might have increased the last 2 years, whatever that means for the number of application developers.
ciaoLast edited by mausle on 19-Apr-2011 at 06:57 AM. Last edited by mausle on 19-Apr-2011 at 06:56 AM.
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Rudei
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 19-Apr-2011 7:15:12
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Joined: 20-Nov-2002 Posts: 3589
From: Dallas, Texas | | |
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| @eXec
Quote:
this is the ghost city then... |
It is, close the door on your way out please!
Rude!_________________ 2017 Camaro 2SS |
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Hammer
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Re: Dave Haynie expresses thoughts on Natami and X1000 Posted on 19-Apr-2011 8:21:44
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Elite Member  |
Joined: 9-Mar-2003 Posts: 6182
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| @pavlor
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pavlor wrote: @Kremlar
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Sounds like a single core 3.46 P4 released in 2004 would blow it out of the water, especially since AmigaOS does not support dual core processors. |
3.4E GHz Pentium 4 (single core) 1484 SpecInt2000 1492 SpecFp2000 TDP: above 100W (not counting needed chipset on motherboard of course)
Next try?  |
Pentium 4 is dead. Try Intel Core i3/i5/i7 Mobile Sandybridge._________________ Amiga 1200 (rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32/RPi CM4/Emu68) Amiga 500 (rev 6A, ECS, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 4B/Emu68) Ryzen 9 7950X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB |
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