@BigD

Quote:

BigD wrote: @Rose I read the other day that the Phase 5 PPC boards made it to around 10,000 users! That seems a lot considering how expensive and complex they were! Maybe 10,000 A1222Plus is technically possible? Quote: Note: In an interview with Amiga Active in July 2000, Ralph Schmidt estimated that around 10,000 people used the PowerPC Phase 5 accelerator cards. Source

This might be a shocker to you but it ain't 1997 anymore. Back then there was still a decent sized userbase and Cyberstorm/Blizzard werent 20 years behind mainstream performance.

TECHNICALLY they can make 1000000 Tabors, tho finding even 1000 people willing to pay €500 for plain motherboard with sub Pi4 performance will be a challange.

@Rose

Quote:

Rose wrote: @BigD This might be a shocker to you but it ain't 1997 anymore.

Obviously that is true but I am not aware of any software other than Candy Factory, Wipeout 2097 and possibly Payback available for AmigaPPC at the time that justified 10,000 people supporting Phase 5’s new platform! Especially given the parent companies were never 100% behind Phase 5!

Have we always been a “build it and they will come” kind of community?

So what is the killer app for the A1222Plus or is this history repeating?

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@Rose

Quote:

tho finding even 1000 people willing to pay €500 for plain motherboard with sub Pi4 performance will be a challange.

... it didn't stop the Apollo Team!

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Already 5669 vampirized* people !

... and climbing by the day!

The A1222Plus is supposed to offer something 'beyond' the Classic Amiga and yet the Apollo Team have devised a FPGA 060 successor (080) and SAGA (don't know if this has been realised yet but it IS a thing with new screen modes and higher resolutions) and have eclipsed vastly faster PPC hardware in the hearts and minds of thousands of Amigans/ex-Amigans and retro hobbiests!

This is serious news if there is no clear roadmap from AmigaKit/A-EON! The Apollo Team weren't at Amiga Ireland and yet they still win the marketing/strategy/pricing war! Insane!

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

The difference is that the Apollo team has a machine that can be bought, today.

In less than one week we should be able to buy a Sam460cr again. It won't be sold in thousands though.

@duga

Quote:

It won't be sold in thousands though.

Because?

I imagine ACube has a relationship with proper fabs etc in Italy whereas Apollo Team are a cottage industry outfit populating contracted out circuit boards by hand and custom programming FPGA one at a time etc! The Vampire counter jumped by 3 boards this afternoon! The tortoise has wiped the floor with the hare in this instance!

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

Acube only produce their hardware in small batches. 50 is the minimum and they probably don't produce in much higher quantities than that when they do run. Why? Simple economics. Serious price breaks for components won't come into play unless you are ordering in quantities of 10,000 or more. That means that there is no real advantage to making 500 boards instead of 50. Depending on what their profit margin is, it probably costs somewhere between 10,000 and 20,000 euros, 500 would be 10 times that. They know they can sell 50 boards fairly quickly so it's less capital tied up for less time.

@Rob

... and so the Vampire is slow and steady while the AmigaOne machines go from glut to famine! X5000 anyone?

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

The team behind the Vampire has made a lot of progress during the last months.

Now they have a webshop with several bundles for the Vampire V4+ Standalone listed:

Apollo Computer Webshop

All items are in stock and being delivered to customers. This means you can get a V4+ Standalone computer now without waiting for long.

Community is active and vibrant and there is a lot of optimism, which is great to see!

One in my demo group (a coder) bought one of these now, so looking forward to hear from him how it performs etc. Can't say I'm not tempted to go V4.

_________________
Old School Game Blog
Gaming on AmigaOS 4
Void - Amiga Demo Group

@AmigaOldskooler

Interesting. Thanks.
What ever happened to the piracy stink that blew up around ApolloOS?
Is it clean now or still of dubious legality?

@deadduckni

ApolloOS became “Coffin” and “CoffinOS” and is still dubious and muddy as ever before. Then the team found that the only “legal” way forward is AROS, and now they have their own spin of AROS/68k that they aptly call ApolloOS (or ApollOS).

_________________
B5D6A1D019D5D45BCC56F4782AC220D8B3E2A6CC

@kolla

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ApolloOS became “Coffin” and “CoffinOS” and is still dubious and muddy as ever before.

Things get hilarious when you see a reseller selling CoffinOS and also legit version of Software included in CoffinOS (Yes, it's happening)

The Vampire V4 works great, I’ve had one for several months. I still really enjoy my X5000 too but lately I’ve been using the V4 more.

Last edited by DiscreetFX on 31-Jan-2021 at 08:33 PM.
Last edited by DiscreetFX on 31-Jan-2021 at 08:33 PM.

_________________
Sent from my Quantum Computer.

@deadduckni

Quote:

deadduckni wrote: @AmigaOldskooler Interesting. Thanks. What ever happened to the piracy stink that blew up around ApolloOS? Is it clean now or still of dubious legality?

You can ask kamelito: he had a "nice" discussion with Gunnar the last time, about that argument, and you can easily guess why...

OK, since there's no feedback from kamelito (maybe he's busy), here's the story:
http://www.apollo-core.com/knowledge.php?b=5¬e=33287

Quote:

Gunnar von Boehn: The current ApollOS has with Frontier included. Please look in WORK:/GAMES/Frontier

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Kamelito Loveless: Even if all Amiga programs/games are ancient that doesn’t mean you can included them anywhere you want without the author approval. In fact a fan had made some years ago a rewrite of Elite in C and put it online, David Braden ask him to remove that link. Just saying.

Quote:

Gunnar von Boehn: Guys I think we all want the same. We all love Amiga! We miss the times when 10 new Amiga came out each week. And in our hearts we still live in them.

I've copied the posts, because Gunnar "the censor" can easily remove them, as proved several times.

So, basically the same story as when they sold the Vampires in the last Amiga anniversary, in Neuss: they are shipping copyrighted Amiga software with their Vampire boards. Stuff which it's evident that they have no rights neither licenses.

But you should close an eye, or even both, because... we love the Amiga!

@cdimauro

Piracy seems par for the course in Amiga circles now! CoffinOS with pirated games included, ADFs everywhere and even CD32 ISOs being ripped and sold as official products on eBay! Apollo Team did the wise thing by using AROS to ship with the Vampire rather than CoffinOS but they obviously think that piracy is ok and probably think it's one of the things that made the Amiga great! I beg to differ but will these games see a release on a retro game store besides Turrican, Rainbow Islands and a few others? Doubtful as the Amiga wasn't popular outside of Europe and as has become painfully obvious especially since Sony America took over; "European gamers and their heritage don't matter!"

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@cdimauro

your contributions to amiga except some forum talk?

The only thing amiga forums today seem to discuss are "copyright violations". And you are in first line with it.

At the same time you talk down 68k anyway so why do you care about Gunnar and Vampire at all? In the past (if I remember right) you praised some "wonder super FPGA card" of your company and then nothing.

Questions...

If David Braben really has a problem with it he can contact the apollo team and ask to remove it. Funny how people here defend the rights of others...

I myself do not share the view of abandoned ware free to distribute and only always integrated former commercial software where I had the approval for that but still it is funny that discussing about copyright seems to be highest priority today on amiga forums. And then of course Apollo is evil, Gunnar is evil, Vampire is evil, Cloanto is evil...

People...

Last edited by OlafS25 on 02-Feb-2021 at 10:48 AM.
Last edited by OlafS25 on 02-Feb-2021 at 10:46 AM.

@cdimauro
Password problems...

Yeah, some dude even say that I should call the police, but I’m sure that if someone stole and release Apollo’s hard work they will feel differently.
By putting copyrighted materials the only thing that the Vampire team is doing is jeopardizing their work. Look at Cloanto vs Hyperion, many will think that AmigaOS is abandonware.

@BigD Quote:

BigD wrote: @cdimauro Piracy seems par for the course in Amiga circles now! CoffinOS with pirated games included, ADFs everywhere and even CD32 ISOs being ripped and sold as official products on eBay! Apollo Team did the wise thing by using AROS to ship with the Vampire rather than CoffinOS

At this point I think that they just replaced the Amiga o.s. with AROS on CoffinOS, keeping the rest.
Quote:

but they obviously think that piracy is ok and probably think it's one of the things that made the Amiga reat!

No, they just want to have a "battery ready" device: you plug it, and you can immediately start working / playing.
Quote:

I beg to differ but will these games see a release on a retro game store besides Turrican, Rainbow Islands and a few others? Doubtful as the Amiga wasn't popular outside of Europe and as has become painfully obvious especially since Sony America took over; "European gamers and their heritage don't matter!"

No idea.


@OlafS25 Quote:

OlafS25 wrote: @cdimauro your contributions to amiga except some forum talk?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4jdNPsbdow

And your contribution?
Quote:

The only thing amiga forums today seem to discuss are "copyright violations". And you are in first line with it.

Why don't you go back to your parallel universe? Because it's clear that you don't frequent this forum, talking about imaginary scenarios.
Quote:

At the same time you talk down 68k anyway so why do you care about Gunnar and Vampire at all?

I don't care, indeed. I'm just lurking some Amiga forum.
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In the past (if I remember right) you praised some "wonder super FPGA card" of your company and then nothing.

You remember wrong: I wasn't employed on that company and I was just helping the project for free.

I had to stop, for obvious reasons, once I started working at Intel. After that, the project was left in the dust after some months, and died.
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Questions... If David Braben really has a problem with it he can contact the apollo team and ask to remove it.

You're completely overturning the logic and law: you should bundle some software only AFTER that you received the permission/license from the author.
Quote:

Funny how people here defend the rights of others...

Not only here: you lost your "Apollo Team Member" status on the Apollo forum immediately after that you criticized CoffinOS for bundling pirated / not licensed software.

Don't you remember? I do! And I can easily imagine who kicked you out from the team...
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I myself do not share the view of abandoned ware free to distribute and only always integrated former commercial software where I had the approval for that

Correct. This is and should be the only valid & legit approach.
Quote:

but still it is funny that discussing about copyright seems to be highest priority today on amiga forums.

Again: you're talking about the parallel universe where you live most of the time. Reality is different: check it!
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And then of course Apollo is evil, Gunnar is evil, Vampire is evil, Cloanto is evil...

OK, now you entered the "victim mode", talking of non-sense just to get some tearful consensus.
Quote:

People...

Should spend more time living in the real world...


@kamelito Quote:

kamelito wrote: @cdimauro Password problems... Yeah, some dude even say that I should call the police, but I’m sure that if someone stole and release Apollo’s hard work they will feel differently.

Indeed. They are very strict on keeping their intellectual properties, but don't care at all of the ones from other people.
Quote:

By putting copyrighted materials the only thing that the Vampire team is doing is jeopardizing their work. Look at Cloanto vs Hyperion, many will think that AmigaOS is abandonware.

Absolutely agree.