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   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  Is AmigaOS still in active development?
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Micam 
Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 13:17:09
#1 ]
Member
Joined: 25-Aug-2004
Posts: 91
From: Copenhagen, Denmark

Hi fellow Amiga users

The subject says it all

I still use my Amiga 4000 and CD32, but has stopped using my AmigaOne XE G4 some years ago as my main computer. Today I am using Ubuntu and very happy with it, but miss the operation system that I really love, AmigaOS. It is very sad, and I believe today that Amiga is done, but for it to come back just a little, AmigaOS has to become free and be ported to Intel/AMD. This way hardware is not going to be a problem, and it a mandatory job for the OS is to have a modern internet browser that works, and is up to date. Making it more like Ubuntu (and other Linux distributions) you have a better commercial appeal.

It is sad that Amiga has become a legal battlefield (and has it since Commodore went bankrupt).

So is AmigaOS DEAD, or is it still in (almost dead) active development?

Don't get me wrong, I have a BIG AMIGA HEART

Last edited by Micam on 07-Jul-2018 at 04:54 PM.
Last edited by Micam on 07-Jul-2018 at 03:48 PM.
Last edited by Micam on 07-Jul-2018 at 01:19 PM.
Last edited by Micam on 07-Jul-2018 at 01:17 PM.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 14:45:50
#2 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10898
From: Norway

@Micam

Well lets put it this way, its probably good to support the company while you can.

News on Hyperion can be found on there web page I guess.

http://hyperion-entertainment.biz/

News about AmigaOS

http://hyperion-entertainment.biz/index.php/news/36-amigaos-4x?layout=default

You can also buy things directly from Hyperion:

http://hyperion-entertainment.biz/index.php/where-to-buy/direct-downloads

You also buy freespace from AmigaKIT.

http://amigakit.amiga.store/product_info.php?products_id=149

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 07-Jul-2018 at 02:55 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 07-Jul-2018 at 02:53 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 07-Jul-2018 at 02:49 PM.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 14:59:16
#3 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10898
From: Norway

@Micam

"AmigaOS has to become free "

how is "free" going to pay for development?

"Making it more like Ubuntu (and other Linux distributions) you have a better commercial appeal."

Well no it does not, the point of Amiga or MacOS or Windows, is that offers something different, the idea that you take X and call it Y, and now you think people get Y, because it has name? when they have X already? This people that like Linux and use Linux, are already using Linux.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 07-Jul-2018 at 03:03 PM.

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Micam 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 15:01:11
#4 ]
Member
Joined: 25-Aug-2004
Posts: 91
From: Copenhagen, Denmark

@NutsAboutAmiga

Last update from Hyperion is over 6 months ago.

Last info about AmigaOS4.1FE is from 2016.

AmiKIT has nothing to do with the direct development of AmigaOS, but they are a great dealer and developer of Amiga products.

I have AmigaOS4.1 (not FE). Today I use my Amiga 4000 for retro gaming and just having fun.

Last edited by Micam on 07-Jul-2018 at 03:02 PM.

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Micam 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 15:06:22
#5 ]
Member
Joined: 25-Aug-2004
Posts: 91
From: Copenhagen, Denmark

@NutsAboutAmiga

See this is a very good question

Here is why Ubuntu is free:

"It's no wonder our users ask how all this can be free. The answer is simple.

1. It's open source.
Everybody's doing it – from IBM to Google, Firefox to Wikipedia – some of today's best software is based on open-source technologies. Shared code, shared efforts, shared principles. No cost.

2. Ubuntu makes money from selling services, support and probably advertising"

https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1554868

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 15:06:39
#6 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10898
From: Norway

@Micam

"AmiKIT has nothing to do with the direct development of AmigaOS, but they are a great dealer and developer of Amiga products."

You are also wrong about that.

AmigaKIT/A-EON is selling their own upgrade packages to AmigaOS4.1, but you're not supporting Hyperion by buying AmigaKIT/A-EON product.

but AmigaKIT/A-EON is funding the development of ReadionHD drivers.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 07-Jul-2018 at 03:47 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 07-Jul-2018 at 03:07 PM.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 15:10:19
#7 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10898
From: Norway

@Micam

Quote:
1. It's open source.
Everybody's doing it – from IBM to Google, Firefox to Wikipedia – some of today's best software is based on open-source technologies. Shared code, shared efforts, shared principles. No cost.


Hi I uploaded and working on Amos Kittens for almost a year, how come I'm not getting payed for work on my open source project?

https://github.com/khval

what am I doing wrong?

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 07-Jul-2018 at 03:11 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 07-Jul-2018 at 03:10 PM.

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Micam 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 15:36:33
#8 ]
Member
Joined: 25-Aug-2004
Posts: 91
From: Copenhagen, Denmark

@NutsAboutAmiga

I guess that depends on how you look at it. I look at Hyperion as the developer of AmigaOS and it's updates. Plug-ins and patches etc from 3rd party is great, but why is Hyperion not just do it? It's there job to work on the OS and fix bugs etc. That's what we pay them for when buying the OS.

I admit that I might be wrong if AmiKit is working with/for Hyperion.


Quote:

NutsAboutAmiga wrote:
@Micam

"AmiKIT has nothing to do with the direct development of AmigaOS, but they are a great dealer and developer of Amiga products."

You are also wrong about that.

AmiKIT/A-EON is selling their own upgrade packages to AmigaOS4.1, but you're not supporting Hyperion by buying AmiKIT/A-EON product.

but AmiKIT/A-EON is funding the development of ReadionHD drivers.

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number6 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 15:39:22
#9 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 10414
From: In the village

@Micam & @NutsAboutAmiga

You folks are still using Amikit and Amigakit interchangeably, when they are 2 different businesses with 2 different owners.

#6

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Micam 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 15:44:49
#10 ]
Member
Joined: 25-Aug-2004
Posts: 91
From: Copenhagen, Denmark

@NutsAboutAmiga

I don't now? Is there a big demand for your software? Are you working in a joint effort to promote it, expand it? The Ubuntu team (Canonical) is a bigger team, and Ubuntu is a modern OS with lots of free up to date software (browsers, office package, paint, video editing, 3D modelling, DTP, server etc). I am sure that the server part is there biggest income group.

Quote:

NutsAboutAmiga wrote:

Hi I uploaded and working on Amos Kittens for almost a year, how come I'm not getting payed for work on my open source project?

https://github.com/khval

what am I doing wrong?

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 15:50:19
#11 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10898
From: Norway

@number6

Your correct sadly AmiKit is too like AmigaKIT, they AmigaKIT should sue

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jPV 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 15:53:14
#12 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 11-Apr-2005
Posts: 623
From: .fi

@Micam

Quote:

Micam wrote:

Here is why Ubuntu is free:

"It's no wonder our users ask how all this can be free. The answer is simple.

1. It's open source.
Everybody's doing it – from IBM to Google, Firefox to Wikipedia – some of today's best software is based on open-source technologies. Shared code, shared efforts, shared principles. No cost.

2. Ubuntu makes money from selling services, support and probably advertising"


1. Being open source doesn't mean anyone would actually develop it. There are numerous examples of that. There's no chance that any big companies, like the ones you mention, would have any interest to Amiga development. And the big companies don't do that just for charity, they have their own interests and they get advantage it by other ways. Being a successful open source project there must be mass behind it.

2. That doesn't work in our situation where we are really really marginal platform.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 15:54:56
#13 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 10898
From: Norway

@Micam

Quote:
I don't now? Is there a big demand for your software?


Not at the moment, many people ask for simple programming language.

Quote:
Are you working in a joint effort to promote it, expand it?


Yes I have been talked about in many groups, many developers say they don't have the time. or don't have the skills.

I have promoted in Amos Coding group as well.

They should know they get rich as open source right? he he he.

Developers should be lining up large queues right about now.



Quote:
The Ubuntu team (Canonical) is a bigger team, and Ubuntu is a modern OS with lots of free up to date software (browsers, office package, paint, video editing, 3D modelling, DTP, server etc). I am sure that the server part is there biggest income group.


Yes they repacked a lot the Debian stuff, and repacked lot outer stuff from other developers that most likely did get penny for there work.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 07-Jul-2018 at 04:00 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 07-Jul-2018 at 03:58 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 07-Jul-2018 at 03:55 PM.

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Micam 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 16:11:18
#14 ]
Member
Joined: 25-Aug-2004
Posts: 91
From: Copenhagen, Denmark

@jPV

You are right, but if we want to make AmigaOS a big thing, and not just a pet project, then we have to think different and big. I agree that making software open source dos not make it work, just buy doing that. BUT! If the OS if free and available, then others might see an interest in developing for it. As the OS gets bigger and bigger, and the community gets bigger, then companies like NVidia and AMD can see a reason to also develop Amiga drivers etc.

Having a very small community, and you have to pay for an OS that lacks support for good browsers and drivers (we even have to pay for GPU drivers, when others don't), and the hardware is ridiculously expensive and often unavailable. There is no way as it is right now, that any companies would invest in Amiga. That is why I say that dumping the PowerPC (like Apple did long time ago) and going Intel/AMD is the right way to do it. There are cheap hardware available (laptops, desktops and servers), so the hardware issue is solved. Porting from other Intel based OS's might even be easier (I might be wrong?).

Having no hardware issues by porting to Intel/AMD, makes it easier for new people to gain interest in AmigaOS. This also brings up the question (again): What is Amiga? Is it hardware or software? I believe it's the software.

Quote:

jPV wrote:

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Micam 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 16:18:47
#15 ]
Member
Joined: 25-Aug-2004
Posts: 91
From: Copenhagen, Denmark

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

NutsAboutAmiga wrote:
@Micam


Quote:
The Ubuntu team (Canonical) is a bigger team, and Ubuntu is a modern OS with lots of free up to date software (browsers, office package, paint, video editing, 3D modelling, DTP, server etc). I am sure that the server part is there biggest income group.


Yes they repacked a lot the Debian stuff, and repacked lot outer stuff from other developers that most likely did get penny for there work.


That is true, but I don't know if others gets cheated

But we have to remember that it is also a responsibly for the OS developer/owner, to partner up with some of the big boys and girls in the hardware/software industry, but create awareness around AmigaOS and it's (I hope in the future) huge user base, and that's why they can benefit from writing drivers and programs to AmigaOS.

It's not just one thing, its two things and more

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number6 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 16:19:06
#16 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 10414
From: In the village

@Micam

Since I don't see the parent companies rushing to answer your original question:

Just as during the lawsuit of 2007-2009 (Amiga Inc. vs Hyperion V.O.F.) development continues.
The issue is about "releases"

Amigakit has already stated for the record on this website that they can release what they own when they wish....and they do.

Hyperion Entertainment C.V.B.A. being somewhat involved in massive legal proceedings atm, does not have that same freedom.

Hope this answers your question.

#6

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djnick 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 16:26:30
#17 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 11-Jun-2003
Posts: 943
From: space

@Micam

I am still reading this AmigaWorld site from time to time, hoping for some good news (as I am still Amiga fan) and also checking Trevor’s site: http://blog.a-eon.biz/blog/

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djnick 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 16:37:36
#18 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 11-Jun-2003
Posts: 943
From: space

@all

And latest good interview was here:

https://www.generationamiga.com/2017/07/10/the-big-interview-with-trevor-dickinson/

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jPV 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 17:32:48
#19 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 11-Apr-2005
Posts: 623
From: .fi

@Micam

Quote:

Micam wrote:
@jPV

You are right, but if we want to make AmigaOS a big thing, and not just a pet project, then we have to think different and big. I agree that making software open source dos not make it work, just buy doing that. BUT! If the OS if free and available, then others might see an interest in developing for it. As the OS gets bigger and bigger, and the community gets bigger, then companies like NVidia and AMD can see a reason to also develop Amiga drivers etc.

Having a very small community, and you have to pay for an OS that lacks support for good browsers and drivers (we even have to pay for GPU drivers, when others don't), and the hardware is ridiculously expensive and often unavailable. There is no way as it is right now, that any companies would invest in Amiga. That is why I say that dumping the PowerPC (like Apple did long time ago) and going Intel/AMD is the right way to do it. There are cheap hardware available (laptops, desktops and servers), so the hardware issue is solved. Porting from other Intel based OS's might even be easier (I might be wrong?).

Having no hardware issues by porting to Intel/AMD, makes it easier for new people to gain interest in AmigaOS. This also brings up the question (again): What is Amiga? Is it hardware or software? I believe it's the software.

AROS is a fine example of trying to make an open source Amiga compatible OS on mainstream hardware, and even when it was started earlier than MorphOS or OS4, you can't say it has progressed any better, quite contrary actually.

We have to be realistic here, Amiga, in the form we know it, can't be big anymore. Even if it'd be free, open source, and run on whatever hardware, nobody in the real world would take it seriously anymore, because of it's limitations and fundamental design issues. We should throw away backwards compatibility, API, GUI toolkits, and about everything to get outsiders interested, and would we ourselves be interested of that kind of OS anymore? I don't think so, because most Amiga users love the way OS works traditionally.

I think we are lucky that we have even this much development left and we have got these fine new compatible operating systems. If these developers who are still in business get motivated even from the little income they get, let them have it. It's better than no development at all.

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ne_one 
Re: Is AmigaOS still in active development?
Posted on 7-Jul-2018 18:37:46
#20 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Jun-2005
Posts: 821
From: Unknown

@jPV

Quote:
AROS is a fine example of trying to make an open source Amiga compatible OS on mainstream hardware, and even when it was started earlier than MorphOS or OS4, you can't say it has progressed any better, quite contrary actually.


That's a silly argument.

The success of any initiative (open source or otherwise), is completely dependent on its proponents.

The post Commodore Amiga era has been an unmitigated disaster marked by scandal and incompetence.

Quote:
I think we are lucky that we have even this much development left and we have got these fine new compatible operating systems. If these developers who are still in business get motivated even from the little income they get, let them have it. It's better than no development at all.


And that sort of sentiment is precisely why the platform languishes.

Going back to the original point, the suggestion is that open-sourcing OS4 would allow development to continue. Hyperion is clearly not doing much of anything other than litigating so any initiative would be productive.

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