@agami
Wow, so much bile... "Die" Why exactly? Because you don't agree with their definition of what an Amiga is (68K OS 3.14 / PPC OS 4.1)?

Why cant people be happy with what they have? Why do thy have to enter a crusade to "convert" others to their ideals on what an Amiga should be?

Wizz.

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Rev 1D3 Amiga 1200, Apollo 1240 (40Mhz '040, 64MB RAM), Indivision MKII, Fast ATA MK V, Rapid Road USB, PCMCIA WIFI & OS 3.14

@Wizzard_o

Unfortunately that just exemplifies the state of the world today. Everything is all "me..me..me".

People have little respect and little patience for anything, and opinions are derived through whatever is trending on whatever social media platform they care to pay more attention to.

Society at present seems to be hellbent on destroying itself.

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Quote:

Wizzard_o wrote: Wow, so much bile... "Die" Why exactly? Because you don't agree with their definition of what an Amiga is (68K OS 3.14 / PPC OS 4.1)?

It is not just the destination but the path along the way. Does rape, pillage and burn along the path justify some perceived good to be done at the destination? Do the ends justify the means? Do you believe Hyperion is a moral or even responsible business or more like a criminal organization? Do you believe they will arrive at their destination with old promises of SMP and AmigaOS 4.2? Do you believe that AmigaOS 3.1.4 was Hyperion's vision, work and property instead of a quick buck they pillaged? Is Hyperion any better than Amiga Inc. at this point or just better at pillaging?

Personally, I wish Hyperion and Amiga Inc. would just go away or die. I prefer to take my chances with Cloanto, A-Eon or any random stranger off the streets.

Last edited by matthey on 26-Jan-2019 at 05:58 PM.

@matthey

Excellent ! I would not think that someone would compare Hyperion with a criminal organization. And about raping and pillage... nice comparison also.

A pity you have not (yet) mentionned Hitler and/or Mussolini in your comparison.

Once again, people trying to convince others that only them detain the truth...

I'm totally with Wizzard_o there.

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FPGA Replay + DB 68060 at 85Mhz

@Thread

Hyperion presumably justify litigation with the need for survival. OS3.1.4 is another bid for survival IMHO. I can't see the vision beyond appealing to Vampire owners. There's little business plan or any value in the company other than the license to the AmigaOS IP and who better to caretake that than a litigious legal company that subcontracts all the actual software development

I am numb to Hyperion by now and don't really understand OS3.1.4 beyond what C= would have delivered in 1996 if they had carried on. The community got a company that reflects the state of the market; fighting for our niche platform in a sea of PC hardware clones, Microsoft and Apple.

In our market A-EON bring the community, passion and the investment, Cloanto bring the real solid business plan, the real Classic Amiga IP and the year on year sustainable sales and Hyperion bring the access to the OS4.x source code the IP and bring the legal expertise.

If they all could have worked together the platform may have raised itself above mere survival. What could have been

Last edited by BigD on 26-Jan-2019 at 09:53 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 26-Jan-2019 at 09:50 PM.

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@BigD

Outside of Amiga market, companies have capital to buy etch other; imagine if Cloanto was part of Hyperion now amazing that be. Imagine have the as good emulation inside of AmigaOS4.1 as WinUAE / Amiga Forever works on Microsoft Windows.

So you have preservation of AmigaOS, and continued development of AmigaOS, working in harmony

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 26-Jan-2019 at 11:19 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 26-Jan-2019 at 11:17 PM.

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@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

So you have preservation of AmigaOS, and continued development of AmigaOS, working in harmony

The chances of that happening would be far bigger with Hyperion out of the picture. They don’t own anything of importance, they are just a (failed) publisher and they don’t have any money or muscles to do anything meaningful. They are just a roadblock.

Quote:

NutsAboutAmiga wrote: Outside of Amiga market, companies have capital to buy etch other; imagine if Cloanto was part of Hyperion now amazing that be. Imagine have the as good emulation inside of AmigaOS4.1 as WinUAE / Amiga Forever works on Microsoft Windows.

More likely would be Cloanto buying Hyperion. I expect Cloanto is profitable on a small scale and thus valuable. Hyperion was not profitable so the only value would have been assets after debt.

assets (practically just Intellectual Property)
- $669,665 U.S debt (there may be more liabilities)
------------
likely a negative book value (this is the value of a consistently unprofitable business)

If Hyperion had been publically traded, the stock would have had a value near zero (large debt, not profitable, no real business plan to become profitable, antiquated IP), up until AmigaOS 3.1.4 result rumors circulated. The stock price would likely have spiked on the rumors and then collapsed on news of the lawsuit and questionable business practices. Instead of going bankrupt, Hyperion should have been searching for buyers so the stockholders did not lose everything. In a logical world, nobody would have bought the business as the IP is worth less than the debt so it is better to get it after the bankruptcy when the debt goes away. Some people are being creative on the value of the Amiga IP though. Just as crazy was getting a loan from someone with Hyperion's financial situation. Only Amiga makes it possible.

Last edited by matthey on 27-Jan-2019 at 02:20 PM.
Last edited by matthey on 27-Jan-2019 at 07:58 AM.

Quote:

dan.hutch wrote: I still swear by Windows 3.1 personally.

I have an old laptop with Windows 3.1 on it. Boots way faster than my much more powerful XP machine, runs DOS programs perfectly, and has my favourite card game - Solitaire! My laptop is actually powerful enough to run Window98 no sweat, but 3.1 is more fun!

BTW Windows 3.1 was released in 1992 (the same year as Amiga OS3.0) and was widely regarded at the time as the first version Microsoft got 'right'. It's a classic! and certainly brings back some fond memories...

Quote:

bhabbott wrote: I have an old laptop with Windows 3.1 on it. Boots way faster than my much more powerful XP machine, runs DOS programs perfectly, and has my favourite card game - Solitaire! My laptop is actually powerful enough to run Window98 no sweat, but 3.1 is more fun! BTW Windows 3.1 was released in 1992 (the same year as Amiga OS3.0) and was widely regarded at the time as the first version Microsoft got 'right'. It's a classic! and certainly brings back some fond memories...

A small footprint and fast boot are more useful than for old hardware. Old versions of Windows have been used in embedded hardware.

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/11/05/microsoft_retires_windows_3_1_1/

Maybe 640kiB of memory was all that was needed for embedded but then Windows became fat. Microsoft has had a few OSs specifically targeting the embedded market.

Azure Sphere, Windows IoT Enterprise, Windows IoT Mobile, Windows IoT Mobile Enterprise, Windows IoT Core, Windows IoT Core Pro, Windows Embedded Pro, Windows Embedded Server, Windows Embedded Compact, Windows Embedded Standard, Windows Embedded NAVReady, Windows Embedded Automotive, Windows Embedded Handheld

Many of the modern products have grown to require 256MiB of memory (which the OS uses a large portion of), 2GiB of storage and 400MHz+ CPUs (Azure Sphere being the exception as a Linux based OS targeting IoT that runs with 4MiB of memory). The 68k AmigaOS 3 has a tiny footprint with code which has average optimization at best and a CPU which has room to significantly improve code density. The Amiga could have moved more into the embedded markets but it has lacked affordable hardware, good support and marketing (this was the niche market key to survival which C= did not leverage). Hyperion's business model of you pay us to support your (fat) PPC hardware certainly isn't working. Gunnar's go bigger and hyper-optimize for an FPGA isn't going to get it done either as ASICs are affordable today with the right product. Going smaller than everyone else is the right direction for embedded and opens up possibilities for higher performance consumer electronic devices. Amiga business strategies are from the '90s with blinders on. Only Amiga makes it (im)possible.

os 4.1 ??? way not os 4.2 for the furture

@retro

Because Hyperion. They are clutching to the AmigaOS sources as best they can, while the number of developers willing to work for them is dwindling.

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@kolla

Are you speaking from personal experience? Facts please not wishful thinking If at all possible.

Wizz.

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Rev 1D3 Amiga 1200, Apollo 1240 (40Mhz '040, 64MB RAM), Indivision MKII, Fast ATA MK V, Rapid Road USB, PCMCIA WIFI & OS 3.14

@Wizzard_o

Since you asked, my view on Hyperion has nothing to do with what I think Amiga is or isn't, or what it should or shouldn't be. My opinion is based on what I feel would be better for the Amiga community as a whole.

I rarely use the word hate to describe how I feel about things, but I hate bullies. So when I observe the business practices of Hyperion over the past one and a half decades, I see a bully. A bully is only good for those that need that bully's protection, or for other likeminded bullies.

I've been around enough, and worked for many types of companies, from startups to large multi-nationals. Everywhere else, the courts are a last resort. Most companies try very hard to avoid going to court. They will negotiate, they will review and rewrite deals to try and find some workable way forward without loosing time and money in the courts.

When I see that someone is taking Hyperion to court, or the other way around, I see a company that is incapable of making a compromise. Their way or the highway. And whilst they're locked up in litigation, we the community continue to suffer.

I've even had the opportunity to size up Ben Hermans via a business opportunity. Suffice to say, this person does not have the Amiga community's best interests at heart.

There is little moral ambiguity here. We could argue the finer points of the difference between a good person doing bad things 50% of the time and a bad person doing good things 50% of the time. But when a person or an organisation does bad things more than 50% of the time, it really doesn't matter if their intentions are good or bad.

Last edited by agami on 29-Jan-2019 at 12:23 AM.

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All the way, with 68k

@agami

Quote:

There is little moral ambiguity here.

And even more troubling... ambivalence.

I can't imagine the end game. It's clearly not about money or some nefarious plot - unless monumental ineptitude was the goal.

Equally disconcerting is the fact that a large number of respondents pronounced their love.

For what exactly?

Hyperion hasn't done anything in years. At least doing good things or bad things warrants some sort of reaction.

@g01df1sh

voted hyperion, and i'm proud of it

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nox's in the house!

There's clearly some very real problems with a company when the majority of people on the 2nd most "pro OS4" site in existence has it voted as a disgrace and incompetent.
Contrary to what "fanbois" will (and do) claim, this is a clear indication that it's a bit of a joke, and a hindrance to the platform,.... this isn't just a handful of trolls, it's the majority of the people who voted.

Last edited by fishy_fis on 30-Jan-2019 at 11:06 PM.

@noXLar

Quote:

voted hyperion

"Love," or "needs to die?"

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@thread

The funniest thing is people answering this childish poll ("Morphos King", "Love Hyperion", "AROS God"...).

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FPGA Replay + DB 68060 at 85Mhz

@fishy_fis

Quote:

fishy_fis wrote: There's clearly some very real problems with a company when the majority of people on the 2nd most "pro OS4" site in existence has it voted as a disgrace and incompetent.

Aside from the fact that this is up there with the most useless, ill-though-out and childish polls I've ever seen, there are actually more pro-OS4 votes than all other votes combined. As it currently stands, 320 votes are for either "I love Hyperion" or "OS4.1 is the future", with 271 votes covering all other options.

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