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   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
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TheDaddy 
Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 9:08:12
#1 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

Just a quick and dirty video of my mini-itx SAM440ep.

I have had it since 2008 and never really used it as I have been too busy doing other stuff.

So my knowledge of the hardware and especially OS4.1 is rather weak.

The board is a SAM440ep at 666MHz, year: 2008-09
with 512MB, onboard Radeon M9, SATA 24x DVD-RW and the award winning OCZ 60GB Agility 3 SSD SATA 3. There are no moving parts and it's absolutely silent!

I have been playing with it more and more in the last few weeks as some friends of mine wanted to know more about it and possibly going back to Amiga.

So I have assembled the fastest SAM440ep configuration I could possibly come up with and shot a couple of videos for fun.

Sorry about the quality, the video was taken at night and without any recording software just a camera pointing at my 24" monitor.

After finishing the build I have to say I am very impressed with this tiny machine.

I'll finish part two later today.

Have fun!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3JUWtNN-P8

Last edited by TheDaddy on 29-Jan-2012 at 07:08 PM.

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koft 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 9:18:45
#2 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Mar-2007
Posts: 493
From: USA, TN, Memphis

@TheDaddy

That video is kind of like watching paint dry. I didn't hear any audio, was there supposed to be audio? Why is the boot time so long, especially since you've got an SSD?

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pavlor 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 9:27:03
#3 ]
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Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 8644
From: Unknown

@TheDaddy

Nice!

So fast, so pleasant to use... I want one!

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pavlor 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 9:28:42
#4 ]
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Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 8644
From: Unknown

@koft

Quote:
Why is the boot time so long, especially since you've got an SSD?


16s long? I think you never used Windows Vista.

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TheDaddy 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 9:41:20
#5 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@koft

Quote:
That video is kind of like watching paint dry.


Thanks.
As I have said above it's not a video to watch with your pop-corns, there is no audio and no music as I don't see the need for it as it's a quick and dirty video to show my friend (who used to be an Amigan) what a relatively old (2008) and underpowered board like mine can do with OS4.1.

Quote:
Why is the boot time so long, especially since you've got an SSD?


Is it? Really? I have the same installation on a 160GB 7200 rpm HD and booting is more than 20 seconds and remember the SSD is going at SATA 1 speeds.

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koft 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 9:58:22
#6 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Mar-2007
Posts: 493
From: USA, TN, Memphis

@TheDaddy

Just surprised is all. I figured a vanilla AOS 4 install would boot almost instantly. What on earth does it have to do? My FreeBSD file server running on a 600MHz athlon with 256MiB of ram boots in less than that and it's running apache, samba, ftpd, postgres and a bunch of other crap.

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TheDaddy 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 10:03:54
#7 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@koft

It's not a vanilla AOS4 install (it's update 4 so I guess stuff has been added).

Can't comment on FreeBSD file server as I don't even know what that is.

This is not a video to say: "My computer is better than yours" bollox...it's to explain someone who used to have an A1200 with 4MB Fast Ram how much Amiga has changed.

If I had left more than 10 years ago and knew nothing about the Amiga anymore I'd be rather impressed but again I am easily impressed.

Last edited by TheDaddy on 29-Jan-2012 at 10:04 AM.

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koft 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 10:12:12
#8 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Mar-2007
Posts: 493
From: USA, TN, Memphis

@TheDaddy

You did an install then the update? Was the boot time faster before the update? Surely there's something one could tweak to make it start up faster. I have an eMac with MorphOS and that sucker boots up almost instantly.

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TheDaddy 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 10:19:17
#9 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@koft

>>You did an install then the update?

That is the first install, under three minutes the updates come later.

>>Was the boot time faster before the update?

No idea. I suspect faster but I wouldn't swer on it.

>>Surely there's something one could tweak to make it start up faster.

I am sure there is but as I said I am very, very rusty with OS4.1

>>I have an eMac with MorphOS and that sucker boots up almost instantly.

But that is a complete different beast.


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koft 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 10:25:26
#10 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Mar-2007
Posts: 493
From: USA, TN, Memphis

@TheDaddy

Yea, I don't know either, if I did I'd offer a suggestion. Will be interesting to see if anybody else offers advice, curious as to what it would be.

Super fast boots usually grab people's attention.

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TheDaddy 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 10:36:24
#11 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@koft

I am sure someone told me to get rid of stuff that the OS doesn't need in the Start UP Sequence or Kickstart but after doing a couple of obvious things I didn't feel very adventurous.

Anyway, it puts a massive grin on my face which is the important bit, especially when I have to reboot (CTRL+A+A)

I have tried doing that on my Macs and Windows pcs but it doesn't work.

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TheDaddy 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 12:06:53
#12 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

I forgot to say that I am not sure if DMA is enabled or not, I believe it isn't, can someone verify it? As I said I am not an expert.

If it isn't then it should be even faster?

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KimmoK 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 13:23:58
#13 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2003
Posts: 5090
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland

@koft

>I figured a vanilla AOS 4 install would boot almost instantly. What on earth does it have to do?

I agree that AOS4 boot times should be improved. Latest windows versions seem to be faster, especially with 4Ghz CPUs and SATA3 SSD drives.
AOS4 is so small that it should outperform windows and linux always, otherwise improvements are needed, IMHO.

>My FreeBSD file server running on a 600MHz athlon with 256MiB of ram boots in less than that and it's running apache, samba, ftpd, postgres and a bunch of other crap.

Try to boot it to half modern usable graphical desktop, then you can compare.
(+600Mhz athlon is faster than 667Mhz SAM440ep)

@thedaddy

I think you have DMA on.

@thread

IIRC, my classic Amigas managed to boot in 5 or 7 seconds at best (IIRC, AOS2.x).
And a friend of mine halved his AOS3.x booting time by putting all needed files in one file that was extracted to RAM and files were then loaded from there.
Also, one could copy boot files to RAD for the next warm reboot. One would then avoid IDE/SATA bottleneck.

I'm surpriced that there has not been yet any reports of people trying such tricks with NG systems.

Last edited by KimmoK on 29-Jan-2012 at 01:31 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 29-Jan-2012 at 01:30 PM.

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KimmoK 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 13:35:52
#14 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2003
Posts: 5090
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland

btw. is there a boot time timer app for AOS4?

When asked for reboot, it would save the current RTC time to RAD or same specific RAM address and after reboot it would check how much time was spent in the process.

( on x1000, xena could do the timing, if it's reboot could/can be disabled for AOS4 warm reboots. )

+ idea for cold boot acceleration...
Once someone develops disc cache SW for NG Amigas, it could be told to learn what files are needed during warm reboot and put that data to "safe place" in cache, then after warm reset, load the previous boot data.
(background process should monitor the checksum of the cacheddata after reboot and inform experienced user if something had trashed the data during previous uptime and one should cold reboot)

Last edited by KimmoK on 29-Jan-2012 at 01:45 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 29-Jan-2012 at 01:36 PM.

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koft 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 13:42:39
#15 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Mar-2007
Posts: 493
From: USA, TN, Memphis

@KimmoK

[quote]
KimmoK wrote:
@koft

>>My FreeBSD file server running on a 600MHz athlon with 256MiB of ram boots in less than that and it's running apache, samba, ftpd, postgres and a bunch of other crap.

>Try to boot it to half modern usable graphical desktop, then you can compare.
(+600Mhz athlon is faster than 667Mhz SAM440ep)

I have X on there, and it starts up instantaneously with flux box if I so choose, though I don't kick it off in my rc.local because obviously that would be a waste of resources. Are you sure the Sam wouldn't outperform it? The Sam has 266MHz ram, this athlon system has 66MHz ram in it and an PCI s3 video card. (the machine was manufactured in 1999). Also, this model athlon was real garbage back in it's day, awful performance compared to the pentium 3.

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KimmoK 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 13:50:49
#16 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2003
Posts: 5090
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland

@koft

Not absolutely sure, but my old 750Mhz Duron (RIP) at least had a lot more raw performance than my PPC440, but yeah, it had faster than 66Mhz RAM.

(refreshed my memory ... Duron was even faster than P3 in some tests example )


btw... slightly offtopic... but what kind of (warm) reboot times people get with AROS on the fastests available x86 systems?

Last edited by KimmoK on 29-Jan-2012 at 01:56 PM.

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TheDaddy 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 14:22:41
#17 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

@KimmoK

>>I agree that AOS4 boot times should be improved. Latest windows versions seem to be faster, especially with 4Ghz CPUs and SATA3 SSD drives.

True but it's apple vs pears. The same SSD I have in the SAM boots in 7 seconds with Windows 7 and a SATA 3 controller.

SATA 1 (SAM) = 1.5Gbit/sec
SATA 3 my pc = 6Gbit/sec

Also the SAM runs at 666MHz and some small, little cache my pc is a quad core running at 4.8GHz 6MB cache (I think)

>>I think you have DMA on.

How do I check?

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Cool_amigaN 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 14:38:48
#18 ]
Super Member
Joined: 6-Oct-2006
Posts: 1176
From: Athens/Greece

@koft

Sam mITX has 133Mhz ram speed not 266 (I think).
Still, everyone that has stayed around here, has read and participated to numerous threads featuring various benchmarks of raw power and general system performance (e.g 3D) or owns the system knows pretty well, that when using it, you can easily get worst results than P133Mhz/MMX + RiVa TNT 16MB PCI + 66MB Ram + Win95.
So, saying that SamEp/OS4 is slower than *any* x86 system out there, isn't anything to new to anybody. Better stop repeating yourself.

Last edited by Cool_amigaN on 29-Jan-2012 at 02:39 PM.

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TheDaddy 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 14:42:56
#19 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Sep-2005
Posts: 4499
From: Quattro Stelle

I have enabled DMA permanently (thanks ChrisH).

Now booting in 15.3 seconds

Warm Reset in 10 seconds.

Off to edit the video...


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koft 
Re: Quick and dirty video of my SAM440ep part one
Posted on 29-Jan-2012 14:55:45
#20 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Mar-2007
Posts: 493
From: USA, TN, Memphis

@Cool_amigaN

Quote:

Cool_amigaN wrote:
@koft

Sam mITX has 133Mhz ram speed not 266 (I think).
Still, everyone that has stayed around here, has read and participated to numerous threads featuring various benchmarks of raw power and general system performance (e.g 3D) or owns the system knows pretty well, that when using it, you can easily get worst results than P133Mhz/MMX + RiVa TNT 16MB PCI + 66MB Ram + Win95.
So, saying that SamEp/OS4 is slower than *any* x86 system out there, isn't anything to new to anybody. Better stop repeating yourself.


I was talking about boot time, not general performance. But your assertion that a sam could perform worse than p133 sounds ridiculous to me. In any case, AOS is a pretty simple operating system, I'd expect to boot extremely fast considering that it doesn't have much to do and fast boots are a hall mark of the Amiga. I just compared to my crappiest PC to make sure my comment wasn't too far out there.

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